- Joined:
- Jul 31, 2010
- Posts:
- 4,967
- Liked Posts:
- 697
Oh it was?! Check again, please....
And no, Castillo's arbitration has not started....Check again, please...
Also, JMO...but I've never advocated overspending for offense at a position that typically doesn't give offense. Soto used to be a scary power presence at the dish...Now he's turned into a just get on base hitter...That's fine...But I'm not wasting money on him because he's top 5 in his position (a position where "great" is defined by first and foremost great defense and anything extra at the plate is gravy). The money, IMO is better spent elsewhere when the time comes...
No one is saying his arbitration has started. I said that his arby clock has started, which it has. Read, please... And his arby clock has started since he was added to the 40 man roster. It doesn't really matter when he is called up, because his service time is for being on the 40 man roster, so it's counting anyway.
Soto used to be a scary power presence? I'm going to assume you mean in 2008, when Soto had an ISO of .219, a SLG% of .504, and a HR/FB of 14.7%. So I ask you this: How does that make him a scary power presence but an ISO of .217, a SLG% of .497, and a HR/FB of 17.7% not?
Also, how is 3 million a waste on a player who has been worth at least 3 million 4 season in a row. One of which he played for like a month and another of which he completely sucked balls. The fact of the matter is that Soto more than makes up for anything he lacks defensively with the bat.
Soto's become just a base hit hitter? What are you talking about?
I don't see what's so wrong with a just base hit hitter anyway... even though it isn't true.
Come on, man. Don't be naive. You really think we expected Soto to go from a player capable of 30 HR and AT LEAST 80 RBI to a .280/17/50?
And, really...Koyie Hill DID catch Marmol more than Soto....CHECK.
When has Soto shown to be capable of hitting 30 HR? You clearly don't realize that Soto would have more RBIs if he would hit higher in the line up. That is not his fault, it is Lou's. What does the .280 BA have to do with it? It was just 5 points lower in 2008.
You are right, Hill did catch for Marmol more than Soto and with Hill, Marmol did have a lower ERA. But what you completely failed to acknowledge was that with Soto, Marmol's opponents had a lower BA, OBP, SLG, and OPS. With Soto, Marmol also had a higher K/9, BB/9, and K/BB.
Koyie hill caught carlos marmol 1.2 more innings than soto. And this was just about all in a row. Soto started the year catching him, but Koyie Hill's reputation to "call a better game" (Bob Brenley) earned him the role as Marmol's personal catcher. Every game (with a lead) that we had going into the 9th, we would take out Soto and the setup for Marmol/Hill...unless Hill started the game, in which he'd just stay...
YouTube - Philadelphia Eagles DeSean Jackson - ESPN Sunday NFL Countdown Commercial: The Catch
Carlos Marmol 2010 Pitching Splits - Baseball-Reference.com
My argument is this: We say Koyie Hill is overpaid. He is not...come on, we didn't shell out THAT much. We say Koyie Hill is an average defensive catcher when he is statistically in the top 5 (percentage-wise) in every important stat category (except for caught stealing last year, but he's still 41% over two years: PHENOMINAL). We say he can't frame a pitch via some BS sabermetric stat. Yet, he was Marmol's personal (with a lead) catcher for the last 3/4 of the year, and Marmol set a record for K/9....most of which were the caught looking variety, mostly throwing a BREAKING PITCH (which apparently Koyie Hill struggles framing pitches...).
Addendum to argument: Marmol threw 2 more Ks with Hill in only an inning and 2 thirds more, and had a lower ERA despite having 3 of his 5 blown saves with Hill. Only reason Soto didn't get them is because Hill was annointed Marmol's personal catcher...and five blown saves is fine....Why are we acting like Hill catching during 3 of them is a reason to boot him?
Bolded parts are complete BS.
I would love to know what you think are important stats. Additionally, Marmol was with Hill for 39 innings. That's not a lot. So to say that Hill can frame pitches because of that is stupid, because that is such a small sample size. Oh and Marmol mostly threw a non-breaking pitch. He threw a breaking pitch about 49% of the time and a non-breaker 51%. Percentages don't lie.
That's why I said "percentage-wise", Jntg4. Percentages do not lie, man. For backup catchers, there are (probably) none better defensively. He'd honestly be fine in an everyday American League lineup, due to the DH. He is a DAMN GOOD defensive catcher, which makes him perfect for the NL...But everyone acts like he's not worth the little money he's getting paid...
Sure, he's not super serviceable in the NL. But it doesn't make him any worse at what catchers are paid to do....catch....
Plus, do you really want Castillo wasting time on Quade's bench AND his arbitration clock to start?
If he played in the AL they would have to have the pitcher hit if they used the DH on him. :facepalm:
He isn't worth the money he is getting paid. He can't hit for shit and his defense is just average.
Castillo's arby clock is already going, bud.
His arb clock has already started, as CO explained.
And BTW, you said 2 more K's in only 1.2 more innings. You know that that means that he had a higher K/9 with Soto than with Hill, right?
Thank You.
Oh you finally learned to read a stat line? He also had a lower ERA by almost half a run with Hill.
Yes, Hill took the job due to Soto's DL stint. But when Lou saw how Marmol closed games (quickly and consisely) with Hill, it was his job to keep. Hence why I said that Hill was Marmol's personal catcher for 3/4 of the year....because HE WAS.
AND FOR THE LAST DAMN TIME....CASTILLO'S ARBITRATION CLOCK HAS NOT STARTED. TO ACCRUE A YEAR, YOU MUST BE ON THE CLUB FOR 86 DAYS DURING YOUR FIRST SEASON TO START THE CLOCK. HE PLAYED IN 7 (SEVEN!!!!!!) GAMES. HIS DEBUT WAS ON AUGUST 11TH OF LAST YEAR. NOT EVEN CLOSE TO QUALIFYING FOR A SUPER 2 ARBY. SO STOP IT WITH THE MISINFORMATION.
That's why I left this damn place. No one takes the time to look up their statistics before they give their opinion....
Bold = BS.
No one is saying he is arby eligible, but his clock has started. There is a difference.
For god's sakes, do you read?
For like the third (or fourth, I've lost track) time now. In SAVE situations, Hill was Marmol's personal catcher. There were many times Lou brought in Marmol in the 8th to pitch an inning in a tie game. Due to needing a run to win, Soto stayed in the game to catch Marmol. If the Cubs scored a lead taking run in the bottom, Hill came into the game.
How many times was that anyway?
You post a lot of made up shit, ya know?
Again, you need to use your head. Check the splits. Marmol had 8 of his IP in the 8th inning. Logic says, he comes in in a tie game to preserve it or to pitch 1 or 2 outs in a crunch situation. Those innings belong(ed) to Soto.
When Soto got hurt, Hill got to catch Marmol much much more often, and Lou saw how they worked together. Finishing games in 9-13 pitches, even....So even when Soto came back, Hill STILL got the 9th inning.
That's all I've been saying. Hill was Marmol's personal catcher in 9th inning save situations beause he CALLS A GOOD GAME....and intangible needed for a good catcher....
You turned this into "Who caught Marmol more." And (without looking) exclaimed that Soto did...and when proven wrong, made the excuse "Well Soto was put on the DL." Like that's my fault. Does Soto's DL stint make my point incorrect? No. Not at all.
So please. Stop talking without looking at statistical evidence first. It's baseball. Mindless talk is ridiculous. It's a game of statistics...USE THEM to refute and rebute your arguments/opponent's arguments rather than giving rhetorical spew.
I'm off work, and outta here. Have a nice day. And GO CUBS.
You check the splits. Marmol came into 15 games in the 8th inning. Literally none of them were in a tie ball game.
Out of the 15 games in which Marmol pitched in the 8th, Hill caught for him in 8 of them. So no, those innings did not belong to Soto.
What I don't get here is how can you call Hill Marmol's personal catcher, when A) Marmol is a reliever and B) Soto and Hill caught the same amount for him?
You are making it sound like Hill was brought into games in the 8th or 9th inning to specifically catch for Marmol. Hill was brought in for 14 games in the 8th inning or later. Four of those were Extra Inning games. Out of the 10 remaining games, he caught in 9(one was that awful game where Lou PH Hill for Soto and Hill bunted.). Out of those 9, 4 Hill actually caught for Marmol. 4. How is that for using statistics to refute and rebute?