The Cubs Hot Stove Action Thread

[beckdawg]

But we have to see what they have in Lake and Sweeney as F/T players also. The may fall short and they may think on having Alacantara play some CF to bridge the gap to Almora.

I don't really care what Sweeney has. He'll be 29 next year and has been through 4 organizations. Now I'm not saying he doesn't provide some value but he's not going to suddenly break out and be a core for the next several years. Let's call Sweeney what he is, a gap filler or if you prefer a role player. As for Lake, I agree you need to give him a shot. But, I'd much rather trade Russell and Barney or whatever other misfits you prefer for an OFer. You yourself indicated the willingness to trade Schierholtz. Also, what do they do if either Sweeney or Lake is ineffective? I'm all for giving Vitters a shot in LF but they have very little depth in their OF.

Also, I don't see the point in trading for Phillips only to try and flip him later. For one, at his age you're not likely to find a team willing to give anything of value for him. Case in point, the Yankees needed a 2B and wouldn't give up Gardner who is at a position they have an excess on. Also, 2B isn't exactly a position where people are desperately looking for people. If he played SS maybe I see your argument. But there's a reason the players the cubs have been flipping are mainly pitchers. They are the easiest to move.

I agree with Boobaby. I like the idea just not the player. I'd rather they go out and find a true lead off hitter type in the mold of Span or Fowler.

 

[Boobaby1]

Sori played below league standards LF. Phillips is the best D 2B in the league and gives 18 HR and 80+ RBI. I wouldnt count on that from any project. That is solid production out of 2B.

My point was that Phillips is contracted out through 2017. Where does Baez, Bryant, and Alcantara play assuming they all make it? Even if the Cubs trade Castro, I am not sure they want to take on salary for one, and two, Phillips is going to cost some prospects.

I am not sure the Cubs want to take on payroll for the infield. The outfield I can see because Almora and Soler are projected to be farther out, and they are only two of the three outfield spots. Again, assuming they make it.

I am in favor of adding a much needed bat, but I would rather get a guy tied to a 1 or 2 year deal. Maybe Morse or Corey Hart (even though they have signed) to play the outfield for example.

 

[CSF77]

My point was that Phillips is contracted out through 2017. Where does Baez, Bryant, and Alcantara play assuming they all make it? Even if the Cubs trade Castro, I am not sure they want to take on salary for one, and two, Phillips is going to cost some prospects.

I am not sure the Cubs want to take on payroll for the infield. The outfield I can see because Almora and Soler are projected to be farther out, and they are only two of the three outfield spots. Again, assuming they make it.

I am in favor of adding a much needed bat, but I would rather get a guy tied to a 1 or 2 year deal. Maybe Morse or Corey Hart (even though they have signed) to play the outfield for example.

You pinned it. There is not much left on the market right now. Choo but he has a Q offer. That really leaves trades.

Again you don't worry about the years attached. Players can be moved around or traded out.

They need system pitching. Taking on 50 mil worth of contract from a player that has real trade value is not a bad thing. I wouldn't pay much for him. But he has value to the team.

If you really think that Baez, Bryant and Alacantara will just come up and have success is really grasping at straws.

That did not happen with Vitters or Jackson. Rizzo hit like crap his first full year. Ya there are going to be growing pains. They need vet leadership to push past it.

2014 is going to suck. Bottom line. Ya they should get Baez on the team and that is the only redeeming thing to look forward to.

Even then Baez has a good chance of not adjusting to major league pitching. His swing is very violent and I'm worried that he is going to be exploited at this level. Slider in the dirt diets.

Bryant takes BB's and has solid pitch reconition. Add to it he has played college ball for 3 years and has developed more as a hitter. I worry less about him but he also projects as a OF.

IDK If it ends up Baez in LF, Almora CF, Bryant RF Olt 3B, Castro SS Phillips 2B Rizzo 1B. I'm not going to be sad.

Shoot Lake is a big question mark and lacks plate discipline. He is 50/50 right now. Ya the league will adjust to him and find his holes. They always do.

There is nothing wrong with adding a proven hitter. 50 mil is worth his value. 35 YO is the drop off age post PED. That is where you hold back.

 

[CSF77]

I don't really care what Sweeney has. He'll be 29 next year and has been through 4 organizations. Now I'm not saying he doesn't provide some value but he's not going to suddenly break out and be a core for the next several years. Let's call Sweeney what he is, a gap filler or if you prefer a role player. As for Lake, I agree you need to give him a shot. But, I'd much rather trade Russell and Barney or whatever other misfits you prefer for an OFer. You yourself indicated the willingness to trade Schierholtz. Also, what do they do if either Sweeney or Lake is ineffective? I'm all for giving Vitters a shot in LF but they have very little depth in their OF.

Also, I don't see the point in trading for Phillips only to try and flip him later. For one, at his age you're not likely to find a team willing to give anything of value for him. Case in point, the Yankees needed a 2B and wouldn't give up Gardner who is at a position they have an excess on. Also, 2B isn't exactly a position where people are desperately looking for people. If he played SS maybe I see your argument. But there's a reason the players the cubs have been flipping are mainly pitchers. They are the easiest to move.

I agree with Boobaby. I like the idea just not the player. I'd rather they go out and find a true lead off hitter type in the mold of Span or Fowler.

I wouldnt count on Vitters for anything at this point. If he has a healthy season that is fine. Even then he is nothing more than a RH platoon.

Lake is given a shot at FT due to his athletic ability. He has adapted to the transition ans word is his OF play is remarkable right now.

Shoot if PeD's were still in the game he could turn into a masher studd like Sosa did. Same tool box when they were both young.

But again his lacking is that he is tools-y as a hitter. can bunt can blast a mistake etc but? Is he going to be a corner OF? I want 30 HR's there.

 

[CSF77]

I don't really care what Sweeney has. He'll be 29 next year and has been through 4 organizations. Now I'm not saying he doesn't provide some value but he's not going to suddenly break out and be a core for the next several years. Let's call Sweeney what he is, a gap filler or if you prefer a role player. As for Lake, I agree you need to give him a shot. But, I'd much rather trade Russell and Barney or whatever other misfits you prefer for an OFer. You yourself indicated the willingness to trade Schierholtz. Also, what do they do if either Sweeney or Lake is ineffective? I'm all for giving Vitters a shot in LF but they have very little depth in their OF.

Also, I don't see the point in trading for Phillips only to try and flip him later. For one, at his age you're not likely to find a team willing to give anything of value for him. Case in point, the Yankees needed a 2B and wouldn't give up Gardner who is at a position they have an excess on. Also, 2B isn't exactly a position where people are desperately looking for people. If he played SS maybe I see your argument. But there's a reason the players the cubs have been flipping are mainly pitchers. They are the easiest to move.

I agree with Boobaby. I like the idea just not the player. I'd rather they go out and find a true lead off hitter type in the mold of Span or Fowler.

Gardner would be fine but the Yanks have said they are going forward with Gardner hitting 9 in CF and Jacoby in LF leading off. Sori is DH. Ichrio 4th OF.

Yanks are looking at D right now. I can not blame them. That team looks pretty good next year.

 

[beckdawg]

I wouldnt count on Vitters for anything at this point. If he has a healthy season that is fine. Even then he is nothing more than a RH platoon.

Lake is given a shot at FT due to his athletic ability. He has adapted to the transition ans word is his OF play is remarkable right now.

Shoot if PeD's were still in the game he could turn into a masher studd like Sosa did. Same tool box when they were both young.

But again his lacking is that he is tools-y as a hitter. can bunt can blast a mistake etc but? Is he going to be a corner OF? I want 30 HR's there.

Again, you assume I'm counting on people for things. I just want them to have playing time because you don't know until they play. Vitters has earned the chance for that at least. He hit .304 with a .356 OBP two years ago in AAA with 17 HRs and 68 RBIs. Last year he hit .295 with a .380 obp Now sure that's inflated some being PCL. He didn't hit well in 2012 in the majors but it was 109 PAs and he was 22. Maybe he doesn't stay healthy but you can't predict that. I don't hear any cubs fans talking about him. The fact is when healthy he has hit in the minors. Why not give him a chance?

Fangraphs also has an interesting article about Either and Choo basically being the same value. I'd rather they tried to work a deal for Either or Crawford if they could get the Dodgers to eat some of their contracts. Also, Russell and Barney would in theory interest them. I think they plan on playing Uribe at 2B and Barney would be a quality defensive replacement. Russell would give them another lefty option out of the pen. If they got Either they could still play Vitters on the short side of a platoon.

 

[CSF77]

Not sure on Ethier. It would depend on cost. If the Cubs took on the whole contract and returned say Olt, Cabarera and Szczur sure. None of the above are impacting the team and might get a shot.

If it cost any top 10 no thank you.

Again I wouldn't get rid of any core prospects at all unless we are talking David Price. Even on that one I'd only go as far as Soler and Johnson with some add in like Cani and maybe a toss in like Jackson. Baez and Bryant would be off limits. Almora is almost at that level himself.

 

[CSF77]

It feels like a pointless endeavor though.

Cubs are frugal and have been looking at waver pick ups and high resale value buys. If Tanaka falls through they may not spend at all.

 

[beckdawg]

Not sure on Ethier. It would depend on cost. If the Cubs took on the whole contract and returned say Olt, Cabarera and Szczur sure. None of the above are impacting the team and might get a shot.

If the cubs are taking on the entire contract it would probably be for a nothing prospect. To be honest, I would expect Barney and Russell to be enough if the cubs ate the entire contract. If the dodgers eat say $5 mil/year you might have to give up a prospect.

 

[CSF77]

If the cubs are taking on the entire contract it would probably be for a nothing prospect. To be honest, I would expect Barney and Russell to be enough if the cubs ate the entire contract. If the dodgers eat say $5 mil/year you might have to give up a prospect.

That would be fine. He would replace Sweeney in CF. I just don't see them doing it.

 

[SilenceS]

Tanaka has a real shot at not being posted now and the Cubs are gonna roll in to 2014 with like a 80 million dollar payroll. Wouldn't mind that if the roster wasn't God awful. lol

 

[CSF77]

Tell me about it. This line up looks the worst yet. No RH power. 2 platoons and 2 4th OF starting. Not to mention Rusin is the #5. Shitty team

 

[beckdawg]

I don't think they will go into the season with what they currently have. They will have even more money next year because they lose another $14 mil off Soriano's deal. A trade for one of the dodgers OF's actually makes a lot of sense if Tanaka doesn't post. I don't know maybe I'm naive but I can't imagine they signed Sweeney and thought yeah he'll do as a starter. There's also very little hitting on the market next off season.

 

[CSF77]

I don't think they will go into the season with what they currently have. They will have even more money next year because they lose another $14 mil off Soriano's deal. A trade for one of the dodgers OF's actually makes a lot of sense if Tanaka doesn't post. I don't know maybe I'm naive but I can't imagine they signed Sweeney and thought yeah he'll do as a starter. There's also very little hitting on the market next off season.

They signed Sweeney to cover the time gap for Almora.

I believe the plan was Dejesus til Jackson then move Jackson to LF after Almora promoted. Szczur would provide a plan B.

When Jackson sucked at AAA the red flags flew. They went out and signed Bog and Sweeney. They liked Sweeney more and traded out Bog

So ya the plan was internal or low cost solution with Almora being the CF long term.

Lake was unexpected to break out last year. Up to that point he was a bust.

I'll bet that they go into the year with this OF. Olt will be given a shot to win 3B. Watkins same thing at 2B. Valbuena also could end up at 2B.

Something like:
Castro
Valbuena or Watkins
Rizzo
Olt
Schierholtz
Lake
Sweeney
Castillo

Looking at it Alacantra slots into the 2 at 2B. Olt can be moved with Baez taking over 3B. Then Schierholtz traded and Bryant taking over.

At that point Sweeny's LH bat looks good in splitting up the RH hitters

Let's say:

Castro
Alacantra
Baez
Bryant
Rizzo
Lake
Sweeney
Castillo

Going into 2015 Soler at AAA and Almora most likely there also. Vogelbach most likely at 1B. It opens more trade opertunity

 

[CSF77]

I believe the main reasons why Sweeny was retained is because he hits LH pitching and he can cover all 3 spots.

I like him. I can see 16 HR with 75 RBI in CF. He should get around 1 WAR value.

 

[Boobaby1]

I don't think they will go into the season with what they currently have. They will have even more money next year because they lose another $14 mil off Soriano's deal. A trade for one of the dodgers OF's actually makes a lot of sense if Tanaka doesn't post. I don't know maybe I'm naive but I can't imagine they signed Sweeney and thought yeah he'll do as a starter. There's also very little hitting on the market next off season.

The Cubs will trade for an outfielder this year IMO. Now, whether that's via Shark, Russell, Barney, some minor leaguers or any combination, that is what I think they will do.

They will try to get someone who is preferably cost controlled or in early ARB years, and 2nd move on to a team that is salary dumping like the Dodgers.

I think a possible fit would be to do a big trade with Toronto using something centered around Shark and Vogelbach, and in return, get back Colby Rasmus and Marcus Stroman.

They would get ready made pitching and a Power hitting prospect, and the Cubs get a CF who can eventually move to a corner position and a high level pitching prospect.

 

[brett05]

The Cubs will trade for an outfielder this year IMO. Now, whether that's via Shark, Russell, Barney, some minor leaguers or any combination, that is what I think they will do.

They will try to get someone who is preferably cost controlled or in early ARB years, and 2nd move on to a team that is salary dumping like the Dodgers.

I think a possible fit would be to do a big trade with Toronto using something centered around Shark and Vogelbach, and in return, get back Colby Rasmus and Marcus Stroman.

They would get ready made pitching and a Power hitting prospect, and the Cubs get a CF who can eventually move to a corner position and a high level pitching prospect.

I could see this as a trade. I still think Shark will have issues in the AL, but if an AL team wants him, this trade seems pretty balanced.

 

[beckdawg]

The Cubs will trade for an outfielder this year IMO. Now, whether that's via Shark, Russell, Barney, some minor leaguers or any combination, that is what I think they will do.

They will try to get someone who is preferably cost controlled or in early ARB years, and 2nd move on to a team that is salary dumping like the Dodgers.

I think a possible fit would be to do a big trade with Toronto using something centered around Shark and Vogelbach, and in return, get back Colby Rasmus and Marcus Stroman.

They would get ready made pitching and a Power hitting prospect, and the Cubs get a CF who can eventually move to a corner position and a high level pitching prospect.

I don't see why they would do that though because if you trade for Shark you want to win now. Trading away Rasmus doesn't help you win now. Not that what you're saying is a bad idea. I think Toronto would like to trade an OF but I would suggest it's Gose. Personally I wouldn't really be in favor of Gose though because he strikes out a metric ton.

 

[CSF77]

They should wait til the dead-line.

Right now they have Castro, Rizzo and Olt at low value. Shark still a 3. These 3 potentially could have their stock rise.

Far as replacements they have Vogelbach and Bryant in AA and Baez in AAA.

So looking at it if they want Baez at SS this year and can use Castro to get a top pitching prospect then they can. I'm expecting Castro to bounce back and Castro hitting .300 is going to demand a teams top arm.

Regardless any trade made right now is from a position of weakness.

Right now is the time to shore together a legit rotation and evaluate players that have potential trade value and put them on the field. It is nothing new. This has been status que for 2 years now.

After Baez and Bryant are on the team then you start building a team around them.

Except for Tanaka. He is worth getting due to his age

 

[CSF77]

Ya it makes sense to do this. If they are not going all in it is better to get a bigger draft pool.