Chicago Bulls hire Fred Hoiberg for Head Coach

[Scoot26]

the Vinny situation was vague...they make it sound like Pax bum rushed his office and started choking him loool

Vinny had to do or say something to incite him like that...it wasn't the most professional thing but it happens when tempers flair

From what I understand, Paxson approached him about Noah playing too many minutes (OT game) and Vinny became defensive about that and shit went down then.

So I wouldn't say Paxson just decided to come in and start choking him as many people seem to believe.

They were both in the wrong for the way they'd handled it I'd say.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

What I said was more so a joke lol...

Again, I am not that into this move, I've kinda been sold by various articles about Hoiberg on how he's different than Floyd or most college coaches.

But I still can't shake that the NBA has not really had a successful college coach in a long time. There's now three in the league with Brad Stevens, Donovan, and Hoiberg, so we'll see what happens.

It won't surprised me if Hoiberg fails hard. I'd be more surprised if he's hugely successful. I kind of expect a slightly more intelligent Vinny Del Negro though.

Brad Stevens, at this point, seems to be the exception to the rule. At this point he just seems to be the kind of guy that 'gets it,' and would have success wherever he goes. Donovan had the definition of a 'cup of coffee' in the NBA, and that was 30 years ago, so I'm pretty interested to see how he adapts to what the NBA game is now. Hoiberg had a 10 year career, and I don't think that should be overlooked. I'm not fully sold on him - but it does seem to be a different hire than just bringing in a college coach.

 

[Scoot26]

Brad Stevens, at this point, seems to be the exception to the rule. At this point he just seems to be the kind of guy that 'gets it,' and would have success wherever he goes. Donovan had the definition of a 'cup of coffee' in the NBA, and that was 30 years ago, so I'm pretty interested to see how he adapts to what the NBA game is now. Hoiberg had a 10 year career, and I don't think that should be overlooked. I'm not fully sold on him - but it does seem to be a different hire than just bringing in a college coach.

Brad Stevens seems like a good coach, but he'll also be on the out if Boston doesn't get some star power in the coming years.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

From what I understand, Paxson approached him about Noah playing too many minutes (OT game) and Vinny became defensive about that and shit went down then.

So I wouldn't say Paxson just decided to come in and start choking him as many people seem to believe.

They were both in the wrong for the way they'd handled it I'd say.

The quote I remember hearing was Vinny saying, "Why don't you come down from your perch and coach the fucking team then?"

 

[Scoot26]

The quote I remember hearing was Vinny saying, "Why don't you come down from your perch and coach the fucking team then?"

Makes sense.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Brad Stevens seems like a good coach, but he'll also be on the out if Boston doesn't get some star power in the coming years.

I've heard some things about Stevens wanting to go back to college and get the Indiana job.

 

[Jailbreak]

Most of the time you need to work with your superiors. It's not always fun, but you share a common purpose. This was Thibadeau's downfall as well as Skiles'. I'm guessing that if Tom had interacted better he would have had a bigger voice. Sometimes you have to give to receive. I'm not the fly on the wall. Hoiberg could be very successful - I'm not entirely sure who should be held responsible in this mess, but I'm eternally optimistic. Yes, call me a Cubs fan.

 

[Diddy1122]

Oh c'mon, I'm not over the moon about this, but hiring Hoiberg is much different than hiring Floyd.

Tbh, it's really not. The similarities are strikingly familiar, other than Floyd's resume wasn't as good in college and he was taking over a team that was dismantled after winning a championship.

1). 1998: New coach Tim Floyd is good friends with the current GM (Krause); 2015: New coach Fred Hoiberg is good friends with the current GM (Foreman)
2). 1998: A handshake deal was in place the entire 97-98 season for Floyd to be Jackson's replacement; 2015: A handshake deal was in place for the entire 14-15 season for Hoiberg to be Thibs replacement.
3.) 1998: A messy divorce ensues with the previous coach and a subsequent swooning over his replacement by management; 2015: A messy divorce ensues with the previous coach and a subsequent swooning over his replacement by management.

The only real differences in these situations is that Hoiberg is actually taking over a talented team, whereas Floyd was left with nothing but scraps in the midst of a rebuilding project. I think people need to face the facts that Hoiberg was brought in more to be a puppet than a coach. And look, I'm not condemning Hoiberg's ability to coach or saying we are doomed to failure because of the hire, but the facts remain that the FO wanted someone THEY could control 100%, just like back in 98 with Floyd. They said as much in their petty statements during their press conference last week.

I hope this hire works out, because I want my Bulls back in the Finals, but we as fans, shouldn't let the wool be pulled over our eyes by management on this.

 

[Axl Rose]

i could easily draw up some differences

Floyd
no NBA experience at all
terrible roster
was forced to run the triangle

Hoiberg
10 years of experience as a player, few years as a executive
is coming to a team that won 50 games in a subpar year
ran a NBA style offense in college and will have the freedom to run it here

i don't see him as a puppet they paid quite a price for him...they could have possibly got Gentry cheaper...Hoiberg is a guy they seem to have allot faith in and hes not just a fishing buddy....other teams were knocking on his door aswell

can't guarantee either way but i'd put my money on him being a great coach...hes knowledgeable, he understands the modern game and is a people person he knows how to relate with players by all accounts

to me everything says he'll succeed i'd be the opposite of Scoot and say i'd be surprised if he did fail at the very least i see him being a good coach

 

[Jailbreak]

I will say that I'm a little concerned about the front office. I'd hate to see more drama. While it's unlikely Fred and John will duke it out, Jerry needs to pay some attention to this. He also didn't need to poison Tom with his press statement. It's hard to get a handle on any of this, but I hope Hoiberg gets a fair shake. He's a new coach and we'll have to see how he does in his first year.

 

[Jailbreak]

Hoiberg and Floyd are comparable from an ISU standpoint, but that's about it. Hoiberg compares favorably even in that regard.

Floyd was dealt a poor hand, but he knew it.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

The only real differences in these situations is that Hoiberg is actually taking over a talented team, whereas Floyd was left with nothing but scraps in the midst of a rebuilding project. I think people need to face the facts that Hoiberg was brought in more to be a puppet than a coach. And look, I'm not condemning Hoiberg's ability to coach or saying we are doomed to failure because of the hire, but the facts remain that the FO wanted someone THEY could control 100%, just like back in 98 with Floyd. They said as much in their petty statements during their press conference last week.

I hope this hire works out, because I want my Bulls back in the Finals, but we as fans, shouldn't let the wool be pulled over our eyes by management on this.

Here is the thing: I can't refute your three reasons for thinking the situations are the same, but I'm not just talking in terms of how we got here but where we are going from here. That is what I mean by this. Hoiberg is in a much different place/situation which is set up to succeed much more than what Floyd was. Coaching styles are different, success at previous stops...I just think the relationship with Gar and ISU things are on the surface and not things to get hung up on.

Now the bigger issue, to me, is how we define the concept of him being a puppet and controlled. The biggest argument - at least publicly - between Thibs and management was the minutes players were being used. Obviously we know that with minute restrictions that was GarPax' way of controlling Thibs and it didn't work. If Hoiberg goes along with those minute restrictions is that because he's being controlled by management, or does that play into his philosophy? I'm not so sure management and the coach being on the same page is necessarily a bad thing.

 

[Scoot26]

Here is the thing: I can't refute your three reasons for thinking the situations are the same, but I'm not just talking in terms of how we got here but where we are going from here. That is what I mean by this. Hoiberg is in a much different place/situation which is set up to succeed much more than what Floyd was. Coaching styles are different, success at previous stops...I just think the relationship with Gar and ISU things are on the surface and not things to get hung up on.

Now the bigger issue, to me, is how we define the concept of him being a puppet and controlled. The biggest argument - at least publicly - between Thibs and management was the minutes players were being used. Obviously we know that with minute restrictions that was GarPax' way of controlling Thibs and it didn't work. If Hoiberg goes along with those minute restrictions is that because he's being controlled by management, or does that play into his philosophy? I'm not so sure management and the coach being on the same page is necessarily a bad thing.

I think Hoiberg will not play the minutes that Thibs played his players... but all it takes is one game where Hoiberg thinks bigger minutes are necessary for GarPax to explode.

 

[Diddy1122]

Here is the thing: I can't refute your three reasons for thinking the situations are the same, but I'm not just talking in terms of how we got here but where we are going from here. That is what I mean by this. Hoiberg is in a much different place/situation which is set up to succeed much more than what Floyd was. Coaching styles are different, success at previous stops...I just think the relationship with Gar and ISU things are on the surface and not things to get hung up on.

Now the bigger issue, to me, is how we define the concept of him being a puppet and controlled. The biggest argument - at least publicly - between Thibs and management was the minutes players were being used. Obviously we know that with minute restrictions that was GarPax' way of controlling Thibs and it didn't work. If Hoiberg goes along with those minute restrictions is that because he's being controlled by management, or does that play into his philosophy? I'm not so sure management and the coach being on the same page is necessarily a bad thing.

I agree. Hoiberg is in a much more favorable situation. Admitted, it will be tough to tell if he's actually being a puppet but I also feel like Thibs, since day 1, was never given any fair shake by the FO. We have to keep in mind he was a Reinsdorf hire, not a GarPax hire. They wanted Hoiberg back then too. JR overruled them. So right from the start there was already a fractious relationship between the coach & FO. Over the years, it just built and built, with minutes restrictions being the main thing that both sides drew a line in the sand over. We all know there was more to it than just that.

With Hoiberg, they are getting someone who they wanted all the way back in 2010, with an established relationship of "trust" already. The last guy that was hired in this manner was Floyd, and that is a bit of a frightening thought. As I stated, Hoiberg comes with a much better resume but how everything has transpired with this FO over the years has given me quite a few reservations about overall team success.

I really hope I'm wrong in all this but I'm not completely overjoyed like quite a few people are on here with this hire as of right now.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

....

I'm with you 100% I want to look back on this and think I was stupid for worrying about it.

 

[Jailbreak]

I'd describe it as bittersweet? It's hard to put an adjective on it. Media can talk about this, much like the last three, but I really have no clue what's taking place. There is obviously an element of comfort on both sides, but that often doesn't translate to success.

I don't want to pile more on his shoulders before he's coached a game.

 

[Axl Rose]

they may have not wanted him and disagreed with him early on...but i think they let him do his thing up until this year

truthfully last year they wanted to tank...but thibs kicked it into overdrive and played Jimmy ungodly minutes and wretched up Noah minutes while he was playing on a knee that he'd have to get surgery on right after the season

only to get smacked by the Wiz...that pissed them off....i also think thats when the players changed up aswell...they pretty much went numb to thibs and it showed in game 5 when they gave up just like they did in game 6 vs cleveland

 

[Scoot26]

they may have not wanted him and disagreed with him early on...but i think they let him do his thing up until this year

truthfully last year they wanted to tank...but thibs kicked it into overdrive and played Jimmy ungodly minutes and wretched up Noah minutes while he was playing on a knee that he'd have to get surgery on right after the season

only to get smacked by the Wiz...that pissed them off....i also think thats when the players changed up aswell...they pretty much went numb to thibs and it showed in game 5 when they gave up just like they did in game 6 vs cleveland

They gave up in Game 5? I recall it being 101-99 near the end. And Rose had a chance to tie it.

Or are you talking about the Milwaukee series?

 

[Axl Rose]

They gave up in Game 5? I recall it being 101-99 near the end. And Rose had a chance to tie it.

Or are you talking about the Milwaukee series?

im talking about the Wizards series last year they scored like 69 points

if you look at the boxscore you might think it was a gritty defensive game but all i remember is it being insufferable and guys looking like they were ready to go home...i think it was a case of both teams not giving a shit

 

[Diddy1122]

they may have not wanted him and disagreed with him early on...but i think they let him do his thing up until this year

truthfully last year they wanted to tank...but thibs kicked it into overdrive and played Jimmy ungodly minutes and wretched up Noah minutes while he was playing on a knee that he'd have to get surgery on right after the season

only to get smacked by the Wiz...that pissed them off....i also think thats when the players changed up aswell...they pretty much went numb to thibs and it showed in game 5 when they gave up just like they did in game 6 vs cleveland

They did not let him "do his thing" ever. They always had a problem with him. Reinsdorf saved Thibs job the year Rose went down with his ACL tear. GarPax reached out to Hoiberg again that offseason, as they didn't want to sign Thibs to an extension. Thibs always was Reinsdorf's man. He was never GarPax's. Reinsdorf soured on him more after Thibs left the extension on his desk for 4 months in silent protest. That burned bridges with JR that never mended which ushered his way out the door.

Thibs always coached with the hand he was dealt and I never faulted him for that. And the year they wanted to "tank" only served to improve Butler & Noah won DPOY. You're acting like he ruined the team on purpose just to stick it to management. Thibs has always wanted one thing and one thing only: To win. To think that he or the players on the team would have given up just cuz Rose was out & Deng was traded was idiotic thinking on their part. It was never going to happen that way.

Let's also not forget that it was the FO who leaked to the press that Rose was cleared to play to try and force him back into the rotation, when they CLEARLY STATED at the beginning of his rehab that it would be up to Rose to decide when he returns. The media and fans raked Rose over hot coals for it, when nearly every single person this board was 110% fine with him sitting out an entire "lost season". This FO has done some foul things over the past few years, and not just to Thibs but players as well, that the majority of the fans and media deflect the blame to said players or coach.