Justice Dept. Rejects New S.C. Voter ID Law

IceHogsFan

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Try to imagine..........



You are talking to an individual that is new to our country. They are learning about the laws, the Constitution, Bill of Rights to become a citizen. That same person looks at you and asks,



"If I want to vote in one of your elections I don't need any photo identification to prove who I am before I vote? In other words, I just claim who I am verbally and they have to let me vote?"













When you think about it, does it not floor you that this is even a debate?
 

jaxhawksfan

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I'm starting to like Oregon's method more and more. You register when you get a state ID, and must have a state ID to get a registration. Then, your ballot is mailed to you. You fill it out, mail it back, or return the ballot to the nearest county registrar.



I have no problem with showing ID to vote, but something tells me the fear is that in some of those states, there is discrimination for getting said state-issued ID's, hence the issues.



I won't sit here and say it doesn't happen, because frankly I have no idea. However, I have never heard of discrimination for getting an ID. Can you give me some examples please? In every state I have ever lived, you show proof of who you are, pay your money, get your photo taken and BOOM! you have an ID.
 

Maiden

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I'm starting to like Oregon's method more and more. You register when you get a state ID, and must have a state ID to get a registration. Then, your ballot is mailed to you. You fill it out, mail it back, or return the ballot to the nearest county registrar.



I have no problem with showing ID to vote, but something tells me the fear is that in some of those states, there is discrimination for getting said state-issued ID's, hence the issues.



So what would prevent those discriminated against from obtaining this state issued I.D.?
 

ytsejam

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So ACORN was not involved in criminal activities involving voter fraud? ACORN made a mockery of our voting system.



In this thread we are discussing voter Id's. For the good of all photo identification is a step in the right direction of cleaning up voter fraud IMO.



I don't buy into the commentary that there will always be voter fraud so in other words we should do nothing to try to address the issue. I find it unbelievable that you do not have to present a photo ID in our federal election cycle. To say it warrants discrimination to certain classes to do so is assanine.



You're fucking right ACORN wasn't involved in voter fraud.

Was there ANY voter fraud?

NO.

Was there voter REGISTRATION fraud?

YES.

What did ACORN do? They reported it to election authorities as required by law.



Is is wrong to get paid to sign up bogus names such as "Mickey Mouse" on registration rolls?

**** yes it is.



Does "Mickey Mouse" actually show up at the polls and vote for "candidate x"?

Hell no.
 

Tater

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You're fucking right ACORN wasn't involved in voter fraud.

Was there ANY voter fraud?

NO.


Was there voter REGISTRATION fraud?

YES.

What did ACORN do? They reported it to election authorities as required by law.



Is is wrong to get paid to sign up bogus names such as "Mickey Mouse" on registration rolls?

**** yes it is.



Does "Mickey Mouse" actually show up at the polls and vote for "candidate x"?

Hell no.



WRONG.



[font="Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif"]ACORN operative admits 'voter fraud'[/font]



[font="Palatino, Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif"]'Americans are sick and tired of having the votes of law-abiding citizens canceled out'[/font]









[size="-1"]Posted: September 13, 2011

8:55 pm Eastern[/size] [size="-1"] © 2011 WND [/size]







After confessing to what appears to constitute voter fraud, high-level Democratic Party insider Andrea "Andi" Pringle has abruptly quit her post as senior aide to Washington, D.C., mayor Vincent Gray.

The resignation comes as several U.S. states initiate a crackdown on voter fraud. It also comes weeks after it was reported that Lessadolla Sowers, a member of the executive board of the Tunica County, Miss., NAACP, was sentenced to five years in prison for voting 10 times in the names of other people.

Get "Subversion Inc." and read about the strategy that intends to take down America.

Barely a week into the job, Pringle, who was Gray's deputy chief of staff, resigned her recently position after admitting she voted in the September 2010 primary election in the District of Columbia even though she was residing at that time in neighboring Montgomery County, Md. In her resignation letter Pringle said she was quitting because she had "become a distraction from the important work of" Gray's administration, as local media in the nation's capital have reported.

"The tired old refrain we keep hearing from the Left is that voter fraud is a myth, but in fact it is fairly common crime," said Matthew Vadum, author of the explosive new book "Subversion Inc.: How Obama's ACORN Red Shirts are Still Terrorizing and Ripping Off American Taxpayers."

ACORN's Project Vote even released a report a few years ago called "The Politics of Voter Fraud," which claimed that voter fraud is a myth. "The claim that voter fraud threatens the integrity of American elections is itself a fraud … [that] is being used to persuade the public that deceitful and criminal voters are manipulating the electoral system."

(Story continues below)

Vadum, senior editor at Capital Research Center, a think tank that studies left-wing advocacy groups and their funders, has compiled the information from nearly three years of research and hundreds of interviews. His book tells the real story about ACORN, the multinational criminal activist group with longstanding ties to Barack Obama and the Democratic National Committee.

As Vadum reports in "Subversion Inc.," at least 54 ACORN employees and individuals associated with ACORN have been convicted of voter fraud. Voter fraud is a blanket term coined by lawyers. It refers to fraudulent voting, identity fraud, perjury, voter registration fraud, forgery, and a variety of crimes related to the electoral process. ACORN itself was convicted of the crime of "compensation" in Nevada for its role in a conspiracy that gave voter registration canvassers cash for exceeding daily quotas.

Like Gray, Pringle is a Democrat with strong ties to that party's establishment.

She was campaign manager for former Sen. Carol Moseley Braun, D-Ill., when she sought the presidency in 2004. Barack Obama helped to elect Braun to the U.S. Senate in 1992 when he ran a successful get-out-the-vote effort for ACORN subsidiary Project Vote.

Pringle worked on both of Jesse Jackson's presidential campaigns and for his National Rainbow Coalition group.

According to Vadum's book, ACORN endorsed Jackson's 1984 presidential run. That year, the group went even farther, running Jackson's campaign in New Hampshire. The voter fraud-prone ACORN, which stands for Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, also was deeply involved with the Jackson campaign in Michigan and Arkansas.

In an ironic twist, Pringle worked on criminal justice issues when she was employed by radical left-wing philanthropist George Soros's foundation, the Open Society Institute.

Pringle was a senior political adviser for former New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson's 2008 presidential campaign. She held the same post at a political action committee for Sen. Mark Warner, D-Va., Forward Together PAC. She also served as deputy campaign manager for Howard Dean's 2004 presidential election campaign after Carol Moseley Braun dropped out of the race.

Whether Pringle will be prosecuted for the felony that could land her in prison for up to 10 years reportedly will be left to the district's U.S. attorney, Obama appointee Ronald C. Machen Jr.



Read more: ACORN operative admits 'voter fraud' http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=344577#ixzz1hdDg7Hb6
 

mikita's helmet

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How [Republican appointed] U.S. attorneys were used to spread voter-fraud fears



Long before it fired eight U.S. attorneys for political reasons, the Bush administration had politicized their jobs by making them push a favorite GOP talking point.



http://www.salon.com/2007/03/21/us_attorneys_2/



Behind the GOP’s voter fraud hysteria



As Republicans warn of catastrophe at the polls, an expert on election fraud explains the real partisan hoax -- the suppression of Democratic votes.



http://www.salon.com/2008/10/15/voter_suppression/singleton/
 

mikita's helmet

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If the Southern states didn't have a history of voter suppression, this wouldn't be an issue. It doesn't help that the last Bush Administration fired 8 Republican appointed US Attorneys who refused to file voter fraud charges, in elections Republicans lost, due to a lack of evidence to bring charges and, now, all the legislatures passing the new voter ID laws are Reublican controlled legislatures.



The only voter suppresion I recall in recent history is the 2000 presidential election. I found it highly ironic that the 5 justices who almost always supported state rights, sided with the federal government in Bush v. Gore. The same could be said of the 4 who sided with the State of Florida. Highly ironic that they would side with the state of Florida.



It was an out and out bipartisan vote by the 9 justices, a velvet robed coup d'etat of the political process.
 

Maiden

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Page 3 of this thread outlines the very reason why showing an ID to vote is crucial. Thank you for making this point crystal clear.
 

puckjim

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I just never knew that voter fraud was so rampant in South Carolina.



Good thing that conscious legislators are championing such an important and nonpartisan cause.



I do know that when I was an examiner at the Illinois Sec of State's office, minority applicants tended to have the hardest time coming up with acceptable identification necessary to secure state-issued identification cards.



That was 20 years ago so perhaps things are different.
 

IceHogsFan

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I just never knew that voter fraud was so rampant in South Carolina.



Good thing that conscious legislators are championing such an important and nonpartisan cause.



I do know that when I was an examiner at the Illinois Sec of State's office, minority applicants tended to have the hardest time coming up with acceptable identification necessary to secure state-issued identification cards.



Why should this be partisan? Why must the AG's office make it a race and minority issue?



Why should it be so easy to get a state issued ID? Why must everyone think that having the right to vote means that it must be simple to do so?



If someone wants to drive must we make it easier for certain classes to get a license? If they want state subsidies? Federal benefits?
 

jaxhawksfan

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I just never knew that voter fraud was so rampant in South Carolina.



Good thing that conscious legislators are championing such an important and nonpartisan cause.



I do know that when I was an examiner at the Illinois Sec of State's office, minority applicants tended to have the hardest time coming up with acceptable identification necessary to secure state-issued identification cards.



That was 20 years ago so perhaps things are different.



My question was asked earlier, and you almost answer it here. What kinds of acceptable ID are required? Seems to me people don't have a problem proving who they are where there is money or some form of benefit involved.
 

puckjim

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My question was asked earlier, and you almost answer it here. What kinds of acceptable ID are required? Seems to me people don't have a problem proving who they are where there is money or some form of benefit involved.



Well, 20 years ago an applicant was required to have a certified birth certificate, social security card, and something that showed an in-state address, like a utility bill. The birth certificate was usually the problem, as many older folks couldn't come up with a certified copy. They are readily available from the county of birth, but a lot of times the elderly or poor couldn't get to the county building.



I don't know what was required to get a certified birth certificate, but I believe those are a matter of public record.



A lot can change in 20 years, though. I don't believe a SS card is still a requirement, but I'm not sure.
 

Maiden

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Well, 20 years ago an applicant was required to have a certified birth certificate, social security card, and something that showed an in-state address, like a utility bill. The birth certificate was usually the problem, as many older folks couldn't come up with a certified copy. They are readily available from the county of birth, but a lot of times the elderly or poor couldn't get to the county building.



I don't know what was required to get a certified birth certificate, but I believe those are a matter of public record.



A lot can change in 20 years, though. I don't believe a SS card is still a requirement, but I'm not sure.



A friend of mine told me today his daughter could not get her drivers license last week because he didn't have her original social security card.
 

Maiden

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I just never knew that voter fraud was so rampant in South Carolina.



Good thing that conscious legislators are championing such an important and nonpartisan cause.



I do know that when I was an examiner at the Illinois Sec of State's office, minority applicants tended to have the hardest time coming up with acceptable identification necessary to secure state-issued identification cards.



That was 20 years ago so perhaps things are different.



Should a law take effect just because their is a problem? Should there not be a standard set and in place?

Seems to me if you need identification to do basic things like cash a check, open a bank account, sign for a registered piece of mail at the post office, the same would hold true for voting correct?
 

klemmer

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Should a law take effect just because their is a problem? Should there not be a standard set and in place?

Seems to me if you need identification to do basic things like cash a check, open a bank account, sign for a registered piece of mail at the post office, the same would hold true for voting correct?



Only problem is that makes too much sense.
 

jaxhawksfan

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Well, 20 years ago an applicant was required to have a certified birth certificate, social security card, and something that showed an in-state address, like a utility bill. The birth certificate was usually the problem, as many older folks couldn't come up with a certified copy. They are readily available from the county of birth, but a lot of times the elderly or poor couldn't get to the county building.



I don't know what was required to get a certified birth certificate, but I believe those are a matter of public record.



A lot can change in 20 years, though. I don't believe a SS card is still a requirement, but I'm not sure.



Thanks. It was an honest question and you answered it. They wouldn't accept the copy of my birth certificate at the passport office (it was certified, but old (like me)) because the old brown ink was really hard to read. I no longer live anywhere near "the region." I had to get my birth certificate and pronto, because I was slated to leave for Korea within two months. What did I do? Called the records office and asked them how I should do it, and what it required. So, I filled out my request for 2 certified copies, put the request and the payment in the mail and BOOM, two weeks later I had 2 copies of my birth certificate. Really not difficult and I didn't have to appear anywhere in person. Again, this is merely to point out that if you really want something, you do what it takes to satisfy the requirements. The day in which a person is supposed to vote, or the voter registration deadlines are no big secret. Get your shit in order ahead of time and you won't be "disenfranchised."
 

jaxhawksfan

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A friend of mine told me today his daughter could not get her drivers license last week because he didn't have her original social security card.



I know the law changed here in FL back in 2010 so I just looked up what is required for a Driver's License or ID card:



1. Proof of who you are. Birth Certificate or US Passport (for US Citizens)

2. Proof of your social security number. Original card, W-2, 1099, or pay stub.

3. Proof of your address. 2 different forms. Voter registration, Mortgage coupons, W-2, Car insurance, Current utility bill, Home insurance, etc....



People have been bitching about this since the law change. I don't see anything on the list which is out of line IMO other than proving your ssn. I don't think a ssn has anything to do with a driver's license or ID card. If and ID is to prove who you are, and where you live, then you should have to prove that to the agency that provides the ID. Pretty simple really.
 

Tater

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Thanks. It was an honest question and you answered it. They wouldn't accept the copy of my birth certificate at the passport office (it was certified, but old (like me)) because the old brown ink was really hard to read. I no longer live anywhere near "the region." I had to get my birth certificate and pronto, because I was slated to leave for Korea within two months. What did I do? Called the records office and asked them how I should do it, and what it required. So, I filled out my request for 2 certified copies, put the request and the payment in the mail and BOOM, two weeks later I had 2 copies of my birth certificate. Really not difficult and I didn't have to appear anywhere in person. Again, this is merely to point out that if you really want something, you do what it takes to satisfy the requirements. The day in which a person is supposed to vote, or the voter registration deadlines are no big secret. Get your shit in order ahead of time and you won't be "disenfranchised."



That's just about enough common sense out of you mister. There's no place for that in a political discussion.
 

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I know the law changed here in FL back in 2010 so I just looked up what is required for a Driver's License or ID card:



1. Proof of who you are. Birth Certificate or US Passport (for US Citizens)

2. Proof of your social security number. Original card, W-2, 1099, or pay stub.

3. Proof of your address. 2 different forms. Voter registration, Mortgage coupons, W-2, Car insurance, Current utility bill, Home insurance, etc....



People have been bitching about this since the law change. I don't see anything on the list which is out of line IMO other than proving your ssn. I don't think a ssn has anything to do with a driver's license or ID card. If and ID is to prove who you are, and where you live, then you should have to prove that to the agency that provides the ID. Pretty simple really.

That's about what Oregon requires. The thing I can see is that the information does have to be processed by a person, and while the laws are pretty much black and white, the interpretation of said laws are up to the biases of the people receiving said documents.



My Illinois birth certificate is a simple copy of a piece of paper with a notary seal on it. It does raise eyebrows around here especially since Oregon and Washington's certificates look like a freaking merit award with all the glitz and glamour on it (Hell, My wife's Slovak BC looks the same with a hologram on it). If the county clerk or DOL clerk had a wild hair up their asses, they could have claimed that my official BC, being so freaking cheap looking, was not acceptable. Regardless of the law, you can get a clerk who hasn't been laid since the bicentennial, and chooses to jam you up.Doubly, if the clerk is a racist fucktard.
 

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