Offseason rumors/discussion thread

[CSF77]

Sorry but I don't see the point in paying a pinch runner $6 mil or whatever he's going to make. The cubs don't even attempt to steal often anyways. While I view that as a flaw, they may not based on their internal analytics.

I see it as a flaw also. Now Gore was a weapon late season and I feel that that is a missing component. Gore is a negative value defender so you can't even use him as a PR/D replacement. He becomes 2 roster spots wasted.

So at least if you PR for Schwarber in the 8th you gain D on the flip. is 6M worth it? Well we don't know what he will get or Russell will get in arb. I'm pretty sure both of their raises will be min. Cots tends to inflate.

But as a line up with him in it:

Zorbrist
Bryant
Rizzo
Baez
Schwarber
Contreras
Heyward
pitcher
Billy

That way you are min his lacking OBA but you take advantage of his speed. Which could mean leading off after the pitcher makes the last out the inning before and just bunting/slapping over the pulled in D.

I would keep his BA's down in general but Almora is a excellent PH so he becomes a impact contact bat later game on those games.

I do feel it is a reach myself. And he is far from ideal but over all he fills a need and to be honest speed is a factor in today's game that is missing in general which makes it desirable.

 

[CSF77]

Didn't really see any decent FA backup Catchers on the list that had good offensive numbers

should flip Russell to Japan for Yu's personal catcher...

 

[beckdawg]

Didn't really see any decent FA backup Catchers on the list that had good offensive numbers

Doesn't really need to be a FA catcher though. I mean I honestly doubt you're going to get someone who hits and is good defensively. If you find someone who is they will be starting for some team next year. C is super thin. But you can find someone who's not really a good hitter but is still really good defensively. Just as an example off the top of my head, Martin Maldinado I believe is a FA and he was up there in framing stats.

 

[RacerX]

Rondon had velocity and a decent slider but his fastball had a Farnsworth-like lack of movement, and when he left it in the zone it'd get hammered.

Please do not speak its name again.

 

[anotheridiot]

Please do not speak its name again.

I could watch that take down against Cincinatti for hours.

 

[CSF77]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owYy3GUjnik&feature=share

 

[beckdawg]

Houston declined their option on Brian McCann which isn't totally surprising but makes him a FA. I'm not sure he would be my first choice but he does bat lefty and he would be pretty damn cheap you have to imagine at 35 next year after hitting .212/.301/.339. He did hit .241/.323/.436 in 2017 so he's not *that* far removed from having a good year.

He's not quite the framer I would want out of a back up catcher. He was 100th best based on BP's rankings out of 117. I believe I've read he's a good club house guy as well.

 

[CSF77]

Houston declined their option on Brian McCann which isn't totally surprising but makes him a FA. I'm not sure he would be my first choice but he does bat lefty and he would be pretty damn cheap you have to imagine at 35 next year after hitting .212/.301/.339. He did hit .241/.323/.436 in 2017 so he's not *that* far removed from having a good year.

He's not quite the framer I would want out of a back up catcher. He was 100th best based on BP's rankings out of 117. I believe I've read he's a good club house guy as well.

Cubs picked up that lefty pen arm off of Toronto and pulled Q’s opt. Kintzler pulled his 5M after the Cubs declined their 10M.

Yangervis Solarte Was declined but has a Arb opt still and expected is 5.9M. He may go back to the Padre’s at 3B but that is early speculation. But he fills the same role Baez did and is interesting if the Cubs deal Russell

 

[anotheridiot]

Houston declined their option on Brian McCann which isn't totally surprising but makes him a FA. I'm not sure he would be my first choice but he does bat lefty and he would be pretty damn cheap you have to imagine at 35 next year after hitting .212/.301/.339. He did hit .241/.323/.436 in 2017 so he's not *that* far removed from having a good year.

He's not quite the framer I would want out of a back up catcher. He was 100th best based on BP's rankings out of 117. I believe I've read he's a good club house guy as well.

You gotta figure they need to get into locking up Altuve, Correa, Springer, getting into that boat the cubs are in. Right against the cap with a core to lock up. Not an expert on anything of course not the Houston Payroll, but the way they went from WS 2005 to rebuild makes them a place that hass little experience at luxury spending.

 

[CSF77]

Houston declined their option on Brian McCann which isn't totally surprising but makes him a FA. I'm not sure he would be my first choice but he does bat lefty and he would be pretty damn cheap you have to imagine at 35 next year after hitting .212/.301/.339. He did hit .241/.323/.436 in 2017 so he's not *that* far removed from having a good year.

He's not quite the framer I would want out of a back up catcher. He was 100th best based on BP's rankings out of 117. I believe I've read he's a good club house guy as well.

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/sortable/index.php?cid=1899425

That is the arguement for Grendel. Top framer in the game.
Suzuki bottom 10. Contreras 2nd to last framer.

Ya know I’m not sure what to make of this myself. This is a area that could be majorly improved with Grendel. Push Contreras to RF and Heyward into a CF platoon with Almora. That point I would let Davis back up. Kid can hit and his limit palette ranks in the 30’s as framers. Not to mention is likable as a player.

 

[beckdawg]

That is the arguement for Grendel.

That really doesn't make sense. You're effectively making him your every day starting C then. Sure you're saying play Contreras in the outfield I'm assuming in some sort of rotation rather than an actual every day OF but that ignores the fact he wasn't a good defender in LF and you're now putting him in RF. In 218 innings in LF he was -21.4 UZR/150. People freak out about Schwarber's defense in LF and he was a 8.8 UZR/150 in 2017 with 14.0 this year. Effectively that's saying Contreras is -2 wins just on his defense alone as 10 runs = 1 win in WAR calculations. And again... that's LF not RF which theoretically should be worse.

I don't know how to say this in a more polite way but that idea isn't happening. They aren't going to play Contreras in LF either. The only way any of that makes sense is to trade Contreras which would be dumb IMO.

 

[CSF77]

That really doesn't make sense. You're effectively making him your every day starting C then. Sure you're saying play Contreras in the outfield I'm assuming in some sort of rotation rather than an actual every day OF but that ignores the fact he wasn't a good defender in LF and you're now putting him in RF. In 218 innings in LF he was -21.4 UZR/150. People freak out about Schwarber's defense in LF and he was a 8.8 UZR/150 in 2017 with 14.0 this year. Effectively that's saying Contreras is -2 wins just on his defense alone as 10 runs = 1 win in WAR calculations. And again... that's LF not RF which theoretically should be worse.

I don't know how to say this in a more polite way but that idea isn't happening. They aren't going to play Contreras in LF either. The only way any of that makes sense is to trade Contreras which would be dumb IMO.

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/...g-yarn-removing-the-mask-encore-presentation/

Interesting. It goes into the catchers helmet being a major indicator of a catchers framing. If he can keep it stable he tends to get more calls. If his head follows the pitch he gets less.

I really didn't look too deep into Contreras because 218 innings is a small sample size and minor league is not measured. In general it really comes down to tool set and ability to learn and quality of the teachers. Speed and arm are good enough and he has quick first twitch shown as a catcher. So the tool set is there. The bat justifies it also.

IMO it comes down to league worst to league best framer. It it worth switching out? As far as the collateral...well Schwarber is pretty good now. So it is a possibility and Wilson is far more athletic.

IMO honestly not a thing that you do on a contender but with Joe managing this is exactly the stuff that happens so there is that part.

 

[beckdawg]

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/...g-yarn-removing-the-mask-encore-presentation/

Interesting. It goes into the catchers helmet being a major indicator of a catchers framing. If he can keep it stable he tends to get more calls. If his head follows the pitch he gets less.

I really didn't look too deep into Contreras because 218 innings is a small sample size and minor league is not measured. In general it really comes down to tool set and ability to learn and quality of the teachers. Speed and arm are good enough and he has quick first twitch shown as a catcher. So the tool set is there. The bat justifies it also.

IMO it comes down to league worst to league best framer. It it worth switching out? As far as the collateral...well Schwarber is pretty good now. So it is a possibility and Wilson is far more athletic.

IMO honestly not a thing that you do on a contender but with Joe managing this is exactly the stuff that happens so there is that part.

He's far more likely to just improve his framing than he is to suddenly become a good RFer because you want to sign Grendel.

 

[anotheridiot]

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/...g-yarn-removing-the-mask-encore-presentation/

Interesting. It goes into the catchers helmet being a major indicator of a catchers framing. If he can keep it stable he tends to get more calls. If his head follows the pitch he gets less.

I really didn't look too deep into Contreras because 218 innings is a small sample size and minor league is not measured. In general it really comes down to tool set and ability to learn and quality of the teachers. Speed and arm are good enough and he has quick first twitch shown as a catcher. So the tool set is there. The bat justifies it also.

IMO it comes down to league worst to league best framer. It it worth switching out? As far as the collateral...well Schwarber is pretty good now. So it is a possibility and Wilson is far more athletic.

IMO honestly not a thing that you do on a contender but with Joe managing this is exactly the stuff that happens so there is that part.

Nobody ever puts the other side of the equation in their equations. If Cub pitchers can stay an inch or two off the plate, I am sure Contrares would be a better framer. If you got Lester staring a hole thru the umpire because he wants a pitch 4 inches off the plate to be called a strike, there is nothing Willson can do to steal pitches for him.

We watched, I thought it was Pittsburgs catchers, maybe it was Milwaukees before they got the old man. Taking the ball from the edge and pulling it all the way to the middle of the plate. To me, thats a terrible framer, not second to last. At least Willson sticks it to the corners, he is just still outside the corner.

Me, I cant wait til they come up with the electronic strike zone and puts this framing shit to sleep for ever.

I was watching Tedy Bruski this morning on sportscenter. He was showing film on Aaron Donald, and how quick he gets to the QB. He explained that all the NFL players have chips embedded in their shoulder pads and that is what is driving these stat numbers. A chip in the belt buckle and at the knees, its done.

 

[CSF77]

Nobody ever puts the other side of the equation in their equations. If Cub pitchers can stay an inch or two off the plate, I am sure Contrares would be a better framer. If you got Lester staring a hole thru the umpire because he wants a pitch 4 inches off the plate to be called a strike, there is nothing Willson can do to steal pitches for him.

We watched, I thought it was Pittsburgs catchers, taking the ball from the edge and pulling it all the way to the middle of the plate. To me, thats a terrible framer, not second to last. At least Willson sticks it to the corners, he is just still outside the corner.

Me, I cant wait til they come up with the electronic strike zone and puts this framing shit to sleep for ever.

I was watching Tedy Bruski this morning on sportscenter. He was showing film on Aaron Donald, and how quick he gets to the QB. He explained that all the NFL players have chips embedded in their shoulder pads and that is what is driving these stat numbers. A chip in the belt buckle and at the knees, its done.

That is not being real. The data shows that the better framers tend to not move their helmets with the pitch. They are able to follow with their eyes vs their whole head. That is honestly a huge deal on retraining a basic instinct when tracking a incoming missile.

Pitches move. If they were stationary then they wouldn't make it to this level. Might as well put the ball on a tee then.

So this goes for Beck also. There is a reason why some catchers never improve their framing. This is a basic reaction and how they are wired.

 

[DanTown]

That is not being real. The data shows that the better framers tend to not move their helmets with the pitch. They are able to follow with their eyes vs their whole head. That is honestly a huge deal on retraining a basic instinct when tracking a incoming missile.

Pitches move. If they were stationary then they wouldn't make it to this level. Might as well put the ball on a tee then.

So this goes for Beck also. There is a reason why some catchers never improve their framing. This is a basic reaction and how they are wired.

Fangraphs DEF runs above average (it is a counting stat)

Willson Contreras +14.5 in 1109 innings
Yasamin Grandal +8.9 in 1037 innings

Look, I understand framing is important but you have to view framing as a part of catching and is not the end all stat for catcher defense. If Grandal comes cheap, he makes some sense as a platoon but that is literally not going to happen considering the lack of catchers who can play as many innings as Grandal and be a not negative player.

 

[CSF77]

Fangraphs DEF runs above average (it is a counting stat)

Willson Contreras +14.5 in 1109 innings
Yasamin Grandal +8.9 in 1037 innings

Look, I understand framing is important but you have to view framing as a part of catching and is not the end all stat for catcher defense. If Grandal comes cheap, he makes some sense as a platoon but that is literally not going to happen considering the lack of catchers who can play as many innings as Grandal and be a not negative player.

I’m concerned with Grendel’s blocking ability. Keeping a stable head could create blind spots low. But this is the same guy that has caught Kershaw so he doesn’t suck and catching breaking pitches

 

[chibears55]

https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/1058186690743934976?s=19

My guess of players they could move to clear salary

Chatwood Smyley Kintzler Duensing Heyward Zobrist

 

[TL1961]

For three years some knucklehea dhere keeps suggesting Schwarber go back to catching, and now we're removing Contreras entirely from the catcher rotation? Carrying him as an OF and two catchers. No way that works.

You could rotate Grandal and Contreras and get Contreras' bat in the lineup by including him in a LF rotation from time to time while Grandal plays. But he is no RF.

I am confident his bat is far better than what we saw last year. I don't know what caused the drop off, but we have seen that he is capable of ar more than what 2018 brought us. At least he/we better hope so.

 

[CSF77]

https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/1058186690743934976?s=19

My guess of players they could move to clear salary

Chatwood Smyley Kintzler Duensing Heyward Zobrist

If they are worried about clearing for 20M no way in hell they sign Manny etc.

The snart move is to axe Russell. Not offer Arb you save a chunk. Chatwood is another one that should be a prime trade.