IST: Cubs @ Rockies

[cubsmann]

When Chapmans fastball losses some velocity he will be nothing cause his curve sucks, he throws high in the zone and he has little movement. God forbid we sign him to a long term deal

Miller was and will be the better choice in the future

Why? Do you think he will suddenly stop being able to pitch the ball 100+? The guy is 28 and in the prime of his physical life. So of course I want him for a full season. Give him a 3 year deal worth $30M-35M and he'll be happy.

 

[cubsmann]

I can't believe how the mood changed in here. Everyone was so jacked when Chapman was coming in and then like "the world is coming to an end!!". Its one game out of 162 and one they should have won but they're still 33 games over .500 and right where they need to be to win 105 games and take HFA throughout the NL playoffs.

 

[Spunky Porkstacker]

The benching be official

http://www.todaysknuckleball.com/news/cubs-jason-heyward-benched-weekend/

Omelete celebrating the Heyward benching, it finally happened.

 

[Omeletpants]

Omelete celebrating the Heyward benching, it finally happened.

POsting a link without any editorial is not celebrating, moron

 

[Omeletpants]

Why? Do you think he will suddenly stop being able to pitch the ball 100+? The guy is 28 and in the prime of his physical life. So of course I want him for a full season. Give him a 3 year deal worth $30M-35M and he'll be happy.

He already turned down a multi year $15m/per season offer from the Cubs. Do you even pay attention or follow this team?

 

[Omeletpants]

In the future, definitely. But for this year, I like Chapman's 100+ heater after Rondon's 97mph heater.

Chapman was pitching at altitude with recent high usage. I think he'll be fine hitting 100+ going forward.

But I'm still upset Maddon pitched him twice in one day against Milwaukee. I think that was totally unnecessary.


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Miller was the better choice for the Cubs over Chapman

 

[DanTown]

When Chapmans fastball losses some velocity he will be nothing cause his curve sucks, he throws high in the zone and he has little movement. God forbid we sign him to a long term deal

Miller was and will be the better choice in the future

Now I know that he was hurt last night so it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, but the real issue I have with Chapman last night was that the Cubs/Maddon are trying to make this "guy A pitches the 7th, guy B pitches the 8th, guy C pitches the 9th" every night and that's just rarely how it plays out. Take last night, after Wood walked Dahl, the score is 5-2, runners on first and second, nobody out, 2-3-4 due up. The game is definitely going to be decided in those next three batters. While Edwards is a good pitcher, this is a time when you need to use your best arm in the bullpen. I know Chapman would eventually give up the double to end the game but I think the game was lost in the eighth going to Edwards instead of Chapman.

But I agree that I'd much rather have Miller because I think he's as good as Chapman, has a better history of going more than an inning, has playoff experience, had more controllable years, and the Cubs would use Miller/Rondon interchagably in the eighth and ninth as matchups suggests instead of strictly one of them in the eighth and one of them in the ninth.

 

[DanTown]

By the way, we'd all be saying how good Jed/Theo are if they did this but the Yankees were amazing in the past two seasons with their use of the bullpen. They let Robertson walk, signed Miller to a vastly better deal that he even out performed and was only about 75% of Robertson's price, traded 4 low level prospects for a rental of Chapman that they then flipped in to vastly better prospects.

 

[Omeletpants]

Now I know that he was hurt last night so it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, but the real issue I have with Chapman last night was that the Cubs/Maddon are trying to make this "guy A pitches the 7th, guy B pitches the 8th, guy C pitches the 9th" every night and that's just rarely how it plays out. Take last night, after Wood walked Dahl, the score is 5-2, runners on first and second, nobody out, 2-3-4 due up. The game is definitely going to be decided in those next three batters. While Edwards is a good pitcher, this is a time when you need to use your best arm in the bullpen. I know Chapman would eventually give up the double to end the game but I think the game was lost in the eighth going to Edwards instead of Chapman.

But I agree that I'd much rather have Miller because I think he's as good as Chapman, has a better history of going more than an inning, has playoff experience, had more controllable years, and the Cubs would use Miller/Rondon interchagably in the eighth and ninth as matchups suggests instead of strictly one of them in the eighth and one of them in the ninth.

Agreed. Maddon does some strange things. When a reliever is pitching well and should go that second inning, Maddon pulls him. Then when the Cubs are up 4-1 in the 9th he brings Chapman in when he pitched the night before. WTF. Even when Chapman doesnt pitch he is in the bullpen throwing every day

 

[chibears55]

He already turned down a multi year $15m/per season offer from the Cubs. Do you even pay attention or follow this team?

Was it the Cubs or just the Yankees

I didn't see anything regarding an offer from Cubs

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[Omeletpants]

Was it the Cubs or just the Yankees

I didn't see anything regarding an offer from Cubs

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As part of the trade the Cubs were demanding Chapman sign a $15M year extension so they wouldn't lose him at the end of the season. When he said no, the Cubs caved in and finalized the trade

Given he wouldnt sign with the Cubs for $15M per year for 3 years what will he be asking for? 20M/year???

 

[chibears55]

Cubs current bullpen

Zastryzny
Pena
Edwards
Wood
Grimm
Montgomery
Cahill
Chapman

With using Cahill and Montgomery twice now in 5 days as starters, the pen is shortened to 6..

Maddon basically been relying on Wood Grimm and Edwards all week.

So, with a couple games being close he had to turn to Chapman to finish because he had no one left to turn to, to close it out..


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[chibears55]

As part of the trade the Cubs were demanding Chapman sign a $15M year extension so they wouldn't lose him at the end of the season. When he said no, the Cubs caved in and finalized the trade

Given he wouldnt sign with the Cubs for $15M per year for 3 years what will he be asking for? 20M/year???

OK..
I didn't see anything like that, especially the demanding part..
I read there was speculation that the Cubs were trying to get an extension, but that was denied that that was going on.

I saw the Yankees were trying to extend him the 15 per for 3 yrs and he turned them down..

So, I still think there a chance he resigns with Cubs if all parties want to negotiate.


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[Omeletpants]

OK..
I didn't see anything like that, especially the demanding part..
I read there was speculation that the Cubs were trying to get an extension, but that was denied that that was going on.

I saw the Yankees were trying to extend him the 15 per for 3 yrs and he turned them down..

So, I still think there a chance he resigns with Cubs if all parties want to negotiate.


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Fine, but if he turned down $15M x 3 do you want to pay him $20M x 3? IMO, some team will pay this guy big bucks on some future contract and be forced to eat it while he becomes a 95mph thrower with no curve ball and iffy control that leaves a lot of balls up in the strike zone

 

[SilenceS]

 

[chibears55]

Fine, but if he turned down $15M x 3 do you want to pay him $20M x 3? IMO, some team will pay this guy big bucks on some future contract and be forced to eat it while he becomes a 95mph thrower with no curve ball and iffy control that leaves a lot of balls up in the strike zone

Maybe he'll take 15 for 4

Thing is, Cubs will be able to negotiate with him solely if they choose from now until FA period begin..

He may like the team, their situation, etc..

Obviously I doubt Epstein gonna offer crazy money n years and I wouldn't want him too But having him on team and able to talk to his agent at anytime.. There always a chance they agree on something reasonable...

If he hits Free Agency, I can see a team offering 4 or 5 yrs but I have doubts it would be for too much more then 15-18 per with the years

 

[SilenceS]

He turned down 60 million for 4 years already. He is going to get stupid money for a closer

 

[Omeletpants]

Maybe he'll take 15 for 4

Thing is, Cubs will be able to negotiate with him solely if they choose from now until FA period begin..

He may like the team, their situation, etc..

Obviously I doubt Epstein gonna offer crazy money n years and I wouldn't want him too But having him on team and able to talk to his agent at anytime.. There always a chance they agree on something reasonable...

If he hits Free Agency, I can see a team offering 4 or 5 yrs but I have doubts it would be for too much more then 15-18 per with the years

Not buying that. He turned down those offers cause he wants to see what the open market offers. He is not signing anything until he see numbers from 5-6 teams

 

[Omeletpants]

He has already said he wouldn't object going back to the Yankees and they have stupid money, plus they hope to be relevant in 2018

 

[DanTown]

Chapman at 15 million kills the Cubs future flexibility to pay guys. If you wanted to pay a reliever that much, you should have simply gone after Miller who is 95% (at worst) of what Chapman is and costs about 60%. Hell, they're paying Wood/Richard 8.2 million this year so they could have replaced those two guys with Miller/arb guy and paid a million more. THAT's being a good GM.

To be perfectly honest, the Chapman deal felt like an ownership move to help ease concerns in the fan base who was concerned over that terrible stretch of baseball.