IST: NBA Finals Thread: Thunder VS Heat

[FirstTimer]

On top of this if Deng is the better player you are more likely to help off of Rip than Deng anyways. You're not going to willingly leave Luol Deng in a rotation more than you would be willing to leave Rip.

You posts get more and more absurd.

Why on God's green earth would you help off the better shooter and rebounder in Deng rather than off Rip?

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Why would it HAVE to be Deng's man? Help defense isn't predicated on positional/skill matchups. It's predicated on the defensive rotations, that more often than not don't really coincide with a wing helping on another wing etc.

As usual, you show that you have never played the game of basketball before in your life.

Regardless of whether it is Deng's man or Boozer/Gibson's man, that is still going to be better for the Bulls' offense than it being a 2009-10 Bulls' SG's man. The Heat have Wade and LeBron who over-help on because they are able to recover back on their defensive assignment much better than nearly every other perimeter defender. Ronnie Brewer's improved shooting combined with the absence of Keith Bogans combined with the addition of Richard Hamilton helped the Bulls' offense improve from 12th to 6th in the league despite Derrick Rose missing almost half of the regular season.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

On top of this if Deng is the better player you are more likely to help off of Rip than Deng anyways. You're not going to willingly leave Luol Deng in a rotation more than you would be willing to leave Rip.

You posts get more and more absurd.

Why on God's green earth would you help off the better shooter and rebounder in Deng rather than off Rip?

Deng is the better defender and rebounder. Rip Hamilton is just as good of a spot-up shooter and a better shooter off of the dribble- even at his age. And also a much better ball-handler than Deng. Deng's finishing ability at the rim took a hit after the wrist injury. You don't typically see the same Luol Deng who can take a hard hit in the paint or absorb contact and make a contest lay-up because of that.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

And do you really think teams are worried about Deng's rebounding very much when the Bulls have 2 out of the 4 of Noah/Asik/Boozer/Gibson on the floor? Not really.

 

[FirstTimer]

Regardless of whether it is Deng's man or Boozer/Gibson's man, that is still going to be better for the Bulls' offense than it being a 2009-10 Bulls' SG's man.

That's not the point really. No one ever said that the Bulls would be better with Keith Bogans taking jumpers than Rip Hamilton. So you pointing it out goes to show that you don't follow along at all and feel the need to state the blatently obvious to try and make yourself feel as though you are contributing to any sort of meaningful dialogue.

Care to break down for us how Kevin McHale was better than Kurt Rambis?

The Heat have Wade and LeBron who over-help on because they are able to recover back on their defensive assignment much better than nearly every other perimeter defender. Ronnie Brewer's improved shooting combined with the absence of Keith Bogans combined with the addition of Richard Hamilton helped the Bulls' offense improve from 12th to 6th in the league despite Derrick Rose missing almost half of the regular season.

This shit again. We already went over this with you. Perhaps in this very thread. (I can't recall off hand because your idiocy tends to permeate this forum). The Bulls being 6th in the league in offense means nothing relative to them matching up with the Heat. The Bulls scoring better against the New Jersey Nets of the world after the departure of Keith Bogans means jack squat in a 7 game series against Miami.

How can you not understand this?

 

[inactiveuser1]

Who brought up Bogans? :lmao:

 

[FirstTimer]

And do you really think teams are worried about Deng's rebounding very much when the Bulls have 2 out of the 4 of Noah/Asik/Boozer/Gibson on the floor? Not really.

Not the point killroy. The point is a team would be more worried about Deng hurting them rebounding than they would Rip. Thus they would be LESS likely to help off of Deng than Rip if needing to decide between the two. If the Bulls already have an advantage rebounding with no help rotations it would make negative amounts of sense for a team to hurt themselves even more in a help situation and tilt the advantage even more towards the Bulls by helping off the better rebounder in Deng.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

Their line-up for a long stretch of time was Perkins-Sefolosha-Cook-Harden-Fisher. That is the worst offense ever when Harden is struggling shooting.

LoL at Sefolosha's offense or lack of. :lol:

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

That's not the point really. No one ever said that the Bulls would be better with Keith Bogans taking jumpers than Rip Hamilton. So you pointing it out goes to show that you don't follow along at all and feel the need to state the blatently obvious to try and make yourself feel as though you are contributing to any sort of meaningful dialogue.

Care to break down for us how Kevin McHale was better than Kurt Rambis?



This shit again. We already went over this with you. Perhaps in this very thread. (I can't recall off hand because your idiocy tends to permeate this forum). The Bulls being 6th in the league in offense means nothing relative to them matching up with the Heat. The Bulls scoring better against the New Jersey Nets of the world after the departure of Keith Bogans means jack squat in a 7 game series against Miami.

How can you not understand this?

You do realize that Chris Bosh wasn't even there in the first 4 games of the ECF, don't you?

It is more than fair to assume the Bulls could have won in the ECF against Miami given that fact. Their offense had improved somewhat since 2009-10 as well which was apart of my point in bringing up why I wished the Bulls had been healthy so they could have made the Finals to see how their defense could have shook up the Thunder offense.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

Not the point killroy. The point is a team would be more worried about Deng hurting them rebounding than they would Rip. Thus they would be LESS likely to help off of Deng than Rip if needing to decide between the two. If the Bulls already have an advantage rebounding with no help rotations it would make negative amounts of sense for a team to hurt themselves even more in a help situation and tilt the advantage even more towards the Bulls by helping off the better rebounder in Deng.

Killroy :rolling:

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Not the point killroy. The point is a team would be more worried about Deng hurting them rebounding than they would Rip. Thus they would be LESS likely to help off of Deng than Rip if needing to decide between the two. If the Bulls already have an advantage rebounding with no help rotations it would make negative amounts of sense for a team to hurt themselves even more in a help situation and tilt the advantage even more towards the Bulls by helping off the better rebounder in Deng.

That is a valid argument.

 

[FirstTimer]

Who brought up Bogans? :lmao:

Basically Rami.

Rami framing his "help thesis" around Hamilton being better than Bogans is absurd. The question isn't who would you rather leave unattended between Bogans and Hamilton, it's who would you rather leave between Deng and Hamilton.

Rami fails to grasp even the most basic logical and basketball concepts.

 

[FirstTimer]

You do realize that Chris Bosh wasn't even there in the first 4 games of the ECF, don't you?

LOL at the guy who doesn't watch basketball asking me if I watch basketball.

It is more than fair to assume the Bulls could have won in the ECF against Miami given that fact.

You do realize Derrick Rose wouldn't have been playing right? Or are you honestly saying you think the Bulls could have beaten the Heat with no Rose?

.......

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BRB going to ignore the Heat's injuries but not the Bulls.

That is a valid argument.

Herp derp.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Basically Rami.

Rami framing his "help thesis" around Hamilton being better than Bogans is absurd. The question isn't who would you rather leave unattended between Bogans and Hamilton, it's who would you rather leave between Deng and Hamilton.

Rami fails to grasp even the most basic logical and basketball concepts.

Deng and Hamilton are both good shooters. Last year against Miami, the Bulls' didn't always have 2 good shooters on the floor (unless they chose to sacrifice a lot of defense in using Korver and Deng). The point is that the Bulls' perimeter offense has improved. At the same time, Miami's perimeter defense also improved with the addition of Battier.

The main reason I believe the Bulls would've beaten Miami is the absence of Bosh for much of that series. That is the main difference between 2011 and 2012.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

LOL at the guy who doesn't watch basketball asking me if I watch basketball.


You do realize Derrick Rose wouldn't have been playing right? Or are you honestly saying you think the Bulls could have beaten the Heat with no Rose?

.......

..
.
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BRB going to ignore the Heat's injuries but not the Bulls.



Herp derp.

The discussion was brought up in the context of 'what if Rose and Noah were healthy' so your point is moot.

 

[FirstTimer]

The point is that the Bulls' perimeter offense has improved.

With Captain Obvious no longer posting here can we transfer the name to Rami?

The main reason I believe the Bulls would've beaten Miami is the absence of Bosh for much of that series. That is the main difference between 2011 and 2012.

Again, Special person discussion.

The discussion was brought up in the context of 'what if Rose and Noah were healthy' so your point is moot.

Why would you even entertain such a Special person discussion?

BRB going to compare a team at full health and ignore their injuries while allowing the other team to be banged up and injured.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

Deng and Hamilton are both good shooters. Last year against Miami, the Bulls' didn't always have 2 good shooters on the floor (unless they chose to sacrifice a lot of defense in using Korver and Deng). The point is that the Bulls' perimeter offense has improved. At the same time, Miami's perimeter defense also improved with the addition of Battier.

The main reason I believe the Bulls would've beaten Miami is the absence of Bosh for much of that series. That is the main difference between 2011 and 2012.

Excuse me, I don't mean to butt in, but the main difference between 2011 and 2012 is NO ROSE and NOAH :shrug:

And even with Noah after and whenever he would of returned from injury, he would of been like a half of a Noah.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

With Captain Obvious no longer posting here can we transfer the name to Rami?




Again, Special person discussion.



Why would you even entertain such a Special person discussion?

BRB going to compare a team at full health and ignore their injuries while allowing the other team to be banged up and injured.

Wishing, as Special person as it is, is hard not to do at times.

 

[FirstTimer]

Excuse me, I don't mean to butt in, but the main difference between 2011 and 2012 is NO ROSE and NOAH :shrug:

And even with Noah after and whenever he would of returned from injury, he would of been like a half of a Noah.

No SP. The Bulls would have had no injuries. Deng would have been 100%, Noah, Rose 100%. The Heat however in this "simulation" would have gotten no such treatment.

Basically Rami's idea is that a fully healthy Bulls team could have beaten a banged up Heat squad.

WOW!

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Excuse me, I don't mean to butt in, but the main difference between 2011 and 2012 is NO ROSE and NOAH :shrug:

And even with Noah after and whenever he would of returned from injury, he would of been like a half of a Noah.

It is all wishful thinking admittedly. I don't think the Bulls would have beaten Miami if both teams were completely healthy. The more rational thought process is to wish that the Bulls had been healthy and run into the Heat while they hadn't had Bosh for a few games.

It is possible that the Bulls would have beaten Miami even if both teams were completely healthy. Doubtful but possible. When you factor the notion of Bosh being out for the first 4 games in a completely hypothetical situation then it would look even better for the Bulls.