The Bears may be better but they're still not good enough

[BearFanJohn]

It’s nice to see the gloom and doom before the draft this year. Why wait until we know the roster? While I agree with the OP for the most part, it’s just too early. And, last year was a display of ineptitude by the coaching staff. Better game management, game planning, and in-game adjustments have to be worth something. Though I don’t expect a turn around year one I am more optimistic than some.

 

[pseudonym]

When your OL is no longer Swiss cheese, each guy doesn't have to be Superman. And TBH against the elite DE rushing WHAT tackle is going to win every time? We still have room to go, but I think this team is already MUCH better and depending on the draft—how many guys will be starting week one, and how many are depth/developmental assets for later—remains to be seen. I'd expect our first three picks to start.

 

[pseudonym]

Don't forget our SOS is one of the TOUGHEST in the NFL. If we can get to NINE wins I'll be pleasantly surprised. Really tough schedule.

 

[SugarWalls]

Ah coaching. The mirage that somehow everyone is going to get better because of coaching.

How much better is DJ Moore going to get because of coaching? How much better is Braxton Jones going to get because of coaching? As was said by Duke Mayweather and highlighted in another thread, at this point Braxton Jones is who he is. Andrew Billings is who he is, Montez Sweat is who is he is at best a tier 2 pass rusher probably more like tier 3.

There are known guys on this roster that coaching isn't going to miraculously upgrade into a Top-5 player at their respective positions.

DJ Moore isn't going to suddenly challenge Justin Jefferson and Jamar Chase for the best WR in the league. I doubt Rome Odunze does as well, but I guess you can always hope he does. Odunze is probably a nice long term complimentary guy but he's probably not in the Larry Fitzgerald stratosphere as we were told last year at this time.

My favorite bears coach of recent history, Vic fangio, would always say every year that the media and everyone focuses too much on who will be added but he said the most important part is getting more out of the players already on the roster.

Idk if you’re saying coaching doesn’t matter or what but I do now you’re r3tarded

 

[DanielCCSBears]

Hey guys. A team that won 5 games last year still isn't good enough to win a superbowl. Just thought you all needed me to tell you that considering my wealth of football knowledge. You're welcome.

Oh simply brilliant the way you added something of value to the conversation yet again.

 

[hebs]

Was listening to Leila Rahimi today and she seemingly stumbled into an excellent point about the Bears roster and it's makeup.

Who on this team is good enough to be on a playoff team?

My thought process on that statement, when the game is on the line who do you trust to make the key block the key catch or the key sack or INT to put the game away and do the Bears have enough of those to do well in the playoffs if they get there and the answer is they don't have them.

For as good as Darnell Wright is, if it's 3rd and 8 with :45 seconds left in the fourth quarter and the Bears are down 4, do you feel like he has the edge over Aidan Hutchinson? Does he have the edge over TJ Watt? Is he going to stop Micah Parsons in that situation?

Does it even matter how good Wright is given how little confidence you have in Braxton Jones is in that situation? Is there even a left tackle in this draft that inspires that type of confidence in the future?

How about on defense? Who is that guy the Bears have? It's not Sweat it's not Jarrett it sure as hell isn't Dexter. There's not one player in that front seven that when you gotta have it you can count on him to come through.

What does this mean to me? It probably would be a good idea to trade up and get a guy like Carter or Graham rather than adding to a roster of players who are all the same type of player.

They went big to get Khalil Mack and it got them to the playoffs. Ultimately they didn't have the QB right.

So if Caleb is the QB and they're going to get next level play from Moore and Odunze in the offense, shouldn't they be adding big to the defense instead of just a stream of players just good enough to be on the Bears?

They need better than Sweat and Dexter. And yeah they may need better than Moore and Odunze. But who are they going to get that's going to dramatically alter the trajectory of the team? Just more pieces isn't going to put them on the path to winning the Super Bowl. They need to swing big while they still have Caleb Williams cheap.

To be honest... Your premise is kinda faulty... as if name recognition or a past glorious playing history can determine if said individual will perform at the moment of need.

For defense.... All I can think of is that ONE 4th down play... 46sec left in the game Bears leading.... Julius Peppers couldn't get to Rodgers and he heaved a 4th quarter touchdown to beat the Bears yet again. PEPPERS..... A first ballot HALL OF FAMER.... Someone you would EXPECT to rely on when everything is on the line.

 

[hebs]

Ah coaching. The mirage that somehow everyone is going to get better because of coaching.

How much better is DJ Moore going to get because of coaching? How much better is Braxton Jones going to get because of coaching? As was said by Duke Mayweather and highlighted in another thread, at this point Braxton Jones is who he is. Andrew Billings is who he is, Montez Sweat is who is he is at best a tier 2 pass rusher probably more like tier 3.

There are known guys on this roster that coaching isn't going to miraculously upgrade into a Top-5 player at their respective positions.

DJ Moore isn't going to suddenly challenge Justin Jefferson and Jamar Chase for the best WR in the league. I doubt Rome Odunze does as well, but I guess you can always hope he does. Odunze is probably a nice long term complimentary guy but he's probably not in the Larry Fitzgerald stratosphere as we were told last year at this time.

You can't discard coaching so quickly though. Does KC really win all of those Superbowls if Eberflus was coaching them instead of Reid??
Coaching isn't just about leading. It's understanding how to best utilize the pieces you have to work with and maximize their potential.

 

[NCChiFan]

Ah coaching. The mirage that somehow everyone is going to get better because of coaching.

How much better is DJ Moore going to get because of coaching? How much better is Braxton Jones going to get because of coaching? As was said by Duke Mayweather and highlighted in another thread, at this point Braxton Jones is who he is. Andrew Billings is who he is, Montez Sweat is who is he is at best a tier 2 pass rusher probably more like tier 3.

There are known guys on this roster that coaching isn't going to miraculously upgrade into a Top-5 player at their respective positions.

DJ Moore isn't going to suddenly challenge Justin Jefferson and Jamar Chase for the best WR in the league. I doubt Rome Odunze does as well, but I guess you can always hope he does. Odunze is probably a nice long term complimentary guy but he's probably not in the Larry Fitzgerald stratosphere as we were told last year at this time.

I guess we will get to find out, won't we. Who do we blame for Kmet He went from 90 targets 719 yards in 2023 to 55 targets 474 yards? Who do you blame for that? Kmet or a bad Offensive system?

 

[thenewguy]

Okay we're good then. Yes there is reason for optimism as compared to the disaster that was Matt Eberflus. But as you highlighted drafting and developing is going to be the key to long term success and Poles hasn't done well at all on anything.

The developing part comes from coaching, not Poles. So, yeah a big part of the improvement from this team will be better coaching and competent schemes. If Poles picked the right coaching staff, that is a win in his column and the development will come.

 

[DanielCCSBears]

You can't discard coaching so quickly though. Does KC really win all of those Superbowls if Eberflus was coaching them instead of Reid??
Coaching isn't just about leading. It's understanding how to best utilize the pieces you have to work with and maximize their potential.

I don't think it's fair to compare one of the greatest of all time against one of the worst Super wins. I believe they would have been consistent playoff contenders.

 

[TL1961]

It still ain’t good enough

( I see from another post that you get this. Some others don’t)

Agree they have work to do yet.

But daniel properly made that point but then acted as though nothing was better.

It has to be proven on the field but no reasonable person would think that it is not better.

 

[zabavka]

Beat the teams in your division and good things will happen.

 

[doctorbear]

There are stars in every draft and they don't always happen in the top 10.

 

[Nelly]

There are stars in every draft and they don't always happen in the top 10.

Along with busts as well. Hopefully Poles can find some good ones in this draft to keep upping the talent pool on the team.

 

[MakeMyDay]

Its hopeless - Just file for bankruptcy and fold up operations already

 

[DanielCCSBears]

I guess we will get to find out, won't we. Who do we blame for Kmet He went from 90 targets 719 yards in 2023 to 55 targets 474 yards? Who do you blame for that? Kmet or a bad Offensive system?

But that's kinda the point here as well. Yeah Kmet regressed but is going back to 719 yards going to be enough of an improvement to be a factor in key wins plural? He's a contributor but the difference he makes statistically within the margin of who he is as a player won't move the needle that much.

 

[DanielCCSBears]

Its hopeless - Just file for bankruptcy and fold up operations already

Yeah it might be hopeless with Ryan Poles still the GM. He whiffs a ton on the players he needs to succeed with this year.

 

[DanielCCSBears]

The developing part comes from coaching, not Poles. So, yeah a big part of the improvement from this team will be better coaching and competent schemes. If Poles picked the right coaching staff, that is a win in his column and the development will come.

Okay so who do you expect to develop into a high level difference maker outside of Caleb? Jones is who he is and will always be, same with Sweat same can probably be said for Dexter and Wright. I'm not diminishing them I'm just saying the difference between their floor and ceiling right now and going forward is minimal.

 

[EDPeezy]

Ah coaching. The mirage that somehow everyone is going to get better because of coaching.

How much better is DJ Moore going to get because of coaching? How much better is Braxton Jones going to get because of coaching? As was said by Duke Mayweather and highlighted in another thread, at this point Braxton Jones is who he is. Andrew Billings is who he is, Montez Sweat is who is he is at best a tier 2 pass rusher probably more like tier 3.

There are known guys on this roster that coaching isn't going to miraculously upgrade into a Top-5 player at their respective positions.

DJ Moore isn't going to suddenly challenge Justin Jefferson and Jamar Chase for the best WR in the league. I doubt Rome Odunze does as well, but I guess you can always hope he does. Odunze is probably a nice long term complimentary guy but he's probably not in the Larry Fitzgerald stratosphere as we were told last year at this time.

You constantly do this really lame and transparent thing where you create strawmen to prove a point. You’ve positioned it where Rome Odunze isn’t Larry Fitzgerald so in that sense he’s a disappointment. But nobody in their right mind made a 1 to 1 comparison of those two players, Everybody with a functioning brain or who isn’t trying to feign ignorance knows it’s more of a “this guys ceiling is this” type of comparison. Nobody really thought Odunze projected to be Larry Fitzgerald. One of the greatest WR’s of all time. Like maybe he had a minuscule chance. It’s just more of a body type, style of play comparison. But you’ve completely taken that out of context in order to create a strawman. So know because the 9th pick and 3rd WR taken isnt projected or on the path after his rookie year of a hall of famer and all time great he’s hasn’t met expectations or is kind of a disappointment. Do you want people to take you seriously?

And the thing is Odunze didn’t really have a great year. He was fine for a rookie. He didn’t look like anything special though. That’s enough to make an argument against him really. But instead of just easily doing that and creating an argument based off that you’re like “I was promised Larry Fitzgerald.” WTF? By who? You’re either being intellectually dishonest or are an idiot. Take your pick.

 

[DanielCCSBears]

To be honest... Your premise is kinda faulty... as if name recognition or a past glorious playing history can determine if said individual will perform at the moment of need.

For defense.... All I can think of is that ONE 4th down play... 46sec left in the game Bears leading.... Julius Peppers couldn't get to Rodgers and he heaved a 4th quarter touchdown to beat the Bears yet again. PEPPERS..... A first ballot HALL OF FAMER.... Someone you would EXPECT to rely on when everything is on the line.

Yeah but that play happened not because Peppers couldn't get to Rodgers Peppers got the pressure on Rodgers Conte had blown the coverage. If all things go right on that play and Conte doesn't blow the coverage there's enough pressure from Peppers where that goes as a sack or an incompletion. If everything goes right you need that guy that wins his one on one.