Cubs trade Rumors Thread

[KBisBack!]

If you can take two pitchers and pony them up for four, you do it in the Cubs condition, no questions asked.

Only you are completely missing one minor detail.

You aren't turning two major league pitchers into four major league pitchers.

You are turning two major league pitchers into four prospects and reality tells you that if even one of the four turn into an above average pitcher you are ahead of the odds.*




* = 100% baseball related content

 

[The Bandit]

Only you are completely missing one minor detail.

You aren't turning two major league pitchers into four major league pitchers.

You are turning two major league pitchers into four prospects and reality tells you that if even one of the four turn into an above average pitcher you are ahead of the odds.*




* = 100% baseball related content

He didn't say 4 Major league pitchers, he said 4 pitchers.

 

[The Bandit]

And that improves the major league roster how?

It doesn't.

All that does is continue the cycle of flipping major league players for lottery tickets like a small market team hoping to get lucky.*




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Major league roster is last on the list to improve drastically. Bring in the loto tickets, win on some flip them for more prospects, riinse, lather, repeat, until the farm is solid enough with enough talent at the top end to make some real splashes.

 

[KBisBack!]

He didn't say 4 Major league pitchers, he said 4 pitchers.

That is my point.*





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[KBisBack!]

Major league roster is last on the list to improve drastically.

I know.

That is the problem.


About 27 other teams worry about the major league roster first.


It seems that only the Cubs, Houston and Miami aren't putting their major league rosters as the top priority.*

Bring in the loto tickets, win on some flip them for more prospects, riinse, lather, repeat, until the farm is solid enough with enough talent at the top end to make some real splashes.

Which could take a decade or longer to actually happen when you ignore the major league roster.*




* = 100% baseball related content.

 

[The Bandit]

Which could take a decade or longer to actually happen when you ignore the major league roster.*




* = 100% baseball related content.

Or it could take 2-5 years, you never know.

 

[KBisBack!]

Or it could take 2-5 years, you never know.

No team in modern history has done it that quickly.

I don't like the odds of the Cubs being the first.*



* = 100% baseball related content

 

[The Bandit]

No team in modern history has done it that quickly.

I don't like the odds of the Cubs being the first.*



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And I've said from the beginning, that the turning point for the team will be between 2014-2015. By turning point, I mean that we won't be just selling everything off at the deadline constantly.

 

[KBisBack!]

And I've said from the beginning, that the turning point for the team will be between 2014-2015. By turning point, I mean that we won't be just selling everything off at the deadline constantly.

And??

So what??

That doesn't mean the team will be a contender or even competitive and could still leave another decade before the team is.*



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[The Bandit]

And??

So what??

That doesn't mean the team will be a contender or even competitive and could still leave another decade before the team is.*



* = 100% baseball related content

baby steps*

*= completely relevant.

 

[Parade_Rain]

And that improves the major league roster how?

It doesn't.

All that does is continue the cycle of flipping major league players for lottery tickets like a small market team hoping to get lucky.*




* = 100% baseball related content

Small market/Large market isn't relevant. The Yankees are going down the crapper and they will be there for a while. Miami? Bought championships with zero sustainability. Good organizations have sustainability. The Cardinals are competitive year after year and they let the likes of Pujols go. Why? Because they make efficient trades/signings and develop their farm hands. These things don't get fixed by waving a magic wand.

 

[CSF77]

Seeing that we are talking about the Ricketts and seeing how Shark has 2 years of control left. Add into this how Shark decided to up his contract value vs extend early. Then looking at the Garza situation unfold and seeing Sharks' situation becoming akin to it. Then looking at the potential core in Daytona 2 years away. That is after said control over said Ace is up. I could see a sell high evolving. Don't matter if it is1 said ace for 2 potentials. It's about ownership not poning up the cash so you have to make the stars align at the same time.

 

[The Bandit]

Seeing that we are talking about the Ricketts and seeing how Shark has 2 years of control left. Add into this how Shark decided to up his contract value vs extend early. Then looking at the Garza situation unfold and seeing Sharks' situation becoming akin to it. Then looking at the potential core in Daytona 2 years away. That is after said control over said Ace is up. I could see a sell high evolving. Don't matter if it is1 said ace for 2 potentials. It's about ownership not poning up the cash so you have to make the stars align at the same time.

Garza unfortunately is looking like he will be gone more and more each day, Shark will only be traded for a very large amount. Theo isn't gonna deal the future or well current ace of the staff with 2 years of control for equal value, he'll get a ton or he'll hold on to him until the time comes to either sign him long term or ship him out at the deadline next year or the year after.

 

[mountsalami]

And I've said from the beginning, that the turning point for the team will be between 2014-2015. By turning point, I mean that we won't be just selling everything off at the deadline constantly.

Great point and I agree !!!!

With the 2014-15 season being so far away I would venture that the Cubs wouldn't miss pitchers like Shark and Garza one bit.

The "turning point" will be one of pure euphoria, during the said season, and matches that exact defintion provided by our great leadership at Command Central of "sustained success." *


* = 100% Pure Special person baseball content provided by myself.

:fap:

 

[KBisBack!]

baby steps*

*= completely relevant.

When you have as far to improve as the Cubs do, you need to do better than baby steps.

Baby steps will put you back to the at least a decade prediction that I made earlier.*




* = 100% baseball related content

 

[KBisBack!]

Small market/Large market isn't relevant.

Yeah it is. When you are a large market team being run like a small market team it means you are wasting resources.

Small market teams have to throw all their eggs in the prospect basket. Large market teams can do BOTH.*

The Yankees are going down the crapper and they will be there for a while.

LOL!!! Yeah ok.

The Yankees will be back in the playoffs long before the Cubs are.*

The Cardinals are competitive year after year and they let the likes of Pujols go. Why? Because they make efficient trades/signings and develop their farm hands

But they also do this while making every effort to field the best major league team possible.

Not throwing away seasons in order to get a better draft pick.

They do the best of doing BOTH.*

These things don't get fixed by waving a magic wand.

Things don't get fixed by consistently trading major league players for lottery tickets either.*


* = knowing that one step forward to take three steps back doesn't equal progress.

 

[CSF77]

I would use Mat Latos as a scale for return value. He got back Volquez, Alonso, Grandal and Boxberger. He had 4 years of control remaining. Shark has 1/2 the control left. Talent is close. 1-2 in the league. So I'd guess a solid return is 1 top prospect and a #3 starter that can start on Sharks next start. That is his fair market value. Garza is worth less in return. 2 months of control. His return value should top out at what Dempster's did. Except Dempster was better last year then Garza this year. Seeing this is a rental and all. Getting 2 fringe is what to expect unless a team gets desperate.

 

[mountsalami]

I would use Mat Latos as a scale for return value. He got back Volquez, Alonso, Grandal and Boxberger. He had 4 years of control remaining. Shark has 1/2 the control left. Talent is close. 1-2 in the league. So I'd guess a solid return is 1 top prospect and a #3 starter that can start on Sharks next start. That is his fair market value. Garza is worth less in return. 2 months of control. His return value should top out at what Dempster's did. Except Dempster was better last year then Garza this year. Seeing this is a rental and all. Getting 2 fringe is what to expect unless a team gets desperate.

The Cubs are desparate to shed payroll to fill the litter box with more turds.

I can't imagine it would take much to get a trade deal done for Garza.

We have players like Edwin Jackson to get us through in the meantime, so you can sleep easy.

 

[Parade_Rain]

Yeah it is. When you are a large market team being run like a small market team it means you are wasting resources.

It means the previous administration didn't know what they were doing and all the pieces aren't available to win.

Small market teams have to throw all their eggs in the prospect basket. Large market teams can do BOTH.*

St Louis is a much smaller market. They don't throw all their eggs in the prospect basket. They smartly acquire FA's, too.

LOL!!! Yeah ok.

The Yankees will be back in the playoffs long before the Cubs are.*

And? what you stated doesn't refute that the farm system needs to be built up. This is why after all the FA signings and trades the Yankees have done over the years, they don't have much left in the tank to replenish the geriatrics that are going to be cycling out.

But they also do this while making every effort to field the best major league team possible.

Not throwing away seasons in order to get a better draft pick.

They do the best of doing BOTH.*

As have the Cubs, unless you think all those everyday acquisitions they made this year that are now tradeable didn't improve the club.

Things don't get fixed by consistently trading major league players for lottery tickets either.*


* = knowing that one step forward to take three steps back doesn't equal progress.

Sure it can. The results just aren't necessarily immediate.

 

[KBisBack!]

It means the previous administration didn't know what they were doing and all the pieces aren't available to win.

Bullshit.

Only idiots continue to blame the previous administration.

There has been more than enough time to have the major league team improve. It hasn't happened.

Anything else is just making excuses.*

St Louis is a much smaller market. They don't throw all their eggs in the prospect basket. They smartly acquire FA's, too.

That is called doing BOTH. Something the Cubs are not doing. Thanks for proving my point.*

And? what you stated doesn't refute that the farm system needs to be built up. This is why after all the FA signings and trades the Yankees have done over the years, they don't have much left in the tank to replenish the geriatrics that are going to be cycling out.

Never have said that the farm system doesn't need to be built up.

Please stick to the facts and not making up stuff when you have nothing intelligent to say.

I have said the Cubs need to improve the major league roster while building up the farm system.

As to the Yankees, the still have resources to rebuild the major league roster. It is called cash.

Like I have said before, the Yankees will make the playoffs long before and multiple times before the Cubs do*

As have the Cubs, unless you think all those everyday acquisitions they made this year that are now tradeable didn't improve the club.

When most of this 'tradable' talent gets traded for 50 cents on the dollar, no that doesn't improve the ball club.

Every trade the Cubs will likely make between now and the deadline will be major league players for minor league lottery tickets.

One step forward and three steps back.*

Sure it can. The results just aren't necessarily immediate.

Yeah. History and reality have shown that successful results generally take at least a decade or longer.*



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