Offseason thread

CSF77

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The disappointing thing to me about hoerner isn't that he doesn't hit homers. It's that he doesn't really hit for extra bases which you would kind of expect with his plus speed. A career .103 ISO isn't really cutting it in my eyes. Not saying he has to be a .200 iso guy but i'd like to at least see .150 because his profile really limits his value as a hitter since he's also below average in terms of walks.

If he was closer to .400 OBA vs .335 I would be willing to accept him more. Right now he is a over rated UI.

For him to have value he has to hit over .300 because of a low BB rate.


If Jed got some balls and shocked the market by signing Bergman and putting Hoerner as the UI and give Shaw the keys to 2B I would be 100% on board with it. Fak payroll issues and profit margins. Win games and endorcements and Marquis subs increase because the Cubs are back in business.

Cubs are not small market. Just small minded.
 
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CSF77

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The thing is Chicago is ripe for picking. The bears suck ass. The bulls are a joke. Blackhawks are even pathetic. The White Sox are the White Sox.

When you have the third largest city and a top five fan base.

With the ability to take over the complete market because every other sports franchise is unwatchable.

You grab the bull by the horns you don't act like a bunch of bitches. Until Tom decides to do this or sells to somebody that's willing to do this this team is never going to be a top tier team. Which it really could be as everything is right for it
 

TL1961

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I have expected Hoerner to hit for more power as he matured a bit but it hasn’t happened.

Like Beckdawg said, it’s not about home runs but more extra base hits.

He’s a gold glove winner and very good on the bases. But unless the oba and ops go up, we’re not getting enough out of that position.
 

CSF77

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So now peeps on Bergman outside chance

Like I said. If Tom wants to push the subs on Marquis sign him and watch the subs go up this year.

You have to think big. That is why the Dodgers and the Yankees go over because they know that winning increases revenue. Losing decreases.

It is a simple thing. Make it and they will come.
 

CSF77

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I have expected Hoerner to hit for more power as he matured a bit but it hasn’t happened.

Like Beckdawg said, it’s not about home runs but more extra base hits.

He’s a gold glove winner and very good on the bases. But unless the oba and ops go up, we’re not getting enough out of that position.
To be fair last year was a issue with his hand for most of the year.

But his lack of taking his walks is his weakness.

If he was in the .380+ with his D value he would be sitting on 5 WAR and a 30M AAV talent.

Right now he is a 3 heavily supported by D value. They have that with Swanson already. 4 WAR and most of it is glove

If they had 2-3 30HR hitters then they could have 3 D heavy valued players. IE Nico, Swanson and PCA. Out of the 3 Nico brings in the least value in D. The other 2 should give a floor of 3-4 WAR based off their glove. Add to it the majority of hitters are RH SS by nature is a more valuable position for D. 2B is not and sacrificing O is not a smart call.

This is why I would be behind signing Bergman and trading Nico for payroll relief. The team only has 1 guy that you can say 30 HR right now. The rest are not proven 30 HR hitters. Adding Bergman changes the line up dynamic drastically.
 

CSF77

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Want to say, missed a bullet here. KBO is just not the same and the Giants found it out the hard way
 

CSF77

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So Jack Flaherty is looking at 115M over 5 years. 23AAV and fits into budget.

Over all he seems like a solid investment. His market is being held up by Sasaki as the Giants and the Cubs are in both markets.

Part of me wants Sasaki to run his 2nd round cuts soon.
 

TL1961

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Sasaki’s decision will come between jan 15 and Jan 24.

Not sure if cuts before that.
 

CSF77

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Sasaki’s decision will come between jan 15 and Jan 24.

Not sure if cuts before that.

Most feel 72hrs past the 15th. He was waiting for the 2025 pool to refill.

Few things on this

If he was 100% Dodgers it was pointless to wait as the Dodgers had the largest pool prior to the 15th.

I have thought about it a bit. Sasaki is a bit of a gamble on health and durability going in.

If it was not about the cash. Flaherty is a far safer bet to get you 180 IP and a quality underline. Sasaki you are looking at a high top end but running into the common 1 per week pitcher going into a 5 day routine.

Then you look at Taillon and Shota they both benefited from park conditions causing many fly balls to die out at the track.

So really thinking about it I kinda want a more stable solution going in. It is not as shiny. But out of a starter being on the mound every 5th is more important.
 

CSF77

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I know you don't care for Jack, Knox. But 3.63ERA, 3.91FIP, 1.2 HR/9, 3.2 BB/9, 10.2 SO/9

829 IP on his arm

Steele has 484 IP on his arm.
3.24 ERA 3.42 FIP, 0.9 HR/9, 2.8 BB/9, 9.2 SO/9

They are in the same ball park for talent. I for one would be fine with Justin and Jack as my 1-2 going into opening day.

Sasaki is a lotto ticket. And most pitchers that come over run into innings issues. Shota was a outlier vs a standard.
 

CSF77

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Yamamoto 90 IP
Senga 166 IP then pitched 1 game last year
Othani 51IP then didn't pitch again until 2021.
DiceK pitched 2 years and fell off the wagon.

Tanaka was solid for his run. Nomo was the best in durability. Darvish injured 2 times but over all a solid career

There is a real reason to be concerned. Sure he is not making anything but what is Jed going to spend it on? Other than roster investments?

I don't see them in on Bergman other than kicking the tires. Jack but they will take the cheapest option. In on Mocena but he should get less than 5M on the market

I look at it as Jed saved in RF and got better for less. But where is that going to? I don't see it
 

CSF77

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Giants To Sign Justin Verlander

Mmm that was unexpected. That most likely takes them out of the Flarhaty running. They were the least likely Sasaki suiter.

Good for them. They are taking the bull by the horns.
 

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I know you don't care for Jack, Knox. But 3.63ERA, 3.91FIP, 1.2 HR/9, 3.2 BB/9, 10.2 SO/9

829 IP on his arm

Steele has 484 IP on his arm.
3.24 ERA 3.42 FIP, 0.9 HR/9, 2.8 BB/9, 9.2 SO/9

They are in the same ball park for talent. I for one would be fine with Justin and Jack as my 1-2 going into opening day.

Sasaki is a lotto ticket. And most pitchers that come over run into innings issues. Shota was a outlier vs a standard.
i just dont see why it makes sense to over pay for Flaherty if Sasaki is an option for less money and sasaki has the higher ceiling.

cubs have plenty of mediocre inning filler arms they can use if sasaki gets hurt.

now, that said...i have no clue if sasaki wants to play for the cubs or not...but also dont know if flaherty wants to either
 

CSF77

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i just dont see why it makes sense to over pay for Flaherty if Sasaki is an option for less money and sasaki has the higher ceiling.

cubs have plenty of mediocre inning filler arms they can use if sasaki gets hurt.

now, that said...i have no clue if sasaki wants to play for the cubs or not...but also dont know if flaherty wants to either

I totally get that argument.

But I feel that they need a guy to slot between Justin and Shota. Jack has been that guy.

Sasaki most likely is not going to be a Cub. To me this is Jed holding out for the cheap option.

SFG kinda knew what was up and moved on. Buster IMO has been pretty impressive to date. He did not give in to Boras on a option filled deal for Burnes. So instead he took a 1 year on Verlander.

I do like that approach as it is aggressive.

Jed took that approach with Tucker. The fact that he is pussy footing the rest of the off-season sucks. It just feels like it was a save my Job move and ownership got a discount on it making them happy.

Waiting for Sasaki would make sense if they are the clear favorite. They are not. So all this is is Jed waiting for the cheap date and getting stood up while the field gets thin.
 

CSF77

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Anyways his market should be at 5/115. That is 23M AAV. The market for aces is 35M. He should be getting a deal like the Cubs gave to Darvish. Which is #2-3 market value.

By the numbers he is a 2-3 pitcher. A ace on some crappy teams.

I expect regression from Shota and Taillon.their splits were showing a clear home field cooking. So neither should be sitting on ERA below 3.50.

So in view of that you want a sure thing. Not a experiment or a waiting game. Or a pitcher that has never pitched a full season or even a season

Just the way I feel. The rotation should be suspect going into 2025. Justin was the only one who pitched better on the road than at home. Shota is to a lesser degree. Taillon and Assad would have been 4-5 ERA pitchers if Wrigley played neutral
 

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