Game of Thrones Thread

[nc0gnet0]

No, I think her having an arrow pointed his way during an attack on Castle Black had much more to do with it. She was taken out before she could take that shot. Didn't she shoot him with 3 arrows a while before that too? She can play the scorned lover but she knew what Jon was doing and had to do.

yes, she did, but never tried for the kill shot. Tormund even confronted her about that.
but, I think you missed the point. Jon was with the Wildlings under false pretenses, and lied to Ygritte about his intentions.

 

[nc0gnet0]

I will exit this bizarre debate with the undeniable fact that going to a budget meeting is decidedly worse than getting drunk and fucking, that is the very definition of smart. King Bobby was an idiot, but he was smart enough to know drunk fucking > budget meetings.

Back on topic, Jon is a boy scout, not necessarely a faverable trait in a king, you want a king with a bit of ruthless in him.

With out getting into the smart or not smart political moves, killing children is the definition of cowardly. And wasn't it his drunkeness that got him killed? Brilliant!

 

[Warrior Spirit]

yes, she did, but never tried for the kill shot. Tormund even confronted her about that.
but, I think you missed the point. Jon was with the Wildlings under false pretenses, and lied to Ygritte about his intentions.

Jon was there on a specific mission. The only dishonorable thing he could have done is to not complete his undercover mission as he was told to do. Ygritte knew it all along. She even said, "you didn't stop being a crow when you walked into Mance Rayder's camp." Jon said nothing to correct her or claim otherwise. The show pointed out the obvious over and over and showed that she had full knowledge of what he was doing. He even told her that her people should not attack his brothers cause they had done it 6 times in the past and lost all 6 times. He said if you all try it again, you will lose again cause you don't know how to fight.

 

[remydat]

That's not him.

Tell that to Brienne Cog as he trying to compare Jamie and Jon. Shit is laughable.

 

[remydat]

Yawn, he told her that so she wouldn't follow him, etc etc. Seen that tired old troupe numerous times. No shock value in Jamie killing Cersei if you don't believe he still lovers her, now is there? Or haven't you figured that out yet?

Nothing he said was untrue. He did cripple a boy for Cersei, he did kill people to get back to her and he would have murdered everyone in River Run for her.

Tommen committed suicide because of his mom and Jamie still stood by her. He also told everyone when he came to Winterfell that he would do it all over again.

So you keep holding out for some grand redemption when the dude has told you the truth about himself. Killing Cersei isnt going to change the fundametal nature of who he is esepcially if it is a case of him killing her when Dany, Arya et all would have killed her anyway. In fact his killing her would probably be a mercy for what Dany or Arya have planned.

 

[ZOMBIE@CTESPN]

 

[remydat]

Jamie cold nah. Dude take Brienne virginity and dip out right after.

Tormund would have at least shared a mug of Giant's milk with her before leaving.

 

[payton 34ever]

I wish.

Redirect Notice

Totally fine with it, as long as he dies in a brutal fashion in the episode.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Jon was there on a specific mission. The only dishonorable thing he could have done is to not complete his undercover mission as he was told to do. Ygritte knew it all along. She even said, "you didn't stop being a crow when you walked into Mance Rayder's camp." Jon said nothing to correct her or claim otherwise. The show pointed out the obvious over and over and showed that she had full knowledge of what he was doing. He even told her that her people should not attack his brothers cause they had done it 6 times in the past and lost all 6 times. He said if you all try it again, you will lose again cause you don't know how to fight.

I am pretty sure that sleep with and fall in love with a Wildling girl was not part of the mission. Ygritte didn't "know" it, but might have suspected it.

 

[ZOMBIE@CTESPN]

Totally fine with it, as long as he dies in a brutal fashion in the episode.

I hope the mountain just tears him apart like
He did with the religious freak a few seasons ago

 

[nc0gnet0]

Nothing he said was untrue. He did cripple a boy for Cersei, he did kill people to get back to her and he would have murdered everyone in River Run for her.

Tommen committed suicide because of his mom and Jamie still stood by her. He also told everyone when he came to Winterfell that he would do it all over again.

So you keep holding out for some grand redemption when the dude has told you the truth about himself. Killing Cersei isnt going to change the fundametal nature of who he is esepcially if it is a case of him killing her when Dany, Arya et all would have killed her anyway. In fact his killing her would probably be a mercy for what Dany or Arya have planned.

Not surprising, you never really seam to grasp context. It's why you lose so many arguments (albiet in your mind you never lose, you almost always lose in the court of public opinion).

1) when Jamie made the statement in WF, it was in regards to the things they had previously brought up (so this excludes pushing Bran out the window you dolt). What precisely was he accused of? Killing the Mad King (justified) Killing many Northerners (they were at war, justified), Fighting Ned Stark in KL (somewhat justified, the North was holding Tyrion prisoner at the time). Leave it to you to once again try to twist what he said into something it wasn't meant to be. Epic fail #1

2) When he convinced Edmore that he would kill everyone in riverun to get back to Cersei, he actually saved the lives of many. Your insistence that he would have actually carried out the threat is nothing but pure speculation on your part. Epic fail number #2

3) he left Cersei, he fulfilled his promise. He fought for the better good of humanity, against Cersei's wish's. As to what his true intentions are in heading back to KL is still an unknown, yet your treating what he told Brienne as fact.
If his intent is to kill Cersei, convince her to surrender, etc in an effort to prevent more bloodshed and save more lives, then you have lost the argument. You are quick to forget it is just not Cersei who's life is at stake, but Jamies unborn child. As to whether or not you agree to this is of no consequence to me, but the court of public opinion will be on my side, and epic fail number #3 will be in place.


3 strikes and your out

 

[Warrior Spirit]

I am pretty sure that sleep with and fall in love with a Wildling girl was not part of the mission. Ygritte didn't "know" it, but might have suspected it.

She knew 100%. Several scenes showed this. She just told him to never betray her and he never did. Then she did that saying a couple times, “you’re mine and I’m yours. If we die we die but til then we live”. He just said he had to go home after the other Wildlings caught on to him when he could not kill an innocent man.

 

[ShiftyDevil]

Jamie is an excellent character and his arc is one of the best in the entire show, well, up until the fucking cliche he turned into in the last episode.

Jamie went after Brienne because she is what he always wanted to be, at least deep down. They didn't explore it enough in the show, but there's a part in the books where Jamie goes through the book of the kingsguard which lists all the kingsguard from history; talking up their exploits and shit. And then he turns to his section in the book, which was written by Barristan and it's basically just a couple lines about him fighting in a couple of battles, and then, that's it.

So you get this scene where Jamie's reading this thing and you see the idealist in him, he's reading how these previous kingsguards where all knightly and just and all that shit, real paragons of decency. And you get the scene where he sort of realizes that he's always wanted that shit, to be an actual knight, not just a dude who's good at swording mother *******. Which, obvious Brienne lives and breathes every day even if she didn't have the title.

So yeah, Jamie is gonna go merc Cersei (or die trying) and shit will come full circle. He kills a mad king to save the city, and he'll kill a mad queen to do it again.

My money is he kills her and dies doing so.

 

[number51]

With out getting into the smart or not smart political moves, killing children is the definition of cowardly. And wasn't it his drunkeness that got him killed? Brilliant!

It is possible that something can be the right move and cowardly at the same time.

Who called Robert brilliant? I called him an idiot, strawman much?

 

[Warrior Spirit]

There s good

Jamie is an excellent character and his arc is one of the best in the entire show, well, up until the fucking cliche he turned into in the last episode.

Jamie went after Brienne because she is what he always wanted to be, at least deep down. They didn't explore it enough in the show, but there's a part in the books where Jamie goes through the book of the kingsguard which lists all the kingsguard from history; talking up their exploits and shit. And then he turns to his section in the book, which was written by Barristan and it's basically just a couple lines about him fighting in a couple of battles, and then, that's it.

So you get this scene where Jamie's reading this thing and you see the idealist in him, he's reading how these previous kingsguards where all knightly and just and all that shit, real paragons of decency. And you get the scene where he sort of realizes that he's always wanted that shit, to be an actual knight, not just a dude who's good at swording mother *******. Which, obvious Brienne lives and breathes every day even if she didn't have the title.

So yeah, Jamie is gonna go merc Cersei (or die trying) and shit will come full circle. He kills a mad king to save the city, and he'll kill a mad queen to do it again.

My money is he kills her and dies doing so.

There is good in him and the want to be good but he lets his love for his sister drag him down. He’s not going to kill her. He’s going to try to save her even though she made a half hearted decision to send Bronn to kill him.

 

[nc0gnet0]

She knew 100%. Several scenes showed this. She just told him to never betray her and he never did. Then she did that saying a couple times, “you’re mine and I’m yours. If we die we die but til then we live”. He just said he had to go home after the other Wildlings caught on to him when he could not kill an innocent man.

Your right, I had forgotten. But she knew based on her gut feelings, not because Jon told her.

 

[nc0gnet0]

There s good

There is good in him and the want to be good but he lets his love for his sister drag him down. He’s not going to kill her. He’s going to try to save her even though she made a half hearted decision to send Bronn to kill him.

Not sure that is the case, but there is a little wiggle room in there. Does Jamie lose his redemption if his intent is too merely prevent Cersei from getting killed? Perhaps try to smuggle her out and whisk her away to some place far away so his unborne child can live? He did the same for Tyrion (against Cersei's wishes I might add).

Now, if he tries to regain her trust and somehow assist her in her attempt to retain the crown, then I will agree, he is back to square one.

Don't you find the timing of him changing his mind a little peculiar?

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Not sure that is the case, but there is a little wiggle room in there. Does Jamie lose his redemption if his intent is too merely prevent Cersei from getting killed? Perhaps try to smuggle her out and whisk her away to some place far away so his unborne child can live? He did the same for Tyrion (against Cersei's wishes I might add).

Now, if he tries to regain her trust and somehow assist her in her attempt to retain the crown, then I will agree, he is back to square one.

Don't you find the timing of him changing his mind a little peculiar?

Honestly, I would think there is that wiggle room. Even the incestuous relationship aside, 1 is almost obligated to be there for family. If it goes down like I think and he just hustles over there to get her out of harms way, I don’t think that’s a bad thing. If he was to do more crazy shit on her behalf that would be a bad thing. Don’t think others will be of the same mindset though. Even if he does just want to save her dumb ass, they’d likely see it as a big blemish in his redemption arc.

 

[remydat]

Not surprising, you never really seam to grasp context. It's why you lose so many arguments (albiet in your mind you never lose, you almost always lose in the court of public opinion).

1) when Jamie made the statement in WF, it was in regards to the things they had previously brought up (so this excludes pushing Bran out the window you dolt). What precisely was he accused of? Killing the Mad King (justified) Killing many Northerners (they were at war, justified), Fighting Ned Stark in KL (somewhat justified, the North was holding Tyrion prisoner at the time). Leave it to you to once again try to twist what he said into something it wasn't meant to be. Epic fail #1

2) When he convinced Edmore that he would kill everyone in riverun to get back to Cersei, he actually saved the lives of many. Your insistence that he would have actually carried out the threat is nothing but pure speculation on your part. Epic fail number #2

3) he left Cersei, he fulfilled his promise. He fought for the better good of humanity, against Cersei's wish's. As to what his true intentions are in heading back to KL is still an unknown, yet your treating what he told Brienne as fact.
If his intent is to kill Cersei, convince her to surrender, etc in an effort to prevent more bloodshed and save more lives, then you have lost the argument. You are quick to forget it is just not Cersei who's life is at stake, but Jamies unborn child. As to whether or not you agree to this is of no consequence to me, but the court of public opinion will be on my side, and epic fail number #3 will be in place.


3 strikes and your out

1. No that is your spin. He later admitted to Brienne what he did to Bran and knows it is part of what makes him a monster but he would in fact do it all over again because it was for Cersei. Does not matter if he knows it is wrong. He would not risk Robert finding out so he would push Bran 100 out of 100 times. He would never risk he and Cersei being killed for treason and you delusional to think otherwise.

2. Holy shit dude, Jamie himself said he would have done it so it is not speculation. It is the truth based on what the dude actually said. Your head so far up Jamie ass that you trying to speculate that Jamie does not mean what he actually said. He flat out told Brienne he would have done it. Period. End of story.

3. No my argument is he is not redeemed. He did shit against the undead and if he does anything with Cersei it will be for selfish reasons ie to save his kid or her. Trying to save your family is not an act of redemption.

 

[remydat]

Jamie is an excellent character and his arc is one of the best in the entire show, well, up until the fucking cliche he turned into in the last episode.

Jamie went after Brienne because she is what he always wanted to be, at least deep down. They didn't explore it enough in the show, but there's a part in the books where Jamie goes through the book of the kingsguard which lists all the kingsguard from history; talking up their exploits and shit. And then he turns to his section in the book, which was written by Barristan and it's basically just a couple lines about him fighting in a couple of battles, and then, that's it.

So you get this scene where Jamie's reading this thing and you see the idealist in him, he's reading how these previous kingsguards where all knightly and just and all that shit, real paragons of decency. And you get the scene where he sort of realizes that he's always wanted that shit, to be an actual knight, not just a dude who's good at swording mother *******. Which, obvious Brienne lives and breathes every day even if she didn't have the title.

So yeah, Jamie is gonna go merc Cersei (or die trying) and shit will come full circle. He kills a mad king to save the city, and he'll kill a mad queen to do it again.

My money is he kills her and dies doing so.

Not sure he kills her with his kid inside her.