Sweet Spot Blog: Who's better: White Sox versus Cubs

Parade_Rain

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Uh yes, I said a push was a tie, and you said I didn't know what a push was. :dunno: YOU said you would have "pushed" on Abreu/Rizzo. Therefore you would have taken 'no action' based on your logic. In the context of the article, the author said it was a 'coin flip', meaning one could easily pick either way.

He chose Rizzo on the premise that the Cubs division was more difficult. I disagreed, and chose Abreu based on his performance last year. Both myself and the author chose different sides of the 'coin'. You however, stated you would have 'pushed', or taken 'no action'.

This seemed 'peculiar' to me as it was out of context for the article, to actually take an 'action', or choice, as to who has an edge, no matter the quality of the article. It seems to me that your logic is flawed in this debate, and you are now somewhat backtracking. :tongue:
I haven't backtracked 1 bit. You claimed that the author knew what a push was. If that's the case, the author wouldn't have chosen a side. It's a tie, so yes. You do not know what a push is. Well, you know what a push is, you just can't seem to leave it at that.

Many authors find areas where teams are even and give an even or undecided score. They place teams ahead where they have an advantage.

The Cubs have an advantage in the dugout. Better manager and better bench so far. I would still wait to write this until the rosters are set.
 
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Jntg4

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Uh, back to the article, and talking baseball..... I thought his comparison of Eaton vs Fowler was pretty good. Let's examine their stats from last year:

Eaton

YearTeamGABRHHRRBIBBSOSBCSOBPSLGAVG
2014CHW123486761461354383159.362.401.300

Fowler

YearTeamGABRHHRRBIBBSOSBCSOBPSLGAVG
2014HOU1164346112083566108114.375.399.276

Their stats are really fairly close. They've both lost some games due to injury. Eaton was better defensively and Fowler had more power. The author went with Eatons defense giving him the edge. Myself, I'm going with Fowler as he has more experience, and the better career OBP (366 vs 350).

Wouldn't say Fowler had more power, the stats you posted show a higher SLG for Eaton.
 

Parade_Rain

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The Sox will likely fare better this season as most of their players are well developed and you know what to expect. With the Cubs we have to rely on a lot of what if's, granted they are high potential what if's. A Cub fan should be happy with a 75 win season and seeing players up here playing and getting better, but obviously it is also time to expect more.

Just look at expectations. If the Sox are at 75 wins it will be a major disappointment, if the Cubs get 75 wins it will be disappointing but also more reasonable to expect.
The Cubs got to 73 wins last season. Now they added Lester and Fowler and Bryant is coming up. Soler has MLB experience now. Rizzo and Castro actually don't need to be the entire offensive production this season. Alcantara is a supersub and a better defensive player than what they had in Valbuena. They signed one of the best managers in baseball. 75 wins is not a reasonable expectation. 80-81 is a more than reasonable expectation, imho.
 

JP Hochbaum

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The Cubs got to 73 wins last season. Now they added Lester and Fowler and Bryant is coming up. Soler has MLB experience now. Rizzo and Castro actually don't need to be the entire offensive production this season. Alcantara is a supersub and a better defensive player than what they had in Valbuena. They signed one of the best managers in baseball. 75 wins is not a reasonable expectation. 80-81 is a more than reasonable expectation, imho.

Oh yeah I agree, I was just saying that if we had 75 wins and the Sox had 75, the White Sox season would be a lot more disappointing than the Cubs 75 season would be. Sox should be disappointed with anything less than a playoff berth in their division. we should just expect something around .500 as that would be an added bonus to just seeing the kids getting time and improving.
 

Bear Pride

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Wouldn't say Fowler had more power, the stats you posted show a higher SLG for Eaton.

Good point, albeit by two points only. Lots of things to look at here. I suppose I was looking at the HR's mostly. A higher SLG would suggest more extra base hits for Eaton, but less HR's. Again, only two points higher. Although, Fowler has the better career SLG (419 vs 390).

Minute maid is pretty short down the lines which could help Fowler's HR total, but the wind in Wrigley could also help his HR total when blowing out, who knows. Conversely, Fowler will have a much shorter CF defensively, which could help him, again, who knows. Interestingly, Fowler has the better career FLD%.

The stats are still pretty similar either way you look at it. I will still give Fowler the edge for being a SH, a better career OBP, and 7 years to 3 years experience.

EDIT to add:

Looking at the extra base hits for last year, Eaton had 26 2B and 10 3B, while Fowler had 21 2B and 4 3B. Eaton had 52 more AB's. I suppose you could argue it either way, Fowler has more power, or he played in a shorter park (down the lines). Again, very similar stats.

To me, OBP is the single most important stat for improvement for the Cubs, and is why I give the edge to the Cubs here cuz of Fowler having the better career OBP.

For instance, the Cubs were 5th in the MLB in HR's, but 3rd from the last in OBP (w/o Fowler). This is the single best stat that will translate to more runs, and ultimately more wins for the Cubs.

In contrast, the Sox were 9th in the MLB in HR's, and 20th in OBP (with Eaton). I'm thinking Melky's OBP can help the Sox here as well.
 

Bear Pride

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This might be a good segue into the LF position .........

While I certainly won't try to give the Cubs any edge here, I do think Coghlan had a pretty good year for the Cubs. Looking at the stats, they are fairly similar as well. Who knows if Denorfia brings anything to the table in LF for the Cubs.

Furthermore, who knows if Bryant ultimately switches to LF if Russell forces the switch by being ready sooner than later. That could make this a different scenario altogether.

I still think OBP is an extremely important stat to have at the top of the order. Imo, it looks like both teams could have a decent 1-2 punch at the top of the order, which translates to runs with the meat coming up.

Cabrera

YearTeamGABRHHRRBIBBSOSBCSOBPSLGAVG
2014TOR139568811711673436762.351.458.301

Coghlan

YearTeamGABRHHRRBIBBSOSBCSOBPSLGAVG
2014CHC12538550109941398174.352.452.283
 

2323

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Yawn. Don't give a f*ck about the sox.
 

Parade_Rain

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I don't care for the Sox either, but you don't think it's fun that fans on both boards have problems figuring out where one team might be better than the other? Good baseball could be played at both parks this season. That should be exciting.
 

2323

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I don't care for the Sox either, but you don't think it's fun that fans on both boards have problems figuring out where one team might be better than the other? Good baseball could be played at both parks this season. That should be exciting.

I don't find it interesting at all. Liking the Cubs somehow implies you should also give a shit about the sox? Why? It's kind of dumb when you think about it. It's a fake rivalry. NL Central, yes. Some American League team with a low rent fan base simply because it's proximate and has a low rent fan base? No. It's one of many reasons I don't go in the sox forum.
 

chibears55

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Field/Seating Readiness For Opening Day
Edge: White Sox
I dont know.. even without the bleachers the cubs will out draw the sox, unless you count the dogs in attendance [emoji6]
 

DewsSox79

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I dont know.. even without the bleachers the cubs will out draw the sox, unless you count the dogs in attendance [emoji6]

we will count the dogs and you can count the business travelers and party boys in their pink polo shirts and flip flops.

once again another attendance post. love it!


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DewsSox79

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I don't care for the Sox either, but you don't think it's fun that fans on both boards have problems figuring out where one team might be better than the other? Good baseball could be played at both parks this season. That should be exciting.

this. if these 2 teams werent doing what they were doing we wouldnt be having these friendly competitive debates. it means our teams may actually be relevant again.


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chibears55

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we will count the dogs and you can count the business travelers and party boys in their pink polo shirts and flip flops.

once again another attendance post. love it!


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Awwww dont take it personal. ...

Yea another attendance post to go along with all the stupid cubs jabs we have to read on here every day
 

DewsSox79

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I don't find it interesting at all. Liking the Cubs somehow implies you should also give a shit about the sox? Why? It's kind of dumb when you think about it. It's a fake rivalry. NL Central, yes. Some American League team with a low rent fan base simply because it's proximate and has a low rent fan base? No. It's one of many reasons I don't go in the sox forum.

pretty ignorant post here.

its not about liking the other team. its about both of them being relevant in the same city that has 2 fan bases that can now actually have friendly debates. they arent rivals its more or less the fans are rivals.

low rent fan base? what does that mean? where do you get off stating such stupid shit.

let me guess... you think im "trolling" again? you are clueless kid.


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DewsSox79

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Awwww dont take it personal. ...

Yea another attendance post to go along with all the stupid cubs jabs we have to read on here every day

what cubs jabs now. for the most part it has been very civil.


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chibears55

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what cubs jabs now. for the most part it has been very civil.


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Not talking about now...

Im just messing with you n brett when I mention attendance because I know how much you guys love hearing about it.. [emoji51]
 

Bear Pride

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Not talking about now...

Im just messing with you n brett when I mention attendance because I know how much you guys love hearing about it.. [emoji51]

I would say that the Sox attendance is a prevalent subject. Even the Sox are trying to increase their ticket sales with their "One more game" strategy. It's definitely an issue for the Sox, and I see no need for Sox fans to insult Cubs fans cuz of their own attendance issue. :dunno:

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/whi...-pulling-out-stops-to-bump-attendance-in-2015
 

DewsSox79

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I would say that the Sox attendance is a prevalent subject. Even the Sox are trying to increase their ticket sales with their "One more game" strategy. It's definitely an issue for the Sox, and I see no need for Sox fans to insult Cubs fans cuz of their own attendance issue. :dunno:

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/whi...-pulling-out-stops-to-bump-attendance-in-2015

no we just insult when that is the only thing that gets brought up when someone has an opinion on something with the cubs. its the transparent fallback crutch for a couple guys here.

sox fan: " i think arrietta still needs to show more to be labeled a number 2"

cubs fan: "atleast our fans go to games"

its that comeback that has worn off years ago.


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Bear Pride

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no we just insult when that is the only thing that gets brought up when someone has an opinion on something with the cubs. its the transparent fallback crutch for a couple guys here.

sox fan: " i think arrietta still needs to show more to be labeled a number 2"

cubs fan: "atleast our fans go to games"

its that comeback that has worn off years ago.


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Kind of like the Sox fans "typical Cubs fan, doesn't know anything about baseball" trick, or maybe "half the Cubs fans are tourists" trick? We both take jabs at each other here and there. He made a joke and I thought it was funny.

Hopefully the additions you guys made brings more people to the ballpark, as I am not bothered by it either way. I'll "enjoy myself and drink a beer at Wrigley" trick. Meanwhile, the Sox management is doing everything they can to bring more people to the seats. Now it's up to actual Sox fans to show up, as I am looking forward to future battles against the Sox. :dunno:

Edit to add:

Also, if you want to be technical, in a thread titled "who's better: the White Sox vs Cubs", I'd say that fan participation and financial income due to said fan participation, plays a part of future financial strength.

Edge: Cubs
 

CSF77

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LF= Sox
CF= push
RF= Cubs

3B= Cubs
SS= push
2B= Cubs
1B= push. Both are strong and not arguing which is better.
C= Cubs

SP= Sox are better 1-3. Cubs are deeper. Sox have a better play off rotation. Cubs should have a better reg season one.

Pen Cubs.

Bench= push

Hard to say. Both have their strong points. This changes if Bryant impacts the line up. If Baez puts up his minor league production etc. Right now they are close but the Cubs have more ceiling.
 

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