Derrick Rose needs to become a TRUE Point Guard!

Commodore K'nection

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Here is Derrick's shooting line from the 5 games vs the Heat:

G1: 10 / 22 for 45%
G2: 7 / 23 for 30%
G3: 8 / 19 for 42%
G4: 8 / 27 for 30%
G5: 9 / 29 for 31%


These are horrible shooting numbers. A PG should never average more than 20 shots a game. The reason we lost this series is because we have a 6-2 PG playing like a 6-6 Kobe Bryant instead of getting his teammates involved. Allen Iverson has never won a championship because little men who shoot a lot cannot shoot a high percentage. Why is this? Because little men are limited in how they can score.

At 6-2 with short arms, Derrick cannot 1) Post up like Barkley, or 2) shoot a fadeway like MJ, or 3) shoot over the top like Dirk Nowitzki. Rose is limited in how he can attack and thus takes so many bad shots resulting in poor efficiency on offense. If Derrick Rose were 6-6, then shooting 30 times a game is acceptable like Kobe or LeBron.

In order for us to go to the promised land next season, this off-season Derrick needs to work on one thing: HIS PASSING. Last off-season he improved his 3-pt shooting. So between his floaters, mid-range game and 3s his offense is covered. But it's time to improve his play-making ability.

Derrick is so explosive that if he can facilitate the offense, it will keep defenses off-balance. Kind of like running the ball in football. If you throw all the time, your offense becomes predictable. But if you can run the ball (ie make plays for your teammates), defenses will be on their heels not knowing where the attacker will be coming from.

First of all, to be a TRUE PG you have to have the mentality that you're gonna create for your teammates. This means Derrick needs to stop fixating on the hoop and learn to read a defense instead. For example check out this video of Ricky Rubio, a true PG that looks to make plays for his teammates. Instead of throwing up a wild shot or getting blocked, Rubio gets easy buckets for his team:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K0krs9RtyQ]YouTube - ‪Ricky Rubio one man show :)‬‏[/ame]

If we are going to maximize Rose's talents, he needs to dedicate himself this off-season to honing his passing. Work on developing his instincts, watch film, study great passers, learn passing angles, and understand where teammates like to get the ball on the floor. Nobody can keep Derrick out of the lane 1-on-1. So when he drives, it takes two guys to cut him off, somebody is going to be open. Instead of jacking up a wild shot, learn how to find the open teammate like Rubio above. When Rubio drives, he's not staring at the goal, he's watching the defense and his teammates.

Furthermore, Derrick needs to study how Steve Nash uses the bounce pass. The Phoenix Suns practically score at will because of their pick-and-roll. You can create passing lanes between two defenders trying to defend a passing lane by throwing it in the hole below their arms between their legs. Instead Rose doesn't understand passing angles because he thinks like a scorer. If he can't pass it over the top then he thinks the teammate is not open, but he is open, you just have to use the floor as leverage to get the ball past the defense.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FcVuag7KvE]YouTube - ‪Steve Nash Pick and Roll 2004-2010‬‏[/ame]

Taj has already proven he can dunk through and over people. Use Taj as our version of Amare Stoudemire. Run the pick-and-roll, send both guys rolling to the basket, throw the bounce pass between the hole in the defense and let Taj posterize the rotating weak-side help. If the defender stays home on the screener, THEN and ONLY THEN should Rose attack because Rose would have a clear path to the basket. Involving teammates with the passing game will enable Rose to shoot a higher percentage as well as up his assist totals. If Rose can average 21 pts and 11 assists a game next year, we would be much better off in going into the playoffs.

Seriously, between developing Rubio's behind-the-back pass, and Steve Nash's through-the-defense bounce pass, Derrick Rose could be impossible to guard. I know everyone says we need to get a 2-guard etc. I disagree, we need Derrick reach his full potential as a Point Guard. Unless we get Derrick to focus on being a facilitator instead of being "The Man", we won't be able to get past Miami. C'mon Coach Thibs! Get in the Gym with Derrick, watch film, teach him to read defenses and turn Derrick into the TRUE point guard that can bring us a championship.
 
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nwfisch

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It's easy to criticize, but if the Bulls won this series, would this post be here? I doubt it.

Do you honestly think Rose does this on his own? Again, I doubt it.

Thibodeau has to be more creative with his offensive sets.
 

James Dwayne Bosh III

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Allen Iverson has never won a championship because little men who shoot a lot cannot shoot a high percentage. Why is this? Because little men are limited in how they can score.

Very true.

Little guys, in the playoffs, who drive the paint get knocked around and lots of times don't get fouls called their way because it's too easy for the big guys to knock them off just a bit to make them miss the shot and not draw a foul. Iverson, as you pointed out, was known for having this happen to him. Rose is in the same situation and he's not the only small guy this happens to.
 

Bullsman24

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that's just not the type of player that derrick rose is. rose isn't a steve nash type of player who is effective when he finds seams, he's a player who is at his passing best when he gets into the lane and draws the defense.

i would even compare him more to a better passing dwyane wade than magic johnson, and wade won a title at 6'4"
 

nwfisch

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that's just not the type of player that derrick rose is. rose isn't a steve nash type of player who is effective when he finds seams, he's a player who is at his passing best when he gets into the lane and draws the defense.

i would even compare him more to a better passing dwyane wade than magic johnson, and wade won a title at 6'4"

Wade won a title with the best center at the time. The Bulls need to acquire the best of the present from Orlando.
 

houheffna

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Wade won a title with the best center at the time. The Bulls need to acquire the best of the present from Orlando.

WOW! When did you come around to that idea? We've been arguing back and forth on that all season...
 

Commodore K'nection

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that's just not the type of player that derrick rose is. rose isn't a steve nash type of player who is effective when he finds seams, he's a player who is at his passing best when he gets into the lane and draws the defense. i would even compare him more to a better passing dwyane wade than magic johnson, and wade won a title at 6'4"

Here is the line for Game 6 vs the Atlanta Hawks.

Derrick Rose: 8-14 FG 19 pts 12 ast

Carlos Boozer: 10-16 FG 23 pts

Luol Deng: 6-14 FG 13 pts

Taj Gibson: 5-7 FG 10 pts

TEAM FG Percentage was 53%


You guys remember this game?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0hFv1vFJ80"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0hFv1vFJ80[/ame]

Derrick Rose shot the ball only 14 times, but shot at 57%. We blew out the Hawks to finish the series. In this game, Derrick makes the kind of passes that we need him to make more routinely as the leader of the offense.

I'll break it down for you:

- At the 8-second mark, Derrick makes a give and go pass to Boozer for an easy finish. As a PG, rewarding teammates for attacking the basket gives them incentive to move without the ball. ASSIST

- At the 22-second mark, Derrick makes a great drive and kick pass. Instead of driving to the lane with tunnel vision and forcing up a bad shot, getting blocked or making an offensive foul--like he did continually in the Heat series--Rose kept his eye on the floor and kicked it to an open teammate. ASSIST

- At the 1:14-second mark, Derrick uses a pick by Boozer, and throws it over the top of the 2 defenders for an easy jumpshot. ASSIST

- At the 1:22-second mark, Derrick uses the same pick by Boozer, makes the same over the top pass for another easy jumpshot. ASSIST

-At the 1:40-second mark, Derrick uses the pick by Boozer and makes the "Steve Nash" pass. He throws it into the hole between the two defenders arms to a wide-open Boozer. ASSIST

-At the 1:56-second mark, he does the same thing AGAIN. Uses the Boozer pick, throws the "Steve Nash" bounce pass into the indefensible hole to a wide-open Boozer for another jump shot. ASSIST


I disagree that Derrick CANNOT do these things as a point guard. He CAN be the kind of passer that Nash is, the question is IS HE WILLING TO BE? Rose wants to attack and score so badly, he gets tunnel vision and forces shots. To be a great point guard, you have to see the whole floor and not just the basket. The defenders on the floor is like a game of chess. When one defender moves out of position, you have to make the read and find the teammate that can do the most damage.
 
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FirstTimer

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The Bulls don't have the players around Rose for him to be that Nash type player on a consistant basis. 2/5th of their starting lineup aren't good offensive players. Deng can't create on his own, and Boozerisn't anywhere near the type of PF that Nash has had. I see your point but as of right now the Bulls aren't built to win with Rose doing more dishing than shooting
 

TheINFLUENCE

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It would probably help him if he actually had some shooters around him... just sayin.

Bogans is shit, Boozer and Deng need to step their game up.
 

MRN

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Yeah, you're right. The MVP needs to change the way he plays the game.

SMH.
 

Commodore K'nection

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Yeah, you're right. The MVP needs to change the way he plays the game.

SMH.


Did Derrick Rose play like an MVP in any way this series? He was the WORST player on the floor for our team, I have no problem saying that. When we had CJ Watson on the floor, we actually increased the lead. Watson had a +/- of +4, second best on the team for this game.

When Rose came back in, we couldn't score, turned the ball over and took bad shots. Rose had a -7, easily the worst on the team. It's not a coincidence, but oh, he's the MVP, its ok it's not his fault, his teammates suck.

LeBron completely outplayed our MVP by continually getting his teammates involved. If your suggesting Rose keep playing the way he plays, then good luck to us because we will never get past the Miami Heat.
 

Commodore K'nection

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It would probably help him if he actually had some shooters around him... just sayin.

Bogans is shit, Boozer and Deng need to step their game up.


What do Hakim Warrick, Robin Lopez and Marcin Gortat have in common? None of them can shoot. Doesn't stop Steve Nash from creating offense for his team.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7x09WmmyPs&feature=related]YouTube - ‪Hakim Warrick VICIOUS dunk on Yi Jianlian (Dec. 5, 2010)‬‏[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt9BqNhp6JA"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt9BqNhp6JA[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEgxFYDsUh8&feature=player_embedded]YouTube - ‪NBA Assist of the Night on Friday 12.11.2010 - Nash to Warrick (Phoenix Suns) for layup‬‏[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzTbBtA-dyw&feature=related]YouTube - ‪Robin Lopez sets the screen then takes a nice feed from Steve Nash‬‏[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MULyPpbResc]YouTube - ‪Steve Nash gives the assist to Marcin Gortat for the dunk‬‏[/ame]

Taj Gibson, Omer Asik, Joakim Noah and Carlos Boozer can all finish. It's up to Derrick to set them up by being a better play-maker. We can either get rid of our whole team and find better players, or we can keep the guys that we have, and get Derrick to give them the ball where they can make plays.
 

FirstTimer

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Did Derrick Rose play like an MVP in any way this series? He was the WORST player on the floor for our team,
Your argument lost all credibility with that statement.

When Rose came back in, we couldn't score, turned the ball over and took bad shots. Rose had a -7, easily the worst on the team. It's not a coincidence, but oh, he's the MVP, its ok it's not his fault, his teammates suck.
+/- is a terrible stat to use in basketball. A players personnal +/- can be affected by literally 9 other people on the floor and have very little to do with the way they personally played.

LeBron completely outplayed our MVP by continually getting his teammates involved.
Because LeBron's teammates are better and/or stepped up. Miami is and was the better team. You're over thinking the issue.The Bulls weren't good enough to beat the Heat and didn't play well. I can't name any Bull that played well the entire series. The Heat had 2 of their 3 best players have very good/fantastic series...and got some big games from some bench players.

It's not rocket science.
 

MRN

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Did Derrick Rose play like an MVP in any way this series? He was the WORST player on the floor for our team, I have no problem saying that. When we had CJ Watson on the floor, we actually increased the lead. Watson had a +/- of +4, second best on the team for this game.

When Rose came back in, we couldn't score, turned the ball over and took bad shots. Rose had a -7, easily the worst on the team. It's not a coincidence, but oh, he's the MVP, its ok it's not his fault, his teammates suck.

LeBron completely outplayed our MVP by continually getting his teammates involved. If your suggesting Rose keep playing the way he plays, then good luck to us because we will never get past the Miami Heat.

Don't pull out the +/-, it's a terrible measure of how well you play.

If you want to be that ignorant asshole that blames the 22 year old MVP for losing to the Miami Heat (the most star studded team in the league) than go ahead.

If we add a two guard and a low post scorer, we will compete for a long time. That's all there is too know.
 

MRN

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Taj Gibson, Omer Asik, Joakim Noah and Carlos Boozer can all finish. It's up to Derrick to set them up by being a better play-maker. We can either get rid of our whole team and find better players, or we can keep the guys that we have, and get Derrick to give them the ball where they can make plays.

The only decent finisher in that bunch is Taj, and I'd say he isn't that great. Not one of those guys can be reliable in the paint. Boozers game is mid range, Noah is pretty bad on offense and Omer is a clean up guy on the boards.
 

FirstTimer

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What do Hakim Warrick, Robin Lopez and Marcin Gortat have in common? None of them can shoot. Doesn't stop Steve Nash from creating offense for his team.

Taj Gibson, Omer Asik, Joakim Noah and Carlos Boozer can all finish. It's up to Derrick to set them up by being a better play-maker. We can either get rid of our whole team and find better players, or we can keep the guys that we have, and get Derrick to give them the ball where they can make plays.

Nash also runs a completely different system than the Bulls do that speads the floor and opens lanes and is a pure fast break/motion offense. The Bulls offense isn't set up to open the same passing lanes and chances the Suns offense is. It's REALLY easy to understand.
 

FirstTimer

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The only decent finisher in that bunch is Taj, and I'd say he isn't that great. Not one of those guys can be reliable in the paint. Boozers game is mid range, Noah is pretty bad on offense and Omer is a clean up guy on the boards.

This.



I'm starting to be convinced this guy has no idea how to play the game.
 
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Commodore K'nection

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Boozer Finishing (ironically from Derrick Rose using the Steve Nash pass)

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9z2FM_ZD6Xc]YouTube - ‪Dunk of the Night: Carlos Boozer One-Handed Dunk against the Hawks (Game 5, May 10, 2011)‬‏[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caXf33F5rW4"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caXf33F5rW4[/ame]

Omer Asik finishing with CJ Watson pass

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_Jq--UrERo&feature=related]YouTube - ‪C J Watson assist Omer Asik cutting the paint for the huge two hand jam vs Denver Nuggets‬‏[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2oyja54bB4"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2oyja54bB4[/ame]

Taj Gibson finishing

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWnf3TyYdQQ&feature=related]YouTube - ‪Chicago Bulls: Taj Gibson A BEAST‬‏[/ame]

Joakim Noah finishing

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GOowP3BSeQ&feature=related]YouTube - ‪Joakim Noah 2 dunks vs Cleveland‬‏[/ame]

More Boozer

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDYhkyJN-40]YouTube - ‪Carlos Boozer Slams Down A Killer Dunk On Gilbert Arenas‬‏[/ame]


You're telling me our big guys are scrubbier than Phoenix's? The key to allowing our bigs to finish is 1) Derrick draws the double team and allow the bigs to get a full head of steam to the basket unimpeded. 2) Derrick has to understand how to MAKE THE PASS where all the big has to do is catch and dunk.

But so often Derrick takes it upon himself to create offense, we have guys on the floor who can help but are standing around watching D-Rose take on 2 or 3 guys in the paint.
 
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