Montero DFA'd, welcome to the bigs Caritini!

[Gustavus Adolphus]

We're turning into the Knicks.

Well this is a dumb comment.

 

[CSF77]

Miggy with catch on with some one.

What I noticed this season is Miggy connected with Lackey the best. Kyle and Jake pitched worse. Contreras had them goto their curves more. Add to it teams respected Contreras's throws.

What I'm concerned the most with is game calling and pitch sequencing. That part Wilson is behind in. He was a converted 3B so that is something that takes years to build.

Now I'm not sure how they will approach Catrini right now. Maybe have him catch sides and BP catch the pen to get used to the staff while PH. I expect them easing him in vs letting him just catch a game untested.

 

[brett05]

I'm pretty confident the cubs will at least get a PTBNL type prospect for him. Miggy's problem was he's pissed he doesn't play as the #1 catcher. There's enough bad catchers out there with the way he's hitting he'll start for someone perhaps even a playoff contender.

For a guy that can't throw? No playoff team is going to jeopardize their standing for that.

 

[beckdawg]

For a guy that can't throw? No playoff team is going to jeopardize their standing for that.

Arizona's C are hitting .206/.266/.441 this year. They are 1.5 back on the dodgers. Montero is hitting .286/.366/.439. Montero also is a good framer. So sure you're not going to get a team to give you a top 100 prospect but the cubs got a AAA reliever for Rosscup who has been hurt for most of the past 2 years. And it's not just Arizona. There's a lot of teams who have underwhelming production out of their C.

 

[anotheridiot]

Carantini is no more than Schwarber is behind the plate. Huge work in progress.

Montero threw out 40% of base runners in 2011. So its all age. 31-31 with three pitchers is not all on Jake.

They should have cut ties last year after the outbursts. Look what I did, but go to its not my fault.

 

[brett05]

Arizona's C are hitting .206/.266/.441 this year. They are 1.5 back on the dodgers. Montero is hitting .286/.366/.439. Montero also is a good framer. So sure you're not going to get a team to give you a top 100 prospect but the cubs got a AAA reliever for Rosscup who has been hurt for most of the past 2 years. And it's not just Arizona. There's a lot of teams who have underwhelming production out of their C.

Montero is the worst catcher in the league this year with his ability to throw. And he'd bottom third in framing this year. His only value is a bat and a change behind the plate can do way more harm than good. Add in that Montero is a malcontent and I am sorry. He's out of a job for this year.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

I think you over estimate the catching market and underestimate Monetero's value. He sucks at throwing guys out, but have him catch a lefty or someone who is great at holding runners and his deficiencies become moot.

 

[brett05]

Thats just because Carantini hasn't played yet and the alleged CCS 'Schwarber catcher rotation' is currently in a van with Terrance Mann heading to Iowa.

Nice Field of Dreams reference.

:clap:

 

[beckdawg]

Montero is the worst catcher in the league this year with his ability to throw. And he'd bottom third in framing this year. His only value is a bat and a change behind the plate can do way more harm than good. Add in that Montero is a malcontent and I am sorry. He's out of a job for this year.

He's only a malcontent when he's not playing as far as I'm aware. I haven't heard anything really negative about him in reference to the club house. My read on the situation is this recent blow up is just carry over from his frustration from last year's playoffs and Maddon not using him. As for his defense, you don't just forget how to frame. I believe he was the highest rated framer last year and if not he was top 10. As for throwing, the cubs have 2 of the worst pitchers. He wasn't wrong about Arrieta. He's always been poor at holding runners. And Lester obviously has his issues. But honestly Lester's issue sort of prove the point that holding base runners in modern baseball is no where near as big a deal as people make of it. Fangraphs actually talks about this. Even if Montero had MLB average pop times it wouldn't have mattered.

So disagree if you like but league average for C is .247/.315/.409. Montero hitting .286/.366/.439 and being a left handed platoon option is going to entice someone. I'm confident the cubs will get a no name prospect for him if they eat a little of his remaining money. But even if they don't someone will pick him up. I mean for god sake
Derek Norris was picked up and he's hitting .201/.258/.380 and is right handed. Stephen Vogt was picked up and he is hitting .217/.285/.354

 

[brett05]

I think you over estimate the catching market and underestimate Monetero's value. He sucks at throwing guys out, but have him catch a lefty or someone who is great at holding runners and his deficiencies become moot.

Yes, its enlightening to learn from the CCS Intelligentsia that a left-handed catcher with a .286/.366/.439 slashline has no place in today's MLB world. I'm glad this group is staying on top of baseball trends and are ahead of the curve.

He's only a malcontent when he's not playing as far as I'm aware. I haven't heard anything really negative about him in reference to the club house. My read on the situation is this recent blow up is just carry over from his frustration from last year's playoffs and Maddon not using him. As for his defense, you don't just forget how to frame. I believe he was the highest rated framer last year and if not he was top 10. As for throwing, the cubs have 2 of the worst pitchers. He wasn't wrong about Arrieta. He's always been poor at holding runners. And Lester obviously has his issues. But honestly Lester's issue sort of prove the point that holding base runners in modern baseball is no where near as big a deal as people make of it. Fangraphs actually talks about this. Even if Montero had MLB average pop times it wouldn't have mattered.

So disagree if you like but league average for C is .247/.315/.409. Montero hitting .286/.366/.439 and being a left handed platoon option is going to entice someone. I'm confident the cubs will get a no name prospect for him if they eat a little of his remaining money. But even if they don't someone will pick him up. I mean ...
Derek Norris was picked up and he's hitting .201/.258/.380 and is right handed. Stephen Vogt was picked up and he is hitting .217/.285/.354

Catchers are rarely traded during the season or changes made, especially for playoff teams. The chemistry needs to be there for pitcher and catcher.
Now you have Montero who is awful with his arm vs Contreras who is 8th in the league with the same staff sans specialized personal catching.
On top of that you have a guy that at least twice publicly is not a team player. Just way too much of a risk the way I see it. Time will tell.

Next year he gets his shot, but this year? I just don't see the scenario. It would have to be a major injury.

 

[JP Hochbaum]

Catchers are rarely traded during the season or changes made, especially for playoff teams.

This thread is literally about a playoff team doing just that and its not anecdotal or an anomaly as Lucroy was traded mid season just last year.

 

[Diehardfan]

A contender will pick him up for the stretch....he still has short term value.

 

[brett05]

This thread is literally about a playoff team doing just that and its not anecdotal or an anomaly as Lucroy was traded mid season just last year.

And never was Miguel in Lucroy's class. So that's not an apples for apples is it? Like I said, RARELY

 

[CSF77]

Good write up. Jake is plain crummy at this:

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/lets-do-the-math-on-miguel-montero-and-jake-arrieta/

 

[TL1961]

And never was Miguel in Lucroy's class. So that's not an apples for apples is it? Like I said, RARELY

You said catchers rately get traded. Catchers. Not "catchers who aren't Lucroy".

 

[brett05]

You said catchers rately get traded. Catchers. Not "catchers who aren't Lucroy".

I would think at your age you'd have learned the English word "rarely."

 

[JP Hochbaum]

I think it is more accurate to say position players rarely get traded, not just catchers. There were two traded last year and by doing some quick searches it seemed similar amounts for other positions.

 

[brett05]

I think it is more accurate to say position players rarely get traded, not just catchers. There were two traded last year and by doing some quick searches it seemed similar amounts for other positions.

Position players get traded more frequently at positions other than catcher. Why? It's the rapport that is needed between catcher and pitcher. Proof of that is with some pitchers having a personal catcher.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Position players get traded more frequently at positions other than catcher. Why? It's the rapport that is needed between catcher and pitcher. Proof of that is with some pitchers having a personal catcher.

The point is though that with Montero a team picking him up is assuming very limited risk, the prorated minimum, and the idea that he could help with his bat particularly on an AL team that could DH him. I don't expect him to be an everyday player but he can still block balls and might have something in the bat. I remain steadfast in my belief that he is signed within a few days of clearing waivers.

 

[brett05]

The point is though that with Montero a team picking him up is assuming very limited risk, the prorated minimum, and the idea that he could help with his bat particularly on an AL team that could DH him. I don't expect him to be an everyday player but he can still block balls and might have something in the bat. I remain steadfast in my belief that he is signed within a few days of clearing waivers.

No one is saying to themselves, man I need a catcher that can block pitches better than what we have. Certainly not a contending team as if that was truly an issue they'd not be contenders.

Chicago Media yesterday basically said he's a wait til next year candidate so I am not alone in this opinion.

It's just not enough bat for a Contending team to risk it. But like I said, time will tell.