Howard to the Lakers

Uman85

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I'm not a baseball follower... can someone answer me this. MLB has no salary cap, right? How much does Reinsdorf spend on the White Sox each year?

They've spent enough to have one of the top 10 payrolls in baseball, but that's still low compared to most contenders. Unfortunately for Sox fans, JR doesn't spend out the wazoo because the team is sort of like an investment hobby for him. If he breaks even, he considers it a success. Also, their low attendance figures kind of handcuff the GM from making large moves that take on salary.
 

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They've spent enough to have one of the top 10 payrolls in baseball, but that's still low compared to most contenders. Unfortunately for Sox fans, JR doesn't spend out the wazoo because the team is sort of like an investment hobby for him. If he breaks even, he considers it a success. Also, their low attendance figures kind of handcuff the GM from making large moves that take on salary.
Dang...JR is a baseball fan and he doesn't even spend money on the team he likes? #Reinsdorfcheap
 

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Don't think the East will be that weak. Still got New York, Boston, Indiana, Philly (especially now that they have Bynum...assuming health of course), and us sorta. That's 5 pretty good teams right there. Milwaukee is bound to be decent having Monta for a full year. Cavs are getting better. Not like the East is total garbage. Granted, West is still the stronger conference, but it's not like the mid 2000s where you could be under .500 and be a playoff team in the 5th or 6th spot.

Yeah, but I mean they are weaker compared to the West in that the 3-8 spots in the East have no shot at title contention. Whereas the West now have 3 legitimate contenders with the Lakers, Thunder, Spurs and maybe even Dallas, but losing Terry and Kidd is going to hurt. The Heat and maybe the Celtics are the only teams in the East that can stand a chance. Maybe the Bulls if they'd stay healthy and somehow get one more needed piece. But I don't really know what they need right now besides some mechanical parts for Rose.
 

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They've spent enough to have one of the top 10 payrolls in baseball, but that's still low compared to most contenders. Unfortunately for Sox fans, JR doesn't spend out the wazoo because the team is sort of like an investment hobby for him. If he breaks even, he considers it a success. Also, their low attendance figures kind of handcuff the GM from making large moves that take on salary.

I just found the numbers.

http://www.stevetheump.com/Payrolls.htm#2011payroll

So he's been dishing out near, or well over 100 million dollars a season on his players/staff.

over the last 12 years, the Bulls pay roll has been between 50-70 million each year, and we were often in the bottom 10 in terms of payroll.. Maybe the rumors are true of him using the Bulls as a cash cow? If he's making a boat load of money on the Bulls and not making money on the sox... yet he's spending a ton on the sox and not much on the Bulls, there might be some truth to it. Especially since he is very open about being a HUGE baseball fan.
 

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The Lakers starters are every bit as good as the heat right now, imo, and they're deeper.
 

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no choice but to move him now? The trade deadline is in 6 months, dude. What's the hurry?

You said right there in your last post. "Trade me now, MID-SEASON or I'll walk." so they didn't NEED to trade him NOW, because they had a choice. And you said you thought the NJ deal was probably better. So why not wait until mid-season and trade him then if that deal was better? Why the hurry now?

And again, they could have traded him to HOU. Just because Howard didn't wanna go there doesn't mean they couldn't deal him there. HOU didn't care if Dwight signed an extension. ORL doesn't owe dwight shit. He wants to leave.. why should they make sure he winds up happy?

So what if the Nets didn't make an offer for Howard midseason? Orlando holds on to him all season for nothing? They took the offer they were given. Do you think they really want a Dwight Howard for 1 year thats going to pout and ***** all season? No.

For the past several weeks all we've heard is "LA and Orlando in trade talks" We knew it was going to happen, yet everyone is still bitching because it happened. If you couldn't see this coming, your eyes need to be checked.

Orlando made the move they were given. It's really not that bad of a deal for them. They were put in a tough spot and made the move.

Again, it's not about him being happy. It's about Orlando getting rid of him and getting SOMETHING in return. You think if the HOU and NJ deals were "so much better" like you proclaim, the Magic wouldn't take them? Doubt it.
 

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The Lakers starters are every bit as good as the heat right now, imo, and they're deeper.
Yeah it'll be quite close talent wise.

Nash vs Wade
Kobe vs Allen
MWP vs Lebron
Gasol vs Bosh
Howard vs Haslem or whoever

Great matchups all around. It'll probably end up with Nash and Allen guarding each other and likewise for Wade and Kobe.

Not sure who the Lakers have on their bench, but I bet they wish they still had Odom. That would put them way over the top imo. Heat pretty much just have Chalmers, Battier, and Lewis on their bench.
 

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The Lakers starters are every bit as good as the heat right now, imo, and they're deeper.

They're not deeper. The Lakers bench is actually pretty bad, imo. Steve blake, jordan hill and Antawn Jamison. Those are the bench players that stand out for the Lakers.

I'd take Miami's bench with Battier, Rashard Lewis, Ray allen, Haslem, and Cole. Even James Jones... that dude is a good ass shooter. And if Mike Miller is healthy, he's pretty decent too. I doubt he will be though.

In terms of starters though.. hard to disagree. Howard/Gasol shit on Bosh/Anthony. Nash is better than Chalmers.... and Kobe/Wade are pretty even at this point. LBJ shits on Artest... but it's close overall.
 
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How the heck do the Lakers keep stealing players like this? They got Gasol for pretty much nothing except his brother (who no one thought would be good at the time) and now they pretty much traded Bynum for Howard straight up while keeping Pau. What...the...eff.

At the time they got Gasol for nothing, now Marc really isn't a bad haul for the Grizzlies. The Lakers giving up Bynum, a young Center, for Howard isn't really THAT lopsided. In your post you even state that Bynum is the 2nd best Center in the league. So what one is it? Laker rip off or what?

Keeping Pau was key for the Lakers. I have no idea how they did it, but they pulled that one off. Dwight, Nash and keeping Pau? That's a great off-season. Almost as good as the '96 one.
How high is the Magic GM? That return is TERRIBLE. Heck, they could've gotten a better deal from us. :lmao:

No one knows if it's 'terrible". Let it play out over the next few years and see how it ends up. Howard isn't guarenteed to sign an extension anway.

No, they really couldn't have. Orlando didn't want to take on big contracts like Noah, Deng and Boozer.

Good deal for the 76ers imo though. They were lacking a big man badly and now they have the 2nd best C in the league.

76ers got better. Losing Iggy sucks, but Bynum as your center when you had Hawes and Kwame is a great pickup.

But losing the 2nd best center as you gain the first best is a ripoff?


I figure it'll be either Wilson Chandler or Iggy at the 2 for the Nuggets. Crazy athletic backcourt with those guys and Lawson. Fastbreaks for them will be fun to watch.
 

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The Lakers starters are every bit as good as the heat right now, imo, and they're deeper.


Agreed.

Lakers arguably have the best starting 5 in the NBA right now.
 

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They've spent enough to have one of the top 10 payrolls in baseball, but that's still low compared to most contenders. Unfortunately for Sox fans, JR doesn't spend out the wazoo because the team is sort of like an investment hobby for him. If he breaks even, he considers it a success. Also, their low attendance figures kind of handcuff the GM from making large moves that take on salary.

They are 11th this year at $98M. The biggest difference between how the 2 businesses are run is that JR allows Kenny Williams the freedom to make bold moves to improve the team even despite the low attendance numbers. There is no such freedom allowed to Gar Foreman or John Paxson, yet the team pulled in just a shade under $60M operating income last year, second most in the league.

I'm not going to jump all down GarPax's throats for not try to get Howard (which I'm sure they did at one point) or not getting in on this deal. It's not because I'm fine with the way they run the team or have evaluated talent, it's because we simply didn't have anything to offer in a trade that was desirable to any of these teams. Bb..bu..but..Noahz & Stuffz! 1) Orlando did not want large contracts back in a trade, hence why they found another team to take Bynum & also Jason Richardson. Their mantra from day 1 of this Dwightmare was "young cheap players & draft picks", 2 things this team does not possess. 2) Most important of all...DWIGHT HOWARD DID NOT WANT TO PLAY HERE!

As for the 4-team deal itself, it worked out great for the other 3 but Orlando has been left feeling like a hooker after a ********...sad, confused & shamefully gooey
 
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So what if the Nets didn't make an offer for Howard midseason? Orlando holds on to him all season for nothing? They took the offer they were given. Do you think they really want a Dwight Howard for 1 year thats going to pout and ***** all season? No.

You keep ignoring Houston. Have you not heard all the rumors with Houston continuing to pursue Howard? Even when they amnestied Scola, their sights were on clearing cap to get Howard. Why didn't they take the offer they were given by HOU? Why didn't they take the offer they were given by NJ? And surely the Magic could have been offered something else by the trade deadline for Howard.. and he still could have ended up in LA. but ORL could have gotten a better deal out of it.

For the past several weeks all we've heard is "LA and Orlando in trade talks" We knew it was going to happen, yet everyone is still bitching because it happened. If you couldn't see this coming, your eyes need to be checked.

I'm not surprised he got traded to LA. I don't think anyone is. I think most people including myself are surprised the Magic made THIS deal. It just doesn't make sense..

Orlando made the move they were given. It's really not that bad of a deal for them. They were put in a tough spot and made the move.

Orlando wanted 3 things. Cap relief, a lot of picks and young prospects. They didn't get cap relief from this deal. They took on 2 contracts that will be about 50 million dollars over the next 3-4 years.

I guess 3 first round picks is a lot... but they are protected first round picks and will likely be picks between 20-30. History shows us that players drafted between 20-30 will rarely wind up being any good. between 20-30, there's usually 1-2 guys that end up being any good in each draft class on average. But a lot of those guys either wind up on another team by the time they're any good, or they just wind up being serviceable role players for a team. But if you're trading the best C in the league, you should be getting more than serviceable role players. Or the picks could end up being all-stars. Time will tell. But at this moment, odds are that those players they draft will either suck or won't be with the team for long.

And young prospects... That's definitely not Harrington. Afflalo is almost 27 and isn't really a prospect anymore. He doesn't have much room for improvement and you already know what your're getting out of him. Vucevic is the only young prospect they're getting... and at this point, he just seems average. Who knows though.

Again, it's not about him being happy. It's about Orlando getting rid of him and getting SOMETHING in return. You think if the HOU and NJ deals were "so much better" like you proclaim, the Magic wouldn't take them? Doubt it.

Clearly the Magic were interested in the NJ deal. That one was really close to getting done too. But talks were going on too long and time came where the Nets had to make a decision on Brook Lopez which sealed it. They couldn't come to an agreement in time before the Nets had to offer Lopez an extension.

" The Houston Rockets have upped their proposal to a package that could include any combination of the players Kevin Martin, Patrick Patterson, Marcus Morris, and Chandler Parsons, draft rights to three more players, and multiple future first-round picks, according to ESPN. One of the most appealing things for new Orlando general manager Rob Hennigan is the salary Houston would also be willing to take on.

Orlando will not get all of those options in a deal for Howard, although reports suggest the Rockets would be willing to take on the contracts of Glen Davis, Jason Richardson, and Chris Duhon. "


You don't think that offer was much better than what ORL got now? Why didn't the Magic do it? who knows. Clearly the Rockets were interested in giving up a lot for Howard.

and that would have been exactly what ORL wanted. Cap relief, picks and prospects.

Which is why I questioned whether or not Hennigan was high. If the Rockets deal was really there and if they really were willing to give up that much, ORL is stupid as **** for passing it up.
 

houheffna

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Dang...JR is a baseball fan and he doesn't even spend money on the team he likes? #Reinsdorfcheap

Lol...this is hilarious...don't believe the hype man. JR spends money. How quick everyone forgets Reindsorf destroying the market with his Albert Belle signing. Other owners were pissed with Reinsdorf. I even heard Reinsdorf asked Frank Thomas who he wanted...Belle or Bonds. Thomas chose Belle.

How has the narrative changed from "Reinsdorf spends Bulls money on the White Sox because he loves baseball so much..." to "Reinsdorf is cheap with everybody..."?

This is getting to be a bit much.
 

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I'm not going to jump all down GarPax's throats for not try to get Howard (which I'm sure they did at one point) or not getting in on this deal. It's not because I'm fine with the way they run the team or have evaluated talent, it's because we simply didn't have anything to offer in a trade that was desirable to any of these teams. Bb..bu..but..Noahz & Stuffz! 1) Orlando did not want large contracts back in a trade, hence why they found another team to take Bynum & also Jason Richardson. Their mantra from day 1 of this Dwightmare was "young cheap players & draft picks", 2 things this team does not possess. 2) Most important of all...DWIGHT HOWARD DID NOT WANT TO PLAY HERE!

As for the 4-team deal itself, it worked out great for the other 3 but Orlando has been left feeling like a hooker after a ********...sad, confused & shamefully gooey

The Dwight to Bulls dream was just that. A dream. Realistically, he was never coming here. That's one reason why I'm happy the trade got done. We can stop talking about it.

and I agree that all 3 teams other than ORL won the deal. Philly really upgraded at C.. even if it meant losing Iggy, they got better. Denver is already pretty stacked with Lawson, Chandler, Gallo, McGee, Faried, etc. Adding Iggy will only help. Obviously, the Lakers upgraded at C and didn't give up anyone else. It's weird that the team giving up the best player is the team that winds up getting shafted. At least when the Nuggets traded Melo they got back a lot of talent in return.
 

houheffna

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There is no such freedom allowed to Gar Foreman or John Paxson, yet the team pulled in just a shade under $60M operating income last year, second most in the league.

That is because of that whole luxury tax thing. Something that I believe 80% of the league avoided last year. It would be bad for business to let Paxson and Foreman run wild with a luxury tax (that is far more punitive than MLB's version) in place.
 

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That is because of that whole luxury tax thing. Something that I believe 80% of the league avoided last year. It would be bad for business to let Paxson and Foreman run wild with a luxury tax (that is far more punitive than MLB's version) in place.

I don't think the new LT rules were in place last year. I think they're starting after next season. Teams were just shedding some salary to prepare for it. But the same teams that were shedding salary [the Lakers for example] have just added more anyway. I don't think the new LT is going to stop the richest owners from spending. I highly doubt money is an issue for mikhail prokhorov, Buss, Dolan, cuban, etc. Those guys will continue going deep into the tax if it means getting great players to compete for a title.
 

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That is because of that whole luxury tax thing. Something that I believe 80% of the league avoided last year. It would be bad for business to let Paxson and Foreman run wild with a luxury tax (that is far more punitive than MLB's version) in place.

wouldn't be fair to compare the bulls to the rest of the league. Not only are we in a bigger market, we're also competing for a championship. Teams like charlotte have no incentive to pay the tax at all. Contenders might have a reason to pay the tax. How many contenders are paying the tax this year/will be paying it next year?
 

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Lol...this is hilarious...don't believe the hype man. JR spends money. How quick everyone forgets Reindsorf destroying the market with his Albert Belle signing. Other owners were pissed with Reinsdorf. I even heard Reinsdorf asked Frank Thomas who he wanted...Belle or Bonds. Thomas chose Belle.

How has the narrative changed from "Reinsdorf spends Bulls money on the White Sox because he loves baseball so much..." to "Reinsdorf is cheap with everybody..."?

This is getting to be a bit much.
Guess you missed the sarcasm there? Wasn't actually serious.

Clearly he's spending some money on the White Sox...pretty obvious by looking at the numbers lol.
 

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You keep ignoring Houston. Have you not heard all the rumors with Houston continuing to pursue Howard? Even when they amnestied Scola, their sights were on clearing cap to get Howard. Why didn't they take the offer they were given by HOU? Why didn't they take the offer they were given by NJ? And surely the Magic could have been offered something else by the trade deadline for Howard.. and he still could have ended up in LA. but ORL could have gotten a better deal out of it.



I'm not surprised he got traded to LA. I don't think anyone is. I think most people including myself are surprised the Magic made THIS deal. It just doesn't make sense..



Orlando wanted 3 things. Cap relief, a lot of picks and young prospects. They didn't get cap relief from this deal. They took on 2 contracts that will be about 50 million dollars over the next 3-4 years.

I guess 3 first round picks is a lot... but they are protected first round picks and will likely be picks between 20-30. History shows us that players drafted between 20-30 will rarely wind up being any good. between 20-30, there's usually 1-2 guys that end up being any good in each draft class on average. But a lot of those guys either wind up on another team by the time they're any good, or they just wind up being serviceable role players for a team. But if you're trading the best C in the league, you should be getting more than serviceable role players. Or the picks could end up being all-stars. Time will tell. But at this moment, odds are that those players they draft will either suck or won't be with the team for long.

And young prospects... That's definitely not Harrington. Afflalo is almost 27 and isn't really a prospect anymore. He doesn't have much room for improvement and you already know what your're getting out of him. Vucevic is the only young prospect they're getting... and at this point, he just seems average. Who knows though.



Clearly the Magic were interested in the NJ deal. That one was really close to getting done too. But talks were going on too long and time came where the Nets had to make a decision on Brook Lopez which sealed it. They couldn't come to an agreement in time before the Nets had to offer Lopez an extension.

" The Houston Rockets have upped their proposal to a package that could include any combination of the players Kevin Martin, Patrick Patterson, Marcus Morris, and Chandler Parsons, draft rights to three more players, and multiple future first-round picks, according to ESPN. One of the most appealing things for new Orlando general manager Rob Hennigan is the salary Houston would also be willing to take on.

Orlando will not get all of those options in a deal for Howard, although reports suggest the Rockets would be willing to take on the contracts of Glen Davis, Jason Richardson, and Chris Duhon. "


You don't think that offer was much better than what ORL got now? Why didn't the Magic do it? who knows. Clearly the Rockets were interested in giving up a lot for Howard.

and that would have been exactly what ORL wanted. Cap relief, picks and prospects.

Which is why I questioned whether or not Hennigan was high. If the Rockets deal was really there and if they really were willing to give up that much, ORL is stupid as **** for passing it up.

No one on Houston intrigues me honestly. It's not a horrible trade at all for Orlando, at least give it a few years to play out.
 

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No one on Houston intrigues me honestly. It's not a horrible trade at all for Orlando, at least give it a few years to play out.

No it's not a bad trade for orlando at all. Anyways, On a completely different note, I got this bag of magic beans that i want to sell you. You interested?
 

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