Anyone watching Westworld - HBO original series

[nc0gnet0]

To be fair, if technology has advanced far enough to build the hosts, why is it so hard to believe that medicine itself has advanced as well, making William is human still a probability. Which brings us to another thing....the hosts can instantly tell human from other hosts, and all the hosts clearly see William as a human.

 

[Ares]

To be fair, if technology has advanced far enough to build the hosts, why is it so hard to believe that medicine itself has advanced as well, making William is human still a probability. Which brings us to another thing....the hosts can instantly tell human from other hosts, and all the hosts clearly see William as a human.

Well at least in this context... because no one swooped in and brought him to a state-of-the-art medical facility.

He was shot a dozen times, and the only treatment he received was from hosts living like Native Americans in the 19th century.

I mean even the lag time between him getting shot up and then being discovered would be plenty of time to bleed to death internally/externally.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Well at least in this context... because no one swooped in and brought him to a state-of-the-art medical facility.

He was shot a dozen times, and the only treatment he received was from hosts living like Native Americans in the 19th century.

I mean even the lag time between him getting shot up and then being discovered would be plenty of time to bleed to death internally/externally.

You ever see those little wand things they are always using to what I assume is regenerate living tissue on the hosts? I'm talking stuff like that. I get it though. his daughter did have a med pack iirc.

 

[number51]

There is, at the very least one human host hybrid of William around. Remember when young William was giving the old man Delos hybrid a fidelity test in the fire apartment? Well now William is in the same apartment taking the same fidelity test, you don't give those to humans.

Accept the fact that there is a hybrid William and everything else falls into place. It was pretty obvious 3 weeks ago, even before the fidelity test.

[video=youtube;dU9VqYBekhs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dU9VqYBekhs[/video]

 

[nc0gnet0]

There is, at the very least one human host hybrid of William around. Remember when young William was giving the old man Delos hybrid a fidelity test in the fire apartment? Well now William is in the same apartment taking the same fidelity test, you don't give those to humans.

Accept the fact that there is a hybrid William and everything else falls into place. It was pretty obvious 3 weeks ago, even before the fidelity test.

[video=youtube;dU9VqYBekhs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dU9VqYBekhs[/video]

Nope, won't except it. the video you are using is set far in the future, and has no bearing on whether or not season 2 William was a host or not. Future (host) William is in his own future hell.

 

[number51]

Nope, won't except it. the video you are using is set far in the future, and has no bearing on whether or not season 2 William was a host or not. Future (host) William is in his own future hell.

Stop thinking so binary. He is a hybrid, and was clearly a hybrid for at the very least part of season 2, if not all of season 2.

You have your opinion, future medicine is amazing, William is human. I respectfully disagree, as Ares already stated the only medical care William received after multiple gunshots was a glass of water, that is some seriously advanced water. There is a William hybrid out there, we know this, it's confirmed, you want to believe that hybrid was made later despite all the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, sorry man.

We shall see, in two years!

 

[nc0gnet0]

Stop thinking so binary. He is a hybrid, and was clearly a hybrid for at the very least part of season 2, if not all of season 2.

You have your opinion, future medicine is amazing, William is human. I respectfully disagree, as Ares already stated the only medical care William received after multiple gunshots was a glass of water, that is some seriously advanced water. There is a William hybrid out there, we know this, it's confirmed, you want to believe that hybrid was made later despite all the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, sorry man.

We shall see, in two years!

Well, no it's not confirmed as you say. I will allow for the possibility he was a host (after the wagon scene), any sooner greatly cheapens the season two storyline (him killing his own daughter would mean nothing), but I don't personally think he was, ever, in season two. Now, your video, showing William far in the future (hasn't aged) I will agree is indeed a host/hybrid.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/06...st-man-in-black-post-credits-ending-explained

"Co-showrunner Lisa Joy clarified the events of the finale's post-credits scene in a number of interviews - reiterating that the real William did indeed kill his real daughter, and then, unable to reckon with what he'd done, began digging in his arm to try and find a port as a way to excuse his heinous actions. "He’s digging into his own skin for answers and doesn’t find any wires by the time Dolores arrives," she told Deadline. "By the end of this timeline, he’s being shipped out into the real world. He did kill his own daughter, he’s in the prison of his own skin, locked in his own confusion and guilt."

To me it seems quite clear that he was human through all of Season 2. His attempt to dig in his arm was his own desperation to justify the fact that he had just killed his own flesh and blood, because he is a host. If he was a host, the whole scene is a waste. the only possibility that exists is that after this occurred, then he became a host, but I kind of doubt it. The parallel/foreshadowing is that James Delos cannot move past the time when he rejected his son and subsequently never saw him alive again, as documented quite well by Host Logan (also note Logan states that humans are one line of code), and the final credit scene of William is suggesting that the same will be the ultimate fate for William. This was foreshadowed a few times when a host had the opportunity to kill William, but choose not to, opting for a particularly bitter hell for William, one we see him living in the final credits. This is established very clearly that it is somewhere well into the future when this takes place. In case you missed it the interviewer is his host daughter.

Your theory on him being a host (possibly) for all of season two is blown out of the water, only after the wagon scene when he awakes and Delores is there, is it remotely possible that he was then a host.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

Well, no it's not confirmed as you say. I will allow for the possibility he was a host, even though it greatly cheapens the season two storyline (him killing his own daughter would mean nothing), but I don't personally think he was. Now, your video, showing Willaim far in the future (hasn't aged) I will agree is indeed a host/hybrid.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/06...st-man-in-black-post-credits-ending-explained

"Co-showrunner Lisa Joy clarified the events of the finale's post-credits scene in a number of interviews - reiterating that the real William did indeed kill his real daughter, and then, unable to reckon with what he'd done, began digging in his arm to try and find a port as a way to excuse his heinous actions. "He’s digging into his own skin for answers and doesn’t find any wires by the time Dolores arrives," she told Deadline. "By the end of this timeline, he’s being shipped out into the real world. He did kill his own daughter, he’s in the prison of his own skin, locked in his own confusion and guilt."

This was along the point I was making after the penultimate episode. He was mentally losing his humanity. Having the season 2 william be a host or a hybrid would have been awful to the story.

Still don't understand how William survived all those gun shots though.

 

[Ares]

This was along the point I was making after the penultimate episode. He was mentally losing his humanity. Having the season 2 william be a host or a hybrid would have been awful to the story.

Still don't understand how William survived all those gun shots though.

He was in a host/hybrid body.

I think we're blurring lines here.... William is not and has never been a host.

He is a human who had his mind transferred to a host/hybrid body that is far more resilient than a human body.

Him losing his humanity whether he was in his original body or not is the same to me.

 

[nc0gnet0]

He was in a host/hybrid body.

I think we're blurring lines here.... William is not and has never been a host.

He is a human who had his mind transferred to a host/hybrid body that is far more resilient than a human body.

Him losing his humanity whether he was in his original body or not is the same to me.

I don't think that is what the show runner meant when she said the "Real William", the context is quite clear, at that point, William was a human, not a host, not a Hybrid. It also disproves this is who Ford was talking about when he said there was another Hot/hybrid in the park.

 

[Ares]

I don't think that is what the show runner meant when she said the "Real William", the context is quite clear, at that point, William was a human, not a host, not a Hybrid. It also disproves this is who Ford was talking about when he said there was another Hot/hybrid in the park.

I don't know the moment you are talking about.

William was shot a dozen or so times... he wasn't in a human body, period.

The best you came up with was that he may have been healed by miracle medicine like the wands they use to heal synthetic flesh.

Zero evidence of miracle medicine that would have kept him alive, much less healed him so he could go back to walking/riding.

That was not a pure human-body William in those sequences, end of story for me.

 

[nc0gnet0]

I don't know the moment you are talking about.

William was shot a dozen or so times... he wasn't in a human body, period.

The best you came up with was that he may have been healed by miracle medicine like the wands they use to heal synthetic flesh.

Zero evidence of miracle medicine that would have kept him alive, much less healed him so he could go back to walking/riding.

That was not a pure human-body William in those sequences, end of story for me.

Ok, so now even what the show producers state is incorrect?

the show producer quite clearly states in this scene, William is a human, not a host, not a host human hybrid.

[video=youtube_share;KR_mZBTN0PQ]https://youtu.be/KR_mZBTN0PQ[/video]

notice how this is episode 9?

Also notice how both Elsie and William are scanned, and both are cleared as human?

 

[nc0gnet0]

now we have this video

[video=youtube_share;e54Tj96BseA]https://youtu.be/e54Tj96BseA[/video]

That is episode 7.

so unless the events in episode 7, happened after William shot his daughter, then it's impossible William was a host.

But it would make no sense that the events were not chronological, because it is William's daughter that takes him to the rescue team shortly after after he is found by akecheta. This was needed for the chain of events to unfold, that lead to William shooting Elsie, in which we are told by the producer the ""Real William" kills his daughter.

Now, the only question that remains is, where is future Host hybrid William (seen in the credits) been placed in his timeline. it is possible that he is reliving this scene, over and over, as a host, but there can be no argument, (unless the show producer is lying), that the first incarceration of those chain of events was carried out by a very human William.

It was all very clearly foreshadowed in the scene with Delores and Logan.

Also foreshadowed by Akecheta, who, after finding William, tells him that Death is a passage from this brutal world, you don't deserve the exit. had william been a host, this passage would make zero sense, as death is NOT an exit for a host.


End of story

 

[nc0gnet0]

[video=youtube_share;mSf8kyUD0PY]https://youtu.be/mSf8kyUD0PY[/video]

 

[Ares]

Ok, so now even what the show producers state is incorrect?

the show producer quite clearly states in this scene, William is a human, not a host, not a host human hybrid.

[video=youtube_share;KR_mZBTN0PQ]https://youtu.be/KR_mZBTN0PQ[/video]

notice how this is episode 9?

Also notice how both Elsie and William are scanned, and both are cleared as human?

You keep referencing something the producers said... do you have a link to a video of them saying it?

And yes, I think they are full of shit if that is what they said.

No person can get shot that many times and survive without a medevac to a fucking hospital inside of 10 minutes.

 

[nc0gnet0]

You keep referencing something the producers said... do you have a link to a video of them saying it?

And yes, I think they are full of shit if that is what they said.

No person can get shot that many times and survive without a medevac to a fucking hospital inside of 10 minutes.

I have an article quoting one of the producers....

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/06...st-man-in-black-post-credits-ending-explained

Co-showrunner Lisa Joy clarified the events of the finale's post-credits scene in a number of interviews

- reiterating that the

real William did indeed kill

his real daughter,

and then, unable to reckon with what he'd done, began digging in his arm to try and find a port as a way to excuse his heinous actions. "He’s digging into his own skin for answers and doesn’t find any wires by the time Dolores arrives," she told Deadline. "By the end of this timeline, he’s being shipped out into the real world. He did kill his own daughter, he’s in the prison of his own skin, locked in his own confusion and guilt."

 

[Ares]

I have an article quoting one of the producers....

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/06...st-man-in-black-post-credits-ending-explained

Co-showrunner Lisa Joy clarified the events of the finale's post-credits scene in a number of interviews

- reiterating that the

real William did indeed kill

his real daughter,

and then, unable to reckon with what he'd done, began digging in his arm to try and find a port as a way to excuse his heinous actions. "He’s digging into his own skin for answers and doesn’t find any wires by the time Dolores arrives," she told Deadline. "By the end of this timeline, he’s being shipped out into the real world. He did kill his own daughter, he’s in the prison of his own skin, locked in his own confusion and guilt."

That does not confirm his body wasn't a host or hybrid of some kind.

They say the "REAL WILLIAM".... aka not a representation of him but his actual consciousness.

Him failing to find stuff digging into his arm for a few minutes proves nothing to me.

Him getting shot a dozen times and surviving without any real medical care proves a lot to me.

 

[nc0gnet0]

That does not confirm his body wasn't a host or hybrid of some kind.

They say the "REAL WILLIAM".... aka not a representation of him but his actual consciousness.

Him failing to find stuff digging into his arm for a few minutes proves nothing to me.

Him getting shot a dozen times and surviving without any real medical care proves a lot to me.

Oh please, now your grasping at straws.

Co-showrunner Lisa Joy clarified the events of the finale's post-credits scene in a number of interviews - reiterating that the real William did indeed kill his real daughter, and then, unable to reckon with what he'd done, began digging in his arm to try and find a port as a way to excuse his heinous actions. "He’s digging into his own skin for answers and doesn’t find any wires by the time Dolores arrives," she told Deadline. "By the end of this timeline, he’s being shipped out into the real world. He did kill his own daughter, he’s in the prison of his own skin, locked in his own confusion and guilt."

It's plain as day to anyone that can understand context. If your going to say "real William" can be a hybrid, then his daughter could have been one as well (real daughter). It took Bernard all of about 15 seconds to find wires when he dug into his skin. Face it, William was completely human, right until the end credits.

 

[number51]

Hybrid William had his consciousness, so yeah it was the 'real William', nobody ever said human William.

A human would not have survived multiple gunshot wounds with only a glass of water. Massive blood loss =/= dehydration.

Humans are not given fidelity tests, William got a fidelity test, do the math.

There is without a doubt a hybrid version of William in the park in season 2, that is not debatable. One of the big themes of this show is not knowing what time line we are watching, any scene could potentially have been hybrid William.

Two possibilities, either we get three consecutive nc0gnet0 posts, or he spontaneously combusts.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Hybrid William had his consciousness, so yeah it was the 'real William', nobody ever said human William.

Grasping at straws, LMAO. The show runner also said real daughter, guess she was a hybrid too, because, well, she didn't say HUMAN daughter. get out of here with that nonsense.

A human would not have survived multiple gunshot wounds with only a glass of water. Massive blood loss =/= dehydration.

And a host like we see could never be made, not by todays technology, AI isn't self aware, controlling the climate (they do this on the Island), would be impossible, etc etc. But hey, lets except that future technology can do all that, yet at the same time be so ignorant to think medicine would not have advanced at the same pace (oh, by the way, did you catch the part were people don't die by disease anymore?[/quote]

Humans are not given fidelity tests, William got a fidelity test, do the math.

he was given a fidelity test after the season ended, in the final credits. Learn math.

There is without a doubt a hybrid version of William in the park in season 2, that is not debatable. One of the big themes of this show is not knowing what time line we are watching, any scene could potentially have been hybrid William.

This is not hybrid William, your refusal to accept it, even when one of the show-runners specifically state he is not, is blind ignorance.

Two possibilities, either we get three consecutive nc0gnet0 posts, or he spontaneously combusts.

Desperate attempt to salvage some dignity when you have been destroyed, nice try.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/06...st-man-in-black-post-credits-ending-explained

So the Man in Black hasn't been a host all season long, as some fans have speculated (despite his questionable ability to survive multiple gunshot wounds).

Instead, when William wakes up alone and injured outside the Forge, the timeline has shifted to the future, which we don't realize until the post-credits scene - meaning that despite some camera and soundtrack trickery when William is taking the elevator down, there was never any possibility of him coinciding with Bernard on the way up.

http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/westworld/274489/westworld-season-2-finale-is-the-man-in-black-a-host

The finale was so revelatory and confusing in fact that now there seems to be a question regarding something that viewers had long etched into stone: the nature of the Man In Black’s identity. Ed Harris’ William a.k.a. The Man In Black was an early contender for “secret robot” back in season one. It was understandable why: he operates within the park with cruel, machine-like efficiency. As far as the innocent hosts are concerned, he may as well be a Terminator.

Then the show revealed once and for all that not only was William a human being, he was the actual owner of the park. Since then, William’s status has never been in doubt…until now, thanks to a mysterious post-credits sequence in the finale.

Powered by Dailymotion
So what gives? Is The Man In Black a secret robot after all?

The answer remains a definitive no…but also in the distant future kinda maybe. Let me explain. First, it may help to check out our breakdown of the inscrutable post-credits scene. If your link-clicking finger is too tired, here is a helpful TL;DR.

The post-credits scene takes place in the very distant future. The hosts, represented by William’s deceased daughter Emily, are testing William for “fidelity” just like William once tested the data ghost of his father-in-law for fidelity. The scene occurs so far in the future that Ed Harris confirmed to USA Today that the “original” Man In Black is in fact dead. As you know, however, dead men have this habit of not walking around in the flesh. So who is this William? Is he a host?


..................


As for everything that happens before that in the finale – and everything that happens to William in season one and two entirely? Forget it. There’s no host there. He’s all human and always has been. In fact, since the system in The Forge singles him out as “irredeemable,” he may have been the “most human” human on the show.

Just give up already, your making a fool of yourself.