Cubs send Torres to Yankees for Chapman

[DJMoore_is_fat]

What I learned: We pretty much gave them Castro for free. Well, we did get a couple months of shit from Warren....

What I've learned:

Starlin Castro has a .295 ON BASE PERCENTAGE this year.
Starlin Castro still is mediocre/below average at defense.
Adam Warren sucks.

So basically we traded a pile of crap for a pile of crap -- and then returned the pile of crap back.

 

[Ari Bear]

What I learned: We pretty much gave them Castro for free. Well, we did get a couple months of shit from Warren....

Or you can look at like Cubs traded Castro, Torres, McKinney and Crawford for Chapman.

 

[FirstTimer]

Or in the LONG run the trade was this:

Cubs get:
Aroldis Chapman

Yankees Get:
Starlin Castro
Gleybar Torres
Adam Warren
Bill McKinney
Rashad Crawford

Or you can look at like Cubs traded Castro, Torres, McKinney and Crawford for Chapman.

....

Even if you want to argue it's an "overpay" it's not like the Cubs gutted their team or system for Chapman. The only guy with any real potential is Torres in my view. The Cubs are trying to win the World Series and traded for one of the best relievers in baseball and essentially gave up a below average hitting and fielding MIF in Castro, a guy that MIGHT be good someday in Torres and a bunch of non-factors.

Don't understand the hand wringing over this by some

 

[Mr. Cub]

So is he gonna be the closer or a 7-8 inning guy?

We needed the lefty, but if he's the closer we won't be using him in the spot that we really needed. Unless Maddon will just mix and match him and Rondon.

 

[Diehardfan]

**** Julie DiCaro. Talk about a social justice warrior who is always on her soap box.

Still remember her reporting and takes on Kane's rape allegation. She aligned herself with the accuser and was completely bias in her reporting. Fucking garbage.

Then you on that she's horrible at her job. I don't understand how she is still employed and how they allow her to have a show on the weekends.

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She claims she was sexually assaulted. Ever get a look at her? Either it's complete bullshit or was unlucky enough to come across the most undemanding rapist on the planet.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

What I've learned:

Starlin Castro has a .295 ON BASE PERCENTAGE this year.
Starlin Castro still is mediocre/below average at defense.
Adam Warren sucks.

So basically we traded a pile of crap for a pile of crap -- and then returned the pile of crap back.

I was really disappointed in Warren. Friends of mine close to the game talked about scouts raving him and what great stuff he had. We didn't see that here really at all. I was hoping to see him get back to the guy people said he was but I can't say I'll miss him.

 

[chibears55]

Cubs have done 2 things with this trade

1. They strengthen their pen with a tough LHer for playoff when they face Giants or Bats who best hitters are LH

2. They kept the Giants and Nats from improving their bullpen with Chapman and they won't have to face him in playoff of either of those teams got him.

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[anotheridiot]

So is he gonna be the closer or a 7-8 inning guy?

We needed the lefty, but if he's the closer we won't be using him in the spot that we really needed. Unless Maddon will just mix and match him and Rondon.

I guess the yankees tried to extend him and he refused, refused to extend with the cubs. My thought, you use him where you need him. I kind of think Montgomery and Wood will share the lefty role, Rondon the 8th and Chapman the ninth.

you would think part of negotiations for extending him would guarantee him the closer role. He was pretty animate about resigning with the Yankees this offseason, so I guess you use him where you need him if he is not gonna stay.

I dont think Chapman will be too happy not being the closer, but remember, this is a guy that still would rather be a starter.

 

[Boobaby1]

Or you can look at like Cubs traded Castro, Torres, McKinney and Crawford for Chapman.

Or...........you can say that the Cubs freed up some money in dealing Castro to net Ben Zobrist. Therefore, the Cubs scored big in getting the OBP up in having a multiple positioned switch hitter, and added one of the best stoppers in the game for the aforementioned players. I will take the latter two any day.

 

[chibears55]

For those who say Chapman a clubhouse cancer..

Just heard his Yankees teammates didn't want him to go and said he was a great teammate...

For what it worth cause I know how ppl feel about Dusty..
But after being Chapman manager for 4yrs, he wanted to get Chapman to Nats.. So, he didn't think Chapman was a bad clubhouse guy..



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[Mr. Cub]

It could be funny though to see what Rizzo says to him. Remember a couple years ago the Cubs and Reds had that benches clearing deal with Chapman and Rizzo involved.

 

[chibears55]

@CSNMooney: Hector Rondon has no issues with #Cubs making Aroldis Chapman their closer: "If you do have a chance to get that guy, you better take it."

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[oober]

@CSNMooney: Hector Rondon has no issues with #Cubs making Aroldis Chapman their closer: "If you do have a chance to get that guy, you better take it."

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The obvious team answer, he's seems to be a team player. I don't think anyone would say anything else though.

 

[NCChiFan]

In Theo I trust. Great signing.

 

[Bear Pride]

So those of you complaining about getting Chapman, does this mean you cant cheer or get excited when he comes in and closes out games. . Heaven forbid he helps get them to the "gulp" WS and we win it all...

Seriously, how can you not see Epstein just solidified his bullpen that as of last week most on here was calling it horrible ..
He did what most GMs do at deadline deals and went and got 2 very good LH relievers that going to be needed in playoff against nats or Giants who best hitters are LH...

Were you seriously content with just Montgomery and 40 YO Nathan to solidify the pen rest of year and playoffs?

Epstein got 2 solid LH relievers for a WS run and all he basically gave up was a career ML 1st basemen who was blocked and a 19 YO SS who we won't know for 2-3 yrs if he even becomes a steady major leaguer plus if you believe in Russell and Baez, they block him .

So.. great move by Epstein. . Finally good to see an owner and GM with balls and go for it in a year they legitimately have a shot

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Exactly! Furthermore, we endured 2.5 years of people complaining about the Cubs not trying to win games. Tell me, what's wrong with the Cubs now actually trying to win games, and even better, trying to win a WS?!

Isn't that what we all want? For the Cubs to end the 100+ year long misery of not winning a WS? I say bravo for the Cubs going for it! It will be madness when the Cubs kill the goat. Why not go for it now?

They didn't give up too much future to get it done, and Theo is still here to work some drafting/trades/magic as he's proved to everyone that he can!

Personally, I can't fathom that people are not happy that the Cubs are not selling, and more importantly, they are going for a WS win. Seriously, when is the last time that we have seen that?

I say "Go Cubs"!

 

[RacerX]

Kinda reminds me of the go-for-it play that Stan B. made for Andrew Ladd. I supported that move, even though it didn't work out. Difference here is twofold, Cubbies had/have a non-depleted fam team, and there's no cap in baseball. Cubs are so stacked with personnel and cash flow, this move is a no-brainier.

 

[FrankieLyrical]

Exactly! Furthermore, we endured 2.5 years of people complaining about the Cubs not trying to win games. Tell me, what's wrong with the Cubs now actually trying to win games, and even better, trying to win a WS?!

Isn't that what we all want? For the Cubs to end the 100+ year long misery of not winning a WS? I say bravo for the Cubs going for it! It will be madness when the Cubs kill the goat. Why not go for it now?

They didn't give up too much future to get it done, and Theo is still here to work some drafting/trades/magic as he's proved to everyone that he can!

Personally, I can't fathom that people are not happy that the Cubs are not selling, and more importantly, they are going for a WS win. Seriously, when is the last time that we have seen that?

I say "Go Cubs"!

Way too much common sense here, man. It's not welcomed.

 

[beckdawg]

Exactly! Furthermore, we endured 2.5 years of people complaining about the Cubs not trying to win games. Tell me, what's wrong with the Cubs now actually trying to win games, and even better, trying to win a WS?!

I've detailed quite verbosely why I didn't like the move. At the end of the day though it largely depends on what Chapman does after the season. If he doesn't re-sign then I really can't see a good argument for how the trade was good. Unless the cubs win the world series and a large number of playoff games come down to him pitching say 2 innings in tight games there's really no way I can justify the price they paid. And considering he was dealt midseason they can't even QO him AFAIK.

I've mentioned this example before but the Red Sox paid a roughly similar package for Kimbrel. They gave up CF Manny Margot(#39 overall prospect), SS Javier Guerra(#49 overall prospect), LHP Logan Allen(50 grade), and 2B/3B Carlos Asuaje(45 grade). Torres is the #24 overall prospect, McKinney is #75, Warren is probably roughly similar value to Logan Allen and Crawford/Asuaje are kind of lottery tickets. The difference is the Red Sox are getting 3 years of Kimbrel. On talent I'd rather have Chapman but 3 years vs 2 months is a bit hard to swallow.

Ultimately, the price on a top 5 closer is just going to be high. That's the way of things but not controlling him beyond this year bothers me. And that's before you consider the domestic violence concerns and whether or not the cubs "need" him. I think you can make an argument the cubs could just let the bullpen play out as is this year and then go after him in FA next year anyways. I'm not sure the trade gives them any real advantage in re-signing him. And if you view things that way, it's hard to look at the price they paid and see value. If you're talking about that sort of price(or more) to acquire a top of the rotation starter even as a rental it makes more sense to me because as we've seen with starters like Bumgarner, starters can get hot and literally just carry a team to the title. It's harder for a reliever to do that.

At this point, it's done so I'm kind of "whatever" on it.

 

[beckdawg]

Also, if this is what 2 months of Chapman is worth, what the hell were the Yanks asking for 3.5 years of Miller? Schwarber + Torres + McKinney + ? Can't really see a reason they keep Miller at these prices. You're talking about adding 4-5 top 100 prospect for 2 relievers.

 

[85Bears]

The deal's done guys. Its all over the news, ESPN reporting it. Chapman for Torres, Warren, McKinney, and Crawford. I think this is a great move. This is the kind of move Epstein makes because he has balls. He wants to win the World Series this year. Aren't you guys about ready for a World Series title of the North Side? This puts us in the drivers seat. After the 6th inning its game over!!

The playoffs are a crap shoot. Even after everything and even if they make more moves everyone loves, there's probably still only a ~25% chance they will win the WS this year. That means there is a 75% chance that they will not...

The only way to improve your chances is to make the playoffs as many times as possible and then get lucky. Theo knows this (and preaches it) which makes me question this move a bit. It feels a bit too much like "win now" mode vs. "win consistently" mode for Theo.

But what the hell, it'll be fun watching Chapman pitch for hopefully 3 months at least...