Pez68
Fire Waldron
- Joined:
- Oct 31, 2014
- Posts:
- 5,020
- Liked Posts:
- 838
I would have absolutely no issue with him sitting a game to clear his head and recharge. The problem is, will whoever you bring in be as good, or better? I have my doubts.</p>
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
You guys do know Kane and Toews haven't scored many playoff goals since the cup season right? I think Kane has scored 3 goals the last 3 playoffs (including this year) and Toews has scored 4? Maybe Kane isn't injured after all. Maybe Kane and Toews aren't as good of playoff players as we think they are? Maybe we were spoiled in their first 2 playoff appearances. Toews can start by trying to have fun again..Kane also. </p>
</p>
</p>
Then again it could all be McDonough just fucking with the fun of the game thus making Toews and Kane poster boys and not hockey players.</p>
</p>
</p>
Then again it could all be McDonough just fucking with the fun of the game thus making Toews and Kane poster boys and not hockey players.</p>
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pez68" data-cid="199154" data-time="1370481851">
<div>
Are you just naturally argumentative? This is a well known fact in ALL sports and ALL young athletes. It isn't an excuse pulled out of thin air like "Kane is injured". It's a well known fact that players typically hit a wall when playing substantially more than they have in the past... Plenty of examples out there.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
and plenty of examples that counter such a silly theory. Absolute garbage theory Pez. You are stretching.</p>
</p>
Its not a fact its a theory and there is no data to support it as a fact. Go find me the studies and I'll be more than happy to read them if they do exist. My gutt tells me they don't exist and it's based on speculation no stronger than mine that Kane is hurt. The best part is my theory and speculation will be supported by data that proves it come seasons end.</p>
<div>
Are you just naturally argumentative? This is a well known fact in ALL sports and ALL young athletes. It isn't an excuse pulled out of thin air like "Kane is injured". It's a well known fact that players typically hit a wall when playing substantially more than they have in the past... Plenty of examples out there.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
and plenty of examples that counter such a silly theory. Absolute garbage theory Pez. You are stretching.</p>
</p>
Its not a fact its a theory and there is no data to support it as a fact. Go find me the studies and I'll be more than happy to read them if they do exist. My gutt tells me they don't exist and it's based on speculation no stronger than mine that Kane is hurt. The best part is my theory and speculation will be supported by data that proves it come seasons end.</p>
Ton
New member
- Joined:
- May 14, 2010
- Posts:
- 3,991
- Liked Posts:
- 124
- Location:
- Park Ridge, IL
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pmxclland" data-cid="199155" data-time="1370481863">
<div>
Then sit him if he's too tired
I don't buy that at all</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Maybe not physically tired, but mentally I can see that.</p>
<div>
Then sit him if he's too tired
I don't buy that at all</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Maybe not physically tired, but mentally I can see that.</p>
Pez68
Fire Waldron
- Joined:
- Oct 31, 2014
- Posts:
- 5,020
- Liked Posts:
- 838
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Ton DeFrancesco" data-cid="199159" data-time="1370482197">
<div>
Maybe not physically tired, but mentally I can see that.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Bingo</p>
<div>
Maybe not physically tired, but mentally I can see that.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Bingo</p>
Ton
New member
- Joined:
- May 14, 2010
- Posts:
- 3,991
- Liked Posts:
- 124
- Location:
- Park Ridge, IL
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pez68" data-cid="199160" data-time="1370482229">
<div>
Bingo</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
It's not like he looks tired out there, it's his decision making/finishing ability that is lacking right now. His wheels are fine.</p>
<div>
Bingo</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
It's not like he looks tired out there, it's his decision making/finishing ability that is lacking right now. His wheels are fine.</p>
Maiden
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 1,148
- Liked Posts:
- 0
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Ton DeFrancesco" data-cid="199161" data-time="1370482362">
<div>
It's not like he looks tired out there, it's his decision making/finishing ability that is lacking right now. His wheels are fine.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
The word everyone is looking for is "pressing."</p>
<div>
It's not like he looks tired out there, it's his decision making/finishing ability that is lacking right now. His wheels are fine.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
The word everyone is looking for is "pressing."</p>
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
If hes mentally tired its because he hasn't been productive and its in his head. That I can agree on but it has nothing to do with playing more games than he is used to because he is young and not used to that. Its mental because he is young and doesn't know how to handle self displeasure and pressures yet. Those are complete different things.</p>
PatrickShart
New member
- Joined:
- May 17, 2010
- Posts:
- 4,782
- Liked Posts:
- 452
While I agree that I'd like to see more points out if Kane...teams aren't letting him get the puck at all
There's a good reason Handzus is leading Hawk Centers in points and Sharp has been so open. I think Sharps had what...4 breakaways in the last 10gms? Zeus' goal the other day was Kane winning a board battle pinned in the NZ to spring he and Sharp
Teams know when Kane has the puck...there are 5 dangerous guys on the ice. Eliminate him and dare others to beat them
There's a good reason Handzus is leading Hawk Centers in points and Sharp has been so open. I think Sharps had what...4 breakaways in the last 10gms? Zeus' goal the other day was Kane winning a board battle pinned in the NZ to spring he and Sharp
Teams know when Kane has the puck...there are 5 dangerous guys on the ice. Eliminate him and dare others to beat them
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
Dont bring actual hockey points and fundamentals into this PMX. Never suggest that the opposition and coaching is good enough to discover blueprints on other players and focus on them thus keeping them off the scoreboard. I mean the Hawks haven't been doing that at all themselves against their opponents star players these playoffs.</p>
Pez68
Fire Waldron
- Joined:
- Oct 31, 2014
- Posts:
- 5,020
- Liked Posts:
- 838
TCD I am not going to continue to argue this here as I don't think Saad has been as disappointing as others. If you have never heard of this just go ahead and google "hit the rookie wall" or "hitting the rookie wall". It is very much talked about in all sports and very much a reality.
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
I have heard of God too. Doesn't mean I believe it or its real. Again theories like these take the data they want to support it and omit the data that counter it. There is plenty of data that completely challenges these type of theories. Besides its all rather subjective...err should be anyways. What's an issue for one rookie player isn't or shouldn't be expected to be an issue for another. Maybe you are right maybe Saad is having trouble dealing with the length of his season. You still cant sit there and tell me its fact and thats equal along the board for every rookie player. like i cant tell you that kane is hurt is fact. If it comes out of Saads mouth ill believe it. will you still believe kane is hurt if he says he is after the playoffs or will you chalk it up as a fake excuse he is using for unproductive goal scoring?</p>
</p>
Im not arguing..im throwing out other points to chew on. Nothing is as black and white as we want it to be. usually when a player is slumping or having issues its more than one thing causing it. AND SOMETIMES ITS BECAUSE THE OTHER TEAM ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING ALSO. Fan bias is the dumbest shit in sports..sometimes you are allowed to give credit to the other team and talents in the league (some people dont watch anything other than the Hawks games). Doesn't mean you are betraying your team..usually means you are watching the other team at the same time. </p>
</p>
Maybe the Kings and Detroit and the Wild have been able to shut down Kane and Toews because they are actually good professional hockey teams with professional players and coaches? Same reason the Hawks are shutting down star players..Boston is shutting down the pens star players etc etc.</p>
</p>
Just maybe that's one of the reasons?</p>
</p>
Im not arguing..im throwing out other points to chew on. Nothing is as black and white as we want it to be. usually when a player is slumping or having issues its more than one thing causing it. AND SOMETIMES ITS BECAUSE THE OTHER TEAM ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING ALSO. Fan bias is the dumbest shit in sports..sometimes you are allowed to give credit to the other team and talents in the league (some people dont watch anything other than the Hawks games). Doesn't mean you are betraying your team..usually means you are watching the other team at the same time. </p>
</p>
Maybe the Kings and Detroit and the Wild have been able to shut down Kane and Toews because they are actually good professional hockey teams with professional players and coaches? Same reason the Hawks are shutting down star players..Boston is shutting down the pens star players etc etc.</p>
</p>
Just maybe that's one of the reasons?</p>
Rex
Chief Blackcock
- Joined:
- Jul 17, 2010
- Posts:
- 3,447
- Liked Posts:
- 449
- Location:
- Grimson's Sweet Ass
It's Chicagos game to lose. </p>
</p>
Just win, Baby!</p>
</p>
Just win, Baby!</p>
Rex
Chief Blackcock
- Joined:
- Jul 17, 2010
- Posts:
- 3,447
- Liked Posts:
- 449
- Location:
- Grimson's Sweet Ass
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Pez68" data-cid="199156" data-time="1370482099">
<div>
I would have absolutely no issue with him sitting a game to clear his head and recharge. The problem is, will whoever you bring in be as good, or better? I have my doubts.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
How about Ben "I show up in the playoffs and score game winning goals" Smith?</p>
<div>
I would have absolutely no issue with him sitting a game to clear his head and recharge. The problem is, will whoever you bring in be as good, or better? I have my doubts.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
How about Ben "I show up in the playoffs and score game winning goals" Smith?</p>
- Joined:
- May 12, 2010
- Posts:
- 47,886
- Liked Posts:
- 26,376
Bickell for Conn Smythe.</p>
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
Craws going to win game 4 regardless of Keith or not.</p>
- Joined:
- Dec 10, 2014
- Posts:
- 7,876
- Liked Posts:
- 1,107
- Location:
- Anacortes, WA via Glenview, IL
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pmxclland" data-cid="199073" data-time="1370474490">
<div>
No call for this late hit from this hit last year....</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
The only possible upside from the Keith suspension is that there will close scrutiny for the rest of the series so douchebag Brown may have to behave less douchy.</p>
<div>
No call for this late hit from this hit last year....</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
The only possible upside from the Keith suspension is that there will close scrutiny for the rest of the series so douchebag Brown may have to behave less douchy.</p>
- Joined:
- Dec 10, 2014
- Posts:
- 7,876
- Liked Posts:
- 1,107
- Location:
- Anacortes, WA via Glenview, IL
Hawks win despite Keith's absence (oh God, where are you?) and the Hawks close out the series Friday night.</p>
</p>
</p>
...er Saturday night.
</p>
</p>
</p>
...er Saturday night.
</p>Pez68
Fire Waldron
- Joined:
- Oct 31, 2014
- Posts:
- 5,020
- Liked Posts:
- 838
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="The Canadian Dreamalchuk" data-cid="199167" data-time="1370483832">
<div>
I have heard of God too. Doesn't mean I believe it or its real. Again theories like these take the data they want to support it and omit the data that counter it. There is plenty of data that completely challenges these type of theories. Besides its all rather subjective...err should be anyways. What's an issue for one rookie player isn't or shouldn't be expected to be an issue for another. Maybe you are right maybe Saad is having trouble dealing with the length of his season. You still cant sit there and tell me its fact and thats equal along the board for every rookie player. like i cant tell you that kane is hurt is fact. If it comes out of Saads mouth ill believe it. will you still believe kane is hurt if he says he is after the playoffs or will you chalk it up as a fake excuse he is using for unproductive goal scoring?</p>
</p>
Im not arguing..im throwing out other points to chew on. Nothing is as black and white as we want it to be. usually when a player is slumping or having issues its more than one thing causing it. AND SOMETIMES ITS BECAUSE THE OTHER TEAM ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING ALSO. Fan bias is the dumbest shit in sports..sometimes you are allowed to give credit to the other team and talents in the league (some people dont watch anything other than the Hawks games). Doesn't mean you are betraying your team..usually means you are watching the other team at the same time. </p>
</p>
Maybe the Kings and Detroit and the Wild have been able to shut down Kane and Toews because they are actually good professional hockey teams with professional players and coaches? Same reason the Hawks are shutting down star players..Boston is shutting down the pens star players etc etc.</p>
</p>
Just maybe that's one of the reasons?</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Can't have it both ways. If you're going to come up with excuses for Toews and Kane not producing, who have MUCH higher expectations on them, and much more talent, then calling out guys like Stalberg and Saad is hyprocitical. Maybe the third line is having issues producing because of the other teams too? Maybe the third line has just as tough a matchup as Kane and Toews do? Kane, Toews, Sharp, Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Hammer, Bolland, Oduya, Crawford...these are the guys that are expected to carry this team. They are the core. They are the players the Hawks kept and built around. They are the veterans on this team. If they are not producing and the team is struggling, they should be criticized first and foremost. If you're going to give them a pass, then the lesser players can't be held to higher standards. That makes no sense.</p>
<div>
I have heard of God too. Doesn't mean I believe it or its real. Again theories like these take the data they want to support it and omit the data that counter it. There is plenty of data that completely challenges these type of theories. Besides its all rather subjective...err should be anyways. What's an issue for one rookie player isn't or shouldn't be expected to be an issue for another. Maybe you are right maybe Saad is having trouble dealing with the length of his season. You still cant sit there and tell me its fact and thats equal along the board for every rookie player. like i cant tell you that kane is hurt is fact. If it comes out of Saads mouth ill believe it. will you still believe kane is hurt if he says he is after the playoffs or will you chalk it up as a fake excuse he is using for unproductive goal scoring?</p>
</p>
Im not arguing..im throwing out other points to chew on. Nothing is as black and white as we want it to be. usually when a player is slumping or having issues its more than one thing causing it. AND SOMETIMES ITS BECAUSE THE OTHER TEAM ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING ALSO. Fan bias is the dumbest shit in sports..sometimes you are allowed to give credit to the other team and talents in the league (some people dont watch anything other than the Hawks games). Doesn't mean you are betraying your team..usually means you are watching the other team at the same time. </p>
</p>
Maybe the Kings and Detroit and the Wild have been able to shut down Kane and Toews because they are actually good professional hockey teams with professional players and coaches? Same reason the Hawks are shutting down star players..Boston is shutting down the pens star players etc etc.</p>
</p>
Just maybe that's one of the reasons?</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Can't have it both ways. If you're going to come up with excuses for Toews and Kane not producing, who have MUCH higher expectations on them, and much more talent, then calling out guys like Stalberg and Saad is hyprocitical. Maybe the third line is having issues producing because of the other teams too? Maybe the third line has just as tough a matchup as Kane and Toews do? Kane, Toews, Sharp, Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Hammer, Bolland, Oduya, Crawford...these are the guys that are expected to carry this team. They are the core. They are the players the Hawks kept and built around. They are the veterans on this team. If they are not producing and the team is struggling, they should be criticized first and foremost. If you're going to give them a pass, then the lesser players can't be held to higher standards. That makes no sense.</p>
the canadian dream
New member
- Joined:
- May 15, 2010
- Posts:
- 6,402
- Liked Posts:
- 14
Since when was caring about depth scoring hypocritical? And since when have i been giving guys like Toews and Kane passes? I have been very critical of both Toews and Kane. Toews almost lost us the Wings series with his early flip outs and i was very vocal about it. You know i have been critical about Kanes choices with the puck esp that short side shot he continues to fail ons..again i have been very vocal about Kane. I care about Toews and Kane..doesn't mean i should downplay the importance of depth scoring. I also expect more scoring from Saad. I also expect it from Stalberg who isn't doing it..also Leddy who isn't scoring but I know who can (hes doing some other things really well though).</p>
</p>
Depth scoring seems like a pretty important thing these playoffs (and usually is in all playoffs) for most teams. Look around the league other than in Boston not many star players are filling the nets 5 on 5 and even on the PP. Does that make Boston scary? Yup indeed it does..in my opinion they are now cup favorites and Chicago or LA should be concerned when they meet the Bruins in the final if they dont start getting real goal scoring from the likes of Kane and Toews or in LA's case Kopitar and Richards and Carter..no doubt about it. Boston are rolling on all fronts right now and YES getting scoring from their star players. Very scary team. Hawks have not been scary up front and yes that has a huge part to do with Toews and Kane not being able to get through the oppositions tight checking.</p>
</p>
My saving grace for the Hawks as it has been all season is team defence. There is no team better at it..even Boston. I give Toews slight breaks over Kane overall because Toews as we all know is a two way forward so when not scoring goals at least he is playing great defence..which he is. Kane is not a guy that brings much to the table outside of offense so his slump is highlighted in my books. Saad was playing good defensive hockey also which made him not scoring a non concern. He isn't playing good defensive hockey now either. But I think we are allowed to have concerns about any player we like to have concerns with. Im not glossing over Kane or Toews either by bringing of Saad. I think talking about other players is fair game.</p>
</p>
You can't tell me you have been pleased with Saad these playoffs overall. Or haven't rolled your eyes at some of the things he has done or not done. Rookie excuses never sit well with me. Seen too many rookies explode in playoffs. trust me im not going to go blaming loses on Saad (haven't done it yet) and im not going to blame guys like Saad if the Hawks dont get to the final and do well in it. Im a bit more realistic than that..but at the end of the day..right now...Saad is playing like shit too.</p>
</p>
Depth scoring seems like a pretty important thing these playoffs (and usually is in all playoffs) for most teams. Look around the league other than in Boston not many star players are filling the nets 5 on 5 and even on the PP. Does that make Boston scary? Yup indeed it does..in my opinion they are now cup favorites and Chicago or LA should be concerned when they meet the Bruins in the final if they dont start getting real goal scoring from the likes of Kane and Toews or in LA's case Kopitar and Richards and Carter..no doubt about it. Boston are rolling on all fronts right now and YES getting scoring from their star players. Very scary team. Hawks have not been scary up front and yes that has a huge part to do with Toews and Kane not being able to get through the oppositions tight checking.</p>
</p>
My saving grace for the Hawks as it has been all season is team defence. There is no team better at it..even Boston. I give Toews slight breaks over Kane overall because Toews as we all know is a two way forward so when not scoring goals at least he is playing great defence..which he is. Kane is not a guy that brings much to the table outside of offense so his slump is highlighted in my books. Saad was playing good defensive hockey also which made him not scoring a non concern. He isn't playing good defensive hockey now either. But I think we are allowed to have concerns about any player we like to have concerns with. Im not glossing over Kane or Toews either by bringing of Saad. I think talking about other players is fair game.</p>
</p>
You can't tell me you have been pleased with Saad these playoffs overall. Or haven't rolled your eyes at some of the things he has done or not done. Rookie excuses never sit well with me. Seen too many rookies explode in playoffs. trust me im not going to go blaming loses on Saad (haven't done it yet) and im not going to blame guys like Saad if the Hawks dont get to the final and do well in it. Im a bit more realistic than that..but at the end of the day..right now...Saad is playing like shit too.</p>