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Trade whatever prospects you want for Kesler other than TT.</p>
PatrickShart
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Grimzus" data-cid="232936" data-time="1403708766">
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Trade whatever prospects you want for Kesler including TT.</p>
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</p>
Good Call Jeff</p>
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Trade whatever prospects you want for Kesler including TT.</p>
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</blockquote>
</p>
Good Call Jeff</p>
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How much is the projected cap going up again? I can't remember what they are estimating? Is it actually enough to matter?</p>
Shantz My Pants
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Not for the Hawks with Kane and Toews due for a 2mil bump in salary each.
Ton
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I still don't see why the Hawks would have to make room for his salary if the Canucks can just retain some. It's only two years.</p>
</p>
They have no defense, no goaltender. Sedins are aging, Kesler wants out, and very little waiting in the pipeline. If they decide to go through a mini-rebuild here, then taking $2-3 mil off Keslers hit is reasonable IMO.</p>
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Why would they ask for Brandon Saad? He's young and they can build around a piece like that. Sharp is not that guy, he's expensive, and getting older. I would be absolutely shocked if they traded Kesler for an older, expensive player.</p>
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They have no defense, no goaltender. Sedins are aging, Kesler wants out, and very little waiting in the pipeline. If they decide to go through a mini-rebuild here, then taking $2-3 mil off Keslers hit is reasonable IMO.</p>
</p>
Why would they ask for Brandon Saad? He's young and they can build around a piece like that. Sharp is not that guy, he's expensive, and getting older. I would be absolutely shocked if they traded Kesler for an older, expensive player.</p>
Shantz My Pants
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Well if they want Saad, I'll pass. Long term I don't like that deal, especially with Sharp potentially gone down the line.
Why would they want to hold Keslers salary though? He's not on their team so why pay him? It's not like a Versteeg where Florida just wants to get rid of him and is willing to bite the bullet on half his salary. The Hawks would need to offer more than if the Nucks hold some of his salary.
Why would they want to hold Keslers salary though? He's not on their team so why pay him? It's not like a Versteeg where Florida just wants to get rid of him and is willing to bite the bullet on half his salary. The Hawks would need to offer more than if the Nucks hold some of his salary.
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Sometimes when you rebuild though, you have to get the right vets in the locker room to make sure the kids come up right. I'm not saying sharp is that guy or anything like that, and they had the Sedins for that, but rebuilding doesn't always mean getting the youngest kids you can.</p>
the canadian dream
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That's all true Havoc but the problem with the Canucks is they don't have any young players worth grooming. They seriously are a mess after years of bad drafting and low draft picks. What the Canucks should be doing with Kesler is trying to get that one prospect and a shit load of picks. I wouldn't be shocked if he gets moved at the draft.</p>
Variable
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Saad more or less is Sharps replacement in a few years. No way they should give him up. Even moreso than Teuvo.
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="the hanadian dreamzues" data-cid="232963" data-time="1403726232">
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That's all true Havoc but the problem with the Canucks is they don't have any young players worth grooming. They seriously are a mess after years of bad drafting and low draft picks. What the Canucks should be doing with Kesler is trying to get that one prospect and a shit load of picks. I wouldn't be shocked if he gets moved at the draft.</p>
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Yeah, i'm not saying that Kesler is that vet, I more ment I wouldn't be surprised to see them bring a vet presence back in any trade that brings picks or prospects. I think more than anything in rebuilding you need to clean house and get rid of the old and bring in the new, because young or old you don't want anything to be allowed to bring the old status quo back into the room or those prospect you groom are going to shit the bed the same as the old guys. Lou going was a start, Kesler will help, anyone else they can move, I wouldn't even be beyond saying the Sedins should be offered up to teams if they would move. Just have to do a culture reboot. And for a team that idolizes the waving of a white flag... they need that more than anything else.</p>
<div>
That's all true Havoc but the problem with the Canucks is they don't have any young players worth grooming. They seriously are a mess after years of bad drafting and low draft picks. What the Canucks should be doing with Kesler is trying to get that one prospect and a shit load of picks. I wouldn't be shocked if he gets moved at the draft.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
Yeah, i'm not saying that Kesler is that vet, I more ment I wouldn't be surprised to see them bring a vet presence back in any trade that brings picks or prospects. I think more than anything in rebuilding you need to clean house and get rid of the old and bring in the new, because young or old you don't want anything to be allowed to bring the old status quo back into the room or those prospect you groom are going to shit the bed the same as the old guys. Lou going was a start, Kesler will help, anyone else they can move, I wouldn't even be beyond saying the Sedins should be offered up to teams if they would move. Just have to do a culture reboot. And for a team that idolizes the waving of a white flag... they need that more than anything else.</p>
Variable
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Doesn't look like it's happening anyway, Sharp's agent has basically come out and said Stan told him he wouldn't be traded.</p>
Shantz My Pants
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His agent also said he was the last guy on the Hawks who would be traded. So figure that out....
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Nothing an agent says has ever matter. It's all posturing. He could just as easily be setting Stan up as the bad guy should he get traded, He tells everyone on.... twitter... that his player wants to be here and stan said that he won't be traded, stan can't say anything because he doesn't want to add fuel to the fire, then the agent engineers the trade and boom not the players fault.</p>
CLWolf81
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="the hanadian dreamzues" data-cid="232794" data-time="1403651358">
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Anyone shocked that this is what the Canucks would ask for? Not me exactly what I thought they would want. Vancouver has zero interest in vet players right now they want youth and they want rebuild blocks. No idea what the Ducks have to offer Vancouver either. Ducks aren't exactly a team in the position to be selling their futures either and they don't have a lot of them to start with. Don't see how Vancouver dealing with the Ducks is easy when the Ducks don't have much to offer in return. Who are the Ducks going to offer up? Rickard Rackel?</p>
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There's far more in their system than you realize, my friend. Don't underestimate Bob Murray.... The man knows how to draft.
The Hockey News ranked the Ducks' farm as the best system in the league. Hawks came in 5th.</p>
<div>
Anyone shocked that this is what the Canucks would ask for? Not me exactly what I thought they would want. Vancouver has zero interest in vet players right now they want youth and they want rebuild blocks. No idea what the Ducks have to offer Vancouver either. Ducks aren't exactly a team in the position to be selling their futures either and they don't have a lot of them to start with. Don't see how Vancouver dealing with the Ducks is easy when the Ducks don't have much to offer in return. Who are the Ducks going to offer up? Rickard Rackel?</p>
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There's far more in their system than you realize, my friend. Don't underestimate Bob Murray.... The man knows how to draft.
The Hockey News ranked the Ducks' farm as the best system in the league. Hawks came in 5th.</p>
Shantz My Pants
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Biggest thing is the ELC contract in today's NHL. We saw it with the Kings, Blues and even Wild. The more you can surround your core with young talented players who are currently cheap, the more you can invest in other guys.
Hawks don't have too many ELC or league minimum contracts on their roster. Eventually, guys like Saad, Leddy, Smith and Shaw might want 3-4 million a year, and you hope that by that point Hossa, Sharp, Seabs are ready to move on to another team. If not, you're stuck in trouble with too many talented players and not enough space to keep them all.
Hawks don't have too many ELC or league minimum contracts on their roster. Eventually, guys like Saad, Leddy, Smith and Shaw might want 3-4 million a year, and you hope that by that point Hossa, Sharp, Seabs are ready to move on to another team. If not, you're stuck in trouble with too many talented players and not enough space to keep them all.
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McKenzie is saying Toews/Kane asking for 12 million per in new contract. How that breaks down and averages out over a long term contract I don't know. Nor do I see how that can be swung without significant trades or a significant increase in the cap. </p>
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Edit: Unless the plan is to gut the roster again next season and plug in patches for the loss of talent as in after the 2010 Cup season.</p>
</p>
Edit: Unless the plan is to gut the roster again next season and plug in patches for the loss of talent as in after the 2010 Cup season.</p>
Forklift
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="winos5" data-cid="233018" data-time="1403799192">
<div>
McKenzie is saying Toews/Kane asking for 12 million per in new contract. How that breaks down and averages out over a long term contract I don't know. Nor do I see how that can be swung without significant trades or a significant increase in the cap. </p>
</p>
Edit: Unless the plan is to gut the roster again next season and plug in patches for the loss of talent as in after the 2010 Cup season.</p>
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Take that number with a mountain of salt. Both players know the simple mathematics of the salary cap, and the more they make the less there is to fill every other spot on the roster. Considering they have the same agent as Crosby, and they've seen how two mountainous contracts can hamstring building a championship-calibre roster, I'd expect whoever fed this number to McKenzie (someone in the Hawks org) is doing it so that whatever these guys get (I'm guessing around 9.5/per for 8) will look like a bargain.</p>
<div>
McKenzie is saying Toews/Kane asking for 12 million per in new contract. How that breaks down and averages out over a long term contract I don't know. Nor do I see how that can be swung without significant trades or a significant increase in the cap. </p>
</p>
Edit: Unless the plan is to gut the roster again next season and plug in patches for the loss of talent as in after the 2010 Cup season.</p>
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</blockquote>
</p>
Take that number with a mountain of salt. Both players know the simple mathematics of the salary cap, and the more they make the less there is to fill every other spot on the roster. Considering they have the same agent as Crosby, and they've seen how two mountainous contracts can hamstring building a championship-calibre roster, I'd expect whoever fed this number to McKenzie (someone in the Hawks org) is doing it so that whatever these guys get (I'm guessing around 9.5/per for 8) will look like a bargain.</p>
Shantz My Pants
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I would expect them to have a cap hit around 8-8.5 million for a cap hit. Maybe less if they realize that they could save the club some money and better the team but I don't think most guys really care about that. If they got anymore than that they are walking into Crosby/Malkin territory and that could get the Hawks in some major trouble down the line.
Variable
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MassHavoc" data-cid="233000" data-time="1403790419">
<div>
Nothing an agent says has ever matter. It's all posturing. He could just as easily be setting Stan up as the bad guy should he get traded, He tells everyone on.... twitter... that his player wants to be here and stan said that he won't be traded, stan can't say anything because he doesn't want to add fuel to the fire, then the agent engineers the trade and boom not the players fault.</p>
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</blockquote>
</p>
Could be that, but I can't remember the last time an agent came out as, I guess vehemently could be the word, as Curran did and specifically stating that the GM told him a trade wasn't happening. I mean, I've heard of agents saying vague things, statements that invoke a lot of gray area, but nothing like this. Maybe there has been, but I can't remember it.</p>
<div>
Nothing an agent says has ever matter. It's all posturing. He could just as easily be setting Stan up as the bad guy should he get traded, He tells everyone on.... twitter... that his player wants to be here and stan said that he won't be traded, stan can't say anything because he doesn't want to add fuel to the fire, then the agent engineers the trade and boom not the players fault.</p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</p>
Could be that, but I can't remember the last time an agent came out as, I guess vehemently could be the word, as Curran did and specifically stating that the GM told him a trade wasn't happening. I mean, I've heard of agents saying vague things, statements that invoke a lot of gray area, but nothing like this. Maybe there has been, but I can't remember it.</p>
phranchk
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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Trev" data-cid="233031" data-time="1403807007">
I would expect them to have a cap hit around 8-8.5 million for a cap hit. Maybe less if they realize that they could save the club some money and better the team but I don't think most guys really care about that. If they got anymore than that they are walking into Crosby/Malkin territory and that could get the Hawks in some major trouble down the line.</p></blockquote>Don't forget that Crosby's contract was signed 2 years ago and Malkin last year. Every year you have to add to it for inflation of salaries. If player values were static from year to year then I'd agree that they'd probably come in around 8.5 million, but I'm guessing that Kane and Toews are going to have close to a $10 million salary hit.
I would expect them to have a cap hit around 8-8.5 million for a cap hit. Maybe less if they realize that they could save the club some money and better the team but I don't think most guys really care about that. If they got anymore than that they are walking into Crosby/Malkin territory and that could get the Hawks in some major trouble down the line.</p></blockquote>Don't forget that Crosby's contract was signed 2 years ago and Malkin last year. Every year you have to add to it for inflation of salaries. If player values were static from year to year then I'd agree that they'd probably come in around 8.5 million, but I'm guessing that Kane and Toews are going to have close to a $10 million salary hit.