Wikileaks

[Kerfuffle]

No, God Dammit, we **** up we admit to it......for fucks sake, that is what i teach my son.....don't lie about something you did, that only makes it worse.



Plausible Deniability is something a fucking intel guy made up to protect his own ass.

To what end though? Why can't it be dealt with privately and handled internally with controls in place to prevent a repeat occurrence. Making an isolated incident public knowledge will just make it worse and not solve anything.



If I may give an analogy, and obviously no where to the same degree, but I want to give you an example of how 'letting everyone' know about it doesn't solve anything. For example, boss is doing the secretary and I find out about it. I handle it privately with HR and compliance and the matter is settled. Internal issue, isolated incident, solved. Now what would happen if instead of handling it this way I sent a mass email out to all employees in the company telling them what happened. What good does that do and what right do others have to that information? See my point? Now like I said the example in this thread is about torture so obviously my little example here is not on the same level of severity but I want to point out how something can be dealt with privately and internally vs. letting everyone know about it.

 

[FlaHawkFan]

To what end though? Why can't it be dealt with privately and handled internally with controls in place to prevent a repeat occurrence. Making an isolated incident public knowledge will just make it worse and not solve anything.



If I may give an analogy, and obviously no where to the same degree, but I want to give you an example of how 'letting everyone' know about it doesn't solve anything. For example, boss is doing the secretary and I find out about it. I handle it privately with HR and compliance and the matter is settled. Internal issue, isolated incident, solved. Now what would happen if instead of handling it this way I sent a mass email out to all employees in the company telling them what happened. What good does that do and what right do others have to that information? See my point? Now like I said the example in this thread is about torture so obviously my little example here is not on the same level of severity but I want to point out how something can be dealt with privately and internally vs. letting everyone know about it.

BUT YOUR FREAKING OFFICE IS NOT A DEMOCRACY. Your money doesn't go to help your boss do his secretary. Apparently, my tax money is being or has been used to capture and deport perfectly innocent people. Huge, huge difference.

 

[MassHavoc]

To what end though? Why can't it be dealt with privately and handled internally with controls in place to prevent a repeat occurrence. Making an isolated incident public knowledge will just make it worse and not solve anything.



If I may give an analogy, and obviously no where to the same degree, but I want to give you an example of how 'letting everyone' know about it doesn't solve anything. For example, boss is doing the secretary and I find out about it. I handle it privately with HR and compliance and the matter is settled. Internal issue, isolated incident, solved. Now what would happen if instead of handling it this way I sent a mass email out to all employees in the company telling them what happened. What good does that do and what right do others have to that information? See my point? Now like I said the example in this thread is about torture so obviously my little example here is not on the same level of severity but I want to point out how something can be dealt with privately and internally vs. letting everyone know about it.

Because things are much more likely to be fixed correctly if they are public and embarrassing. If you make a mistake that could get correctly with no one really knowing about it, then would you be more likely to do it.



Also, admitting it and taking responsibility for it adds context to the importance of the issue. By keeping it quiet and hiding things it's almost as if it was no big deal for us to kidnap a Canadian citizen in the name of terrorism. Well it is a big deal.



You analogy is incorrect because we are not talking about the same response. We are talking about going to HR and dealing with the problem which leads to public actions to correct the situation from happening again.

 

[TSD]

To what end though? Why can't it be dealt with privately and handled internally with controls in place to prevent a repeat occurrence. Making an isolated incident public knowledge will just make it worse and not solve anything.



If I may give an analogy, and obviously no where to the same degree, but I want to give you an example of how 'letting everyone' know about it doesn't solve anything. For example, boss is doing the secretary and I find out about it. I handle it privately with HR and compliance and the matter is settled. Internal issue, isolated incident, solved. Now what would happen if instead of handling it this way I sent a mass email out to all employees in the company telling them what happened. What good does that do and what right do others have to that information? See my point? Now like I said the example in this thread is about torture so obviously my little example here is not on the same level of severity but I want to point out how something can be dealt with privately and internally vs. letting everyone know about it.

That depends man, still think you should do it privately through HR, if your boss kidnapped and imprisoned his secretary in his basement?

Why do you think sex offenders need to advertize themselves? because they cant regulate themselves and need people to know all about what theyve done to keep them in line.





Two employees consentually having sex, is just a tad bit different than kidnapping some poor fool and letting him rot in a prison in syria for a year.

 

[bubbleheadchief]

To what end though? Why can't it be dealt with privately and handled internally with controls in place to prevent a repeat occurrence. Making an isolated incident public knowledge will just make it worse and not solve anything.



If I may give an analogy, and obviously no where to the same degree, but I want to give you an example of how 'letting everyone' know about it doesn't solve anything. For example, boss is doing the secretary and I find out about it. I handle it privately with HR and compliance and the matter is settled. Internal issue, isolated incident, solved. Now what would happen if instead of handling it this way I sent a mass email out to all employees in the company telling them what happened. What good does that do and what right do others have to that information? See my point? Now like I said the example in this thread is about torture so obviously my little example here is not on the same level of severity but I want to point out how something can be dealt with privately and internally vs. letting everyone know about it.

If it wasn't happening as often as it did, i could almost agree with you, but it is happening way too much. I am sorry, but if one of my kids fucked up continuously, like the CIA is, in radio, he is going to Captain's Mast and either finding a new boat or finding a new job because he is geting kicked out, i am not going to keep covering for his ass. I am sorry but in your analogy, throw this in there: others have seen the boss get away for this for a while, so they decide they can do the same thing. They dont know that the boss got caught, and it continues to happen, becuase in their eyes, it is an acceptable behaviour.

 

[Kerfuffle]

That depends man, still think you should do it privately through HR, if your boss kidnapped and imprisoned his secretary in his basement?

Why do you think sex offenders need to advertize themselves? because they cant regulate themselves and need people to know all about what theyve done to keep them in line.





Two employees consentually having sex, is just a tad bit different than kidnapping some poor fool and letting him rot in a prison in syria for a year.

I said twice in my post above that my example was not the same as torture. The point I was making is that matters can be dealt with privately and internally and settled.

 

[TSD]

I said twice in my post above that my example was not the same as torture. The point I was making is that matters can be dealt with privately and internally and settled.

you simply have too much faith. Its not like a couple of rogue CIA agents just up and decided to do this. Unless the CIA was caught red handed and got egg on their face why would they stop? What if they had reason not to stop? What if 1 in every 3 they picked up and hauled off to a sandbox hole turned out to actually be a terrorist and provided good intel? If I am a results at all costs kind of guy, i keep doing what im doing.



What I am trying to say to you, is if nothing was in place for them not to do this to begin with....they knew what they were doing was wrong, but they did it anyway, I find it ridiculous to think they didnt know full well ahead of time that this guy may be just that, just some guy.



Without this being exposed, they had no reason to correct their activities. The CIA has been in existence long enough to know the difference between right and wrong.

 

[Variable]

I said twice in my post above that my example was not the same as torture. The point I was making is that matters can be dealt with privately and internally and settled.

When you're fucking around with other countries and their citizens without any right to, or that "right" was a based on a lie to begin with, yeah that deserves to be out in the public because it's CRIMINAL. I mean, they've deceived people. All this propaganda about going to war, how it had to be done, why we needed to be over there. Think of how many people's lives are being ruined by that, people who've had nothing to do with anything whatsoever. They haven't "privately" dealt with it, and even if they had, it's still going on right now, what the hell was accomplished with that? Nothing.



Yeah, it's bad news, but it's gotta come out to have ANY chance of making things right. You can't trust the government to "discipline" themselves.

 

[Chief Walking Stick]

Hahaha this thread is so full of win!



And quite a bit of lose....

 

[genefoley]

Hahaha this thread is so full of win!



And quite a bit of lose....

I believe the opposite of win is fail, Stu.

/derail

 

[Chief Walking Stick]

I believe the opposite of win is fail, Stu.

/derail

Actually the opposite of win is lose..... but I know what you mean.

 

[supraman]