Deceive without Lying

[Nail Polish]

I looked up lie, and it gave a list of what Obama promised us

 

[Scoot26]

Welp, time to move this thread to the B&I forum.

Sent from the mod station in Nome, Alaska.

 

[brett05]

I looked up lie, and it gave a list of what Obama promised us

You're back! :hi5:

 

[brett05]

Welp, time to move this thread to the B&I forum.

Sent from the mod station in Nome, Alaska.

Why?

 

[clonetrooper264]

Why?

Joke

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Lets just end this already. From Merriam Webster:





So, they are closely related as we would all agree. But not the same as a lie requires only an attempt to make one believe the untrue statement and amdeceive requires its successful completion. Also, a lie requires an untrue statement and a deception does not. However, Spartan states they are synonymous and therefore the same thing. I'm sure no one would disagree that they are synonymous. But does synonymous require the same definition?



Okay, so there you have it. Deceive can be and is synonymous with lie based on having nearly the same meaning in some senses, but it's not exactly the same as described above.

Don't believe me, or the definitions provided? How about a journal article on this very subject from Stanford:

http://Plato.Stanford.edu/entries/lying-definition/#TraDefDec

Finally, here's an example if you don't believe me: you and I are good friends. We are hanging out and I tell you I won that billion dollar lottery. Except you know I didn't leave the state and no winning tickets were sold in the state and all winning tickets were sold on the other side of the country where you know I know no one and I have never been. As a result, you know I'm lying and dont believe it. I've lied to you, but you don't believe me. Therefore, I have not deceived you.

You are wrong again. Don't need people to go all philosopher and try to change the meaning of simple words to suit their needs. There are many words which have more than 1 meaning, lying and deceiving are not among them. If you are attempting to deceive someone, you will have to misrepresent the truth in some way.

Your example is also very stupid. If you tell somebody an unbelievable lie, it will be discounted no matter. You still made the attempt to deceive them but they were not deceived because they discounted what you said because it was so stupid. Let me say it again so you can understand. A lie is an untruth. If you lie to somebody, it is a lie whether they choose to believe it or not. You lied, and that lie is not dependent on another person believing it. It's just a fact that you made an untruthful statement. If I blow it off cause I recognize it as stupid and an outright lie, that doesn't mean you didn't lie cause you clearly did. Same goes for deceiving. You attempted to deceive with a lie. I didn't buy it. It doesn't mean you weren't trying to deceive. It just means I gave no merit to what you said.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Nah everything in the English language is black and white, its a lie or not a lie.

If you use sarcasm with Sparty he will scream LIAR!!!!!!!! and then cut off your head, carve the word LIAR in your forehead and stake it out front of his house.

Do you think I'm associated with ISIS or something? I'm VP material here.

There are many words in our language that can be taken in more than one way even when used in the same context. Lie and deceiving just happen to be those type words that define themselves and really can't be taken any other way.

 

[Urblock]

VPs know how to lie.

 

[The Hawk]

Welp, time to move this thread to the B&I forum.

Sent from the mod station in Nome, Alaska.

Oh darn. Now I can't read about Obama's lies. Still haven't got a reason why I was banned, speaking about lies

 

[Warrior Spirit]

VPs know how to lie.

If I ever lie to you the people. Rest assured it will be for your own good.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Oh darn. Now I can't read about Obama's lies. Still haven't got a reason why I was banned, speaking about lies

Did they deceive you, friend?

As future Veep of this great nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all, I ask the fine moderators to free the Hawk. Let him be free.... just like a bird. And, further more, to compensate Hawk for the oppression that has been brought down upon him, I promise to make my first act as Veep a motion to make the Hawk Murica's NEW national symbol!

 

[Tjodalv]

Bwahaha...is this going to be another of Da Cawk's "I'm a little *****, why did they revoke my B&I privileges" threads? Looks like it's off to a good start!

 

[Bearin' Down]

You are wrong again. Don't need people to go all philosopher and try to change the meaning of simple words to suit their needs. There are many words which have more than 1 meaning, lying and deceiving are not among them. If you are attempting to deceive someone, you will have to misrepresent the truth in some way.

Your example is also very stupid. If you tell somebody an unbelievable lie, it will be discounted no matter. You still made the attempt to deceive them but they were not deceived because they discounted what you said because it was so stupid. Let me say it again so you can understand. A lie is an untruth. If you lie to somebody, it is a lie whether they choose to believe it or not. You lied, and that lie is not dependent on another person believing it. It's just a fact that you made an untruthful statement. If I blow it off cause I recognize it as stupid and an outright lie, that doesn't mean you didn't lie cause you clearly did. Same goes for deceiving. You attempted to deceive with a lie. I didn't buy it. It doesn't mean you weren't trying to deceive. It just means I gave no merit to what you said.

Nice examples. What are you basing it on? Its not the definitions

 

[BearDen]

Oh darn. Now I can't read about Obama's lies. Still haven't got a reason why I was banned, speaking about lies

True. It's such a shame they deleted the 60 page thread without explaining it to you, and then started another 60 page thread (they couldn't have changed the title, that's just impossible) and still didn't explain it to you. I WANT THE DAMN TRUTH. Poor #FullHawk

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Nice examples. What are you basing it on? Its not the definitions

It's the only definition, son. You are the weakest link. Good bye.

 

[Scoot26]

Oh darn. Now I can't read about Obama's lies. Still haven't got a reason why I was banned, speaking about lies

Its been explained to you like 27 times. Get over it already and stop being a broken record.

 

[The Hawk]

Bwahaha...is this going to be another of Da Cawk's "I'm a little *****, why did they revoke my B&I privileges" threads? Looks like it's off to a good start!

Hey, TJ............ The guy talked about moving something to the B&I thread and I am banned from it for no reason so I said what I said. You say this shit to me from the safety of a couple of thousand of miles. Well, how about this? Your tag line TJ must mean "THE JAG-OFF, right? By how you respond to people smarter than you, who are most people, you must be a couple of steps IQ wise below an aardvark.

So, TJ............You are the little *****. You are a pissant who insults from the safety of being an immature fool on an internet board. I didn't attack you. You attacked me. You called me a little *****. Bwahaha, yourself. So bend over and take it in the ass like you enjoy it so, little *****

 

[The Hawk]

True. It's such a shame they deleted the 60 page thread without explaining it to you, and then started another 60 page thread (they couldn't have changed the title, that's just impossible) and still didn't explain it to you. I WANT THE DAMN TRUTH. Poor #FullHawk

They deleted the thread because a lot of people got upset about the lies and deceit prevalent here by the powers to be. A lot of people know that. BTW **** off.

 

[Tjodalv]

So cute. You should continue to whine about things that have been explained to you repeatedly from the comfort of your hoveround; it's a very safe place when you don't have to back up your internet big man talk, isn't it?

 

[The Hawk]

Its been explained to you like 27 times. Get over it already and stop being a broken record.

Liar. You impugned me and I am not letting you off of the hook. Nothing that I said was racist, bigoted, condemnation of all Moslems, or anything else. I DARE YOU to put it out there for everyone to see, namely the specific details of what I supposedly said that was so damned wrong and controversial. What are you assholes so fucking scared of, anyway? IF you are not COWARDS, put it out there for all to see. Go ahead and try and embarrass me Scoot; Can't do it can you? So apologize for your action and lets go on. I am a forgiving person

The TRUTH IS that there was an argument about Islamic terrorism, a heated argument certainly. But in that argument I never attacked anyone personally although I was personally attacked by several. I defended myself and some cowards cut me off from that forum without even telling me and then several of you assholes had a lot of fun fucking around with me for several days, cowards that you are. Yeah, Scoot, cowards. Why did you and your "boys" do it, Scoot? Was that warranted? Do you think that you would do this kind of shit to me when I was around, Scoot? Hilarious!

So then I was told just to be a good boy, don't talk bad about you mods that had a fucking field day at my expense, and MAYBE I'll be reinstated. So I played nice and still not a fucking thing happened so I complained once again and got attacked again.

Who in the hell are you anyway, to tell me that I am a fucking broken record when others call me a little ***** in this very thread and not a fucking thing happens? This "little *****", half fucking blind as he is would just love to be up front and personal with some of these people who talk shit from afar. This board has a bias that is amazing. A bias that really wants to shut up anyone who has a political bent other than theirs. It is amazing. Truly amazing.

You banned me, Scoot. so show the fucking evidence that I am some kind of a racist, bigoted, homophobic, anti-Islamic, sexist, asshole that you and your ilk have accused me of. Shit that by all sensible principles should have merited these cretins a suspension off of this board. I challenge you, Scoot. PROVE IT or SHUT THE **** UP!