IST:Cubs at Reds

[Parade_Rain]

I agree with Omeletpants. The only exception that comes to mind is Pete Rose. All of the greats had a regular position. At times they were moved off to another regular position (See Ernie Banks) but they weren't bounced around. Madden has a super utility guy with Ben Zobrist. And let's for argument sake say Ben is exceptional. Who else has Joe done this with and succeeded?

Kris Bryant plays 3B. LF when needed. CF when needed. Baez, if he can hit will play quite a few. Also, Egghead took my post out of context, as you now have as well. I never suggested this was done in the past. Soler plays RF and LF. Schwarber plays LF and they were working him in as a C, too.

 

[beckdawg]

Not sure why people are making a big deal about playing multiple positions. OF often move around. If you want to contrast that with playing all over the field then fine. However, I can't imagine how playing all over the field some how makes you worse. Often the problem is utility players just don't see often enough at bats.

 

[DanTown]

Bryant was never projected to be a good defensive 3B. If you thought he was the next Nolan Arenado (someone who never flashed elite glove potential but then was an elite glove), I assume the Cubs would move Bryant way less than they do. As it stands, the Cubs basically don't move a ton of starters around

C - Montero, Ross, Schwarber once a week
1B- Rizzo
2B - Zobrist, Baez, LaStella
3B - Bryant, Baez, LaStella
SS - Russell, Baez
LF - Schwarber, Soler, Bryant, Szczur
CF - Fowler, Heyward, Szczur, Baez (though never MLB)
RF - Heyward, Soler, Bryant

There are really only two guys who ROUTINELY move around - Bryant and Baez. Almost everyone else who is in the lineup is in the same place if they're in the lineup.

Baez moves around because he's a fairly elite glove who gives guys days off; Bryant moves around because he's not an elite glove but a great athlete (his best defensive abilities are tied to his speed/range/size combo) so it makes sense to use him in a utility way.

 

[Omeletpants]

Not sure why people are making a big deal about playing multiple positions. OF often move around. If you want to contrast that with playing all over the field then fine. However, I can't imagine how playing all over the field some how makes you worse. Often the problem is utility players just don't see often enough at bats.

There are lots of outfielders that can only play LF or the corners

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Bryant was never projected to be a good defensive 3B. If you thought he was the next Nolan Arenado (someone who never flashed elite glove potential but then was an elite glove), I assume the Cubs would move Bryant way less than they do. As it stands, the Cubs basically don't move a ton of starters around

C - Montero, Ross, Schwarber once a week
1B- Rizzo
2B - Zobrist, Baez, LaStella
3B - Bryant, Baez, LaStella
SS - Russell, Baez
LF - Schwarber, Soler, Bryant, Szczur
CF - Fowler, Heyward, Szczur, Baez (though never MLB)
RF - Heyward, Soler, Bryant

There are really only two guys who ROUTINELY move around - Bryant and Baez. Almost everyone else who is in the lineup is in the same place if they're in the lineup.

Baez moves around because he's a fairly elite glove who gives guys days off; Bryant moves around because he's not an elite glove but a great athlete (his best defensive abilities are tied to his speed/range/size combo) so it makes sense to use him in a utility way.

You summed it up better than I could. Basically if Baez had more OF experience or Bryant was a lights out defender at 3B you wouldn't see this happening but Baez is a very versatile plus defender IF with little time in the OF (none in LF in the majors) and Bryant is equally competent in LF as he is at 3B. As it is it doesn't make your team worse when you want a certain combination of guys in the lineup.

 

[Omeletpants]

I think Bryant LF, Baez 3B, Soler in the AL makes this a better team offensively and defensively

 

[Diehardfan]

You know, what we have here are a bunch of kids playing baseball. Granted it's MLB and not sandlot ball it's still baseball. In organized ball I pitched but when we played pickup games, I played everywhere. I'm sure all of these guys did the same at one time or another. It's nothing that they haven't done before, for example Shelby Miller played left field last night for a few innings. The only difference is if you stick with one position, you'll get better playing it defensively....hitting should be a non-factor. I'm guessing they're just glad to get out there and play....no matter where they are in the field.

 

[Omeletpants]

You know, what we have here are a bunch of kids playing baseball. Granted it's MLB and not sandlot ball it's still baseball. In organized ball I pitched but when we played pickup games, I played everywhere. I'm sure all of these guys did the same at one time or another. It's nothing that they haven't done before, for example Shelby Miller played left field last night for a few innings. The only difference is if you stick with one position, you'll get better playing it defensively....hitting should be a non-factor. I'm guessing they're just glad to get out there and play....no matter where they are in the field.

It's not about what other positions they can play or want to play. It's about what is best for the team. In my HUMBLE opinion, Bryant playing LF is better than Bryant playing 3B. That Soler in the American League is the best, long term solution

 

[Diehardfan]

97 wins last year. 14-5 overall and 10-3 on the road this year. I think they know what's best for this team.

 

[DanTown]

Just a reminder people: the Cubs are 15-4 with a margin of +68.

They're two wins LOWER than their expected W/L.

The Cubs are 9-9 if the question is "will the Cubs win by 5+ runs tonight".

Jake Arrieta has continued his last year pace and has had the best 24 game stretch maybe ever comparatively speaking.

Top 5 teams in runs allowed (runs scored rank in "()")
Washington - 51 (12)
White Sox - 47 (28)
Cubs - 51 (1)
Mets - 52 (16)
Royals - 55 (20)

Top 5 teams in runs scored (runs given up in "()")
Chicago - 119 (3)
St Louis - 111 (11)
Colorado - 99 (28)
San Francisco - 99 (21)
Arizona - 97 (26)

 

[beckdawg]

There are lots of outfielders that can only play LF or the corners

And most people can't play SS. That's generally why you don't see these types of players. It's far less to do with that some how making them worse at least in my opinion. I'm not sure there's enough sample size either way to make a firm conclusion. With that being said, most SS can probably play any position on the field. But the thing is there's so few good SS you're almost always going to see them stay at SS if they are good enough to play there. If not they are going to play at 2B or 3B depending on how their body type is. A bigger guy is probably a 3B and a more athletic guy is probably a 2B. And that's the extent of it.

The thing is the cubs are one of the few teams that have enough positional talent where you would consider moving a starter around positionally to see time. If you look at the vast majority of the super utility players who've been successful they were never big time prospects. They almost always were late bloomers who played so well their manager had to find time for them. This is the case with Zobrist in TB, Placido Palanco, Ryan Freel(sp?) and so on.

Also for what it's worth the cubs as an organization are well known for taking "position-less" players. They have drafted multiple players in the past few years who are tweeners but tweeners who can hit. Mark Zagunis has hit .274/.408/.406 in the minors and isn't a bigger name prospect because he's not a prototypical corner OF. Same can be said with McKinney who they dealt for. Ian Happ they are trying at 2B and many don't see that as realistic. Schwarber is an obvious case. They inherited Vogelbach I believe but he is another case they've yet to deal. And so on and so forth.

Regardless, the cubs value positional flexibility and probably rightly so. Even if someone isn't a "ideal fit" some where just being able to play there insures you have someone in case of injury.

 

[brett05]

Kris Bryant plays 3B. LF when needed. CF when needed. Baez, if he can hit will play quite a few. Also, Egghead took my post out of context, as you now have as well. I never suggested this was done in the past. Soler plays RF and LF. Schwarber plays LF and they were working him in as a C, too.

Then your issue is sample size. None of those players have a track record to say it works. Your argument seems to be that Maddon is the first to try this and that it will work. I'm not sure on either of those points and I use the history of the game to back that up.

 

[Parade_Rain]

Then your issue is sample size. None of those players have a track record to say it works. Your argument seems to be that Maddon is the first to try this and that it will work. I'm not sure on either of those points and I use the history of the game to back that up.

You took my post out of context and now you're trying a CYA with some sample size comment. LOL.

 

[brett05]

You took my post out of context and now you're trying a CYA with some sample size comment. LOL.

Not at all, but if you refuse to have reasonable discourse on this issue, we can just move along.