Jeff Samardzija and Jason Hammel traded to Oakland Athletics for Addison Russell plus

[SilenceS]

So the reason you don't like it isn't about Russell but redundancy?

No, I think you ust traded a position of weakness for a position of strength in our whole org.

 

[SilenceS]

I also believe you just put your whole trade on one player. The A's win this year. Russell has to become a perennial all star to even try to compare.
Yet again, Hammel I am fine with. He would have never netted Russell or close to him but I dont care that much for Russell with our organization depth.

 

[dabynsky]

I also believe you just put your whole trade on one player. The A's win this year. Russell has to become a perennial all star to even try to compare.
Yet again, Hammel I am fine with. He would have never netted Russell or close to him but I dont care that much for Russell with our organization depth.

There is never a bad thing of having impact caliber prospects. Would you guys feel better about this getting a guy like Crick instead?

 

[SilenceS]

There is never a bad thing of having impact caliber prospects. Would you guys feel better about this getting a guy like Crick instead?

Ok, I get that but now you are looking to trade again. If you dont trade for a proven TOR starter then whats the point of this trade? Castro, Russell, or Baez has to be trade or most likely they busted. Russel bat is not bad but I dont find it great. His glove could be good but he has to get there. I just think we put our eggs in one basket. I dont care for this trade but I could be completely wrong. Has happened before. Also, I am higher on Shark then you and others. I think Shark is going to have his best days ahead.

 

[dabynsky]

Ok, I get that but now you are looking to trade again. If you dont trade for a proven TOR starter then whats the point of this trade? Castro, Russell, or Baez has to be trade or most likely they busted. Russel bat is not bad but I dont find it great. His glove could be good but he has to get there. I just think we put our eggs in one basket. I dont care for this trade but I could be completely wrong. Has happened before. Also, I am higher on Shark then you and others. I think Shark is going to have his best days ahead.

My deal is value straight forward. The Cubs got the best possible return for Shark. There is no way the Cubs could have gotten anything better than Russell. You always regret taking less value whether it is in a draft or in trades. Take the most value which is what the Cubs did. If they all make it then you have an amazing trade chip which is cost controlled young impact bats and you can fill any holes you have otherwise between trades and signing free agents.

 

[chibears55]

Just got this feeling samardzija and Hammel are gonna struggle a bit in AL..
We shall see

 

[beckdawg]

I guess so... I'm blaming my disappointment on beckdawg for talking up the hauls we were gonna get with these two...

Unless we decide that this is actually a great haul... in which case... I don't know.

I think this return is actually pretty good. Look at it this way, I had been suggesting basically 2 top 50 guys for Shark and 1 for Hammel. Would you trade Kris Bryant for 3 of Henry Owens, Blake Swihart, Allen Webster, Mookie Betts, and Garin Cecchini? Because that's what you're talking about in the case of Russell. He's *that* good. I frankly wouldn't have even thought a top 10 type player was available even for both. We're talking about 20-25 HR/25+ SB out of SS and unlike Baez he's likely to stick. You're talking Castro plus better defense. Russell supposedly is 3rd on Keith Law's top 100 right now. Additionally, I'd argue that Russell is far safer than trading for a pitching prospect because they are so fickle.

On top of Russell, McKinney slots in behind Pierce Johnson on the cubs top 10 prospects according to mlb.com. So, he's likely fringe top 100 right now maybe higher. I'll do a write up on both in the prospect thread but suffice to say he is hitting .241/.330/.400 in A+ at 19. Almora at 20 in A+ is struggling some so to see a 19 year old play even that well is good. Also, left handed OF is obviously something the system needs. Straily is probably a 3-5 starter and was mlb.com's #73 pitcher prior to 2012. His major league numbers haven't been spectacular but 2 years ago he had 11.39/2.43 k/9 bb/9 with a 3.38/2.65 ERA/FIP in AA and 11.07/2.57 k/9 bb/9 and 2.03/2.69 ERA/FIP in AAA. Are we really saying that someone like Aaron Sanchez is sexier? He had 7.77/5.45 and 3.82/4.23 ERA/FIP in AA this year and 6.64/5.75 and 4.43/4.56 ERA/FIP in AAA. In fairness, Sanchez is 21 vs Straily who was 23 but with those walk rates I'd be super concerned about Sanchez and I said this prior to the trade. I was never a fan of him.

We flat out weren't getting Taijuan Walker, Archie Bradley, Noah Syndergaard, Robert Stephenson, Jon Gray, and Mark Appel. I had hopes for Dylan Bundy but obviously he O's weren't motivated enough to move him. Jameson Taillon had tommy john and the pirates weren't going to move him last offseason so I doubt they would have this year. After that you're talking about pitchers who rated worse than Sanchez on the top 100 from mlb.com.

We also don't know who the PTBNL is. From what I've read he's not expected to change the value of the deal greatly. Cubs den speculated it might be Raul Alcantara(unlikely) or Dustin Driver. Alcantara projects as a 2/3 starter and is Oakland's #2 prospect after the trade with a 50 grade, think Arodys Vizcaino level. Dustin Driver is #20 after what's left with a 45 grade, think Neil Ramirez level.

As someone who's been suggesting that a Castro trade isn't that crazy this sort of makes sense to me. Russell is all of the things Castro is and good(probably not great) defense. Obviously he still has to make it to the majors and prove it. One thing is sure though Baez is pretty much done at SS now. It will be interesting to see if he moves to 3B(my suggestion) or 2B. What my suggestion would be is to wait about a year or so until Russell is ready and/or proven at the MLB level and then consider putting together a package of Castro + for a MLB starter a team is having to trade. Stephen Strasburg, Darvish, Tanaka(can opt out in 2017), David Price(a team does a 1 year rental and deals him again), Johnny Cueto(2016 FA if they can't lock him up long term) and so on and so forth. Castro plus Jorge Soler/Billy McKinney and say Vogelbach should realistically be able to land any of these guys and instead of getting what you hope is a front line starter, you're getting someone who's already done it.

 

[beckdawg]

Oh one more thing, if Shark turned down $17 mi/season with the cubs the chances of him actually re-signing with Oakland are nil which means in 1.5 years Shark will be a FA. Perhaps Oakland just rents him a year and then trades him again though given the price they paid they would have to get a pretty substantial deal by next year's trade deadline. And even if they do trade him, that actually removes the ability to put a QO on Shark is the second team doesn't re-sign him which is looking unlikely. Long story short, expect to see Shark in 2016 FA with hopefully more realistic salary expectations.

 

[CSF77]

I'm holding out for Leater next year. They should have plenty of payroll flexibility to make a 20 mil offer per. Add to it he is proven in the play offs.

The Cubs need to start making moves like that soon.

Trading shark is fine. He wanted ace cash and has never been a proven play off comity. He will have that opportunity now. It will show his true value going into his F/A.

I don't see any Castro deals for another year now but if they are in the hunt next year anything could happen.

I would expect next years team to have Alcantara in CF and Baez at 2B. Bryant at 3B or RF.

That really sets up Russell and Soler as trade chips for top end SP or Castro as a flip for more system arms.

But that is a year down the road. Cubs if good will look to add. If bad look to subtract. Pretty basic stuff here.

 

[CSF77]

And regarding this year.

shark was 2-7. Hammel will be short term missed more.

But Arrieta has been the best starter of late and slots in as our #1 post allstar game.

I'm not sure who they back fill with though. As far as ready. Wada would be #1 to promote. He should translate here fine. 2nd one is tricky. By the numbers it would be Hendricks. By arm Beeler. Just looking to back fill vs start arb clocks Rusin.

We will see how they approach this. It should point to how they deal with promoting Alcantara also.

 

[BearsWillWin]

Great......based on everything you've said they are still 4 years away from being close to having a real team that can compete.

Awesome.

 

[JIMMY MAC FAN]

With the smoke starting to clear from this trade it looks as if the Cubs really made a haul. They got the A's 2012 and 2103 first round draft picks and the top two prospects in their system. They got a young pitcher that could be the next Jake Arrieta. The Cubs have to have the #1 minor league prospects in all of baseball now. Will be interesting to see this team in three years.

 

[CSF77]

Great......based on everything you've said they are still 4 years away from being close to having a real team that can compete.

Awesome.

Not really. It depends on how fast Bryant adapts. Given his track record 1month.

Baez I would expect a year long struggle then year 2 picking it up.

Alcantara gas gotten better every year in the minors. This is the best year he has had. I expect a lot from him.

You add those 3 to Castro and Rizzo the team will go from 3.9 runs to around 4.5 fast.

Now the trick is the rotation. Let's be surprised with that. Given Theo's track record it has been pretty good with finding pitchers like Hammel every year. The problem has come when he has over spent. "Jackson"

I'm almost to the point of accepting Kendrick on a 1 year if he puts up Hammel's production with Hendricks and they set up for making a strike at Price.

4 years no. I see next year them over .500

 

[brett05]

Seriously I get that the Cubs gave up quality major league arms but one wasn't going to resign here. The other has never pitched 200 innings because he has been hurt. The Cubs got a top 5 prospect in baseball plus a couple other decent pieces. Again the Cubs got another Baez/Bryant today. This is far beyond what any of us reasonably thought the Cubs would get.

You missed a lot of posts in the past nine months. Cub fans thought they'd get two pitchers in the top 30 plus some for Shark

Would you agree not all top five prospects are the same?

 

[brett05]

The idea of trading Castro is just so dumb to me. I think Rizzo and Castro should be completely off limits. Both are having All-Star caliber seasons while being younger than the average rookie

Got a link to that stat?

 

[brett05]

Just got this feeling samardzija and Hammel are gonna struggle a bit in AL..
We shall see

Most do

 

[BearsWillWin]

Not really. It depends on how fast Bryant adapts. Given his track record 1month.

Baez I would expect a year long struggle then year 2 picking it up.

Alcantara gas gotten better every year in the minors. This is the best year he has had. I expect a lot from him.

You add those 3 to Castro and Rizzo the team will go from 3.9 runs to around 4.5 fast.

Now the trick is the rotation. Let's be surprised with that. Given Theo's track record it has been pretty good with finding pitchers like Hammel every year. The problem has come when he has over spent. "Jackson"

I'm almost to the point of accepting Kendrick on a 1 year if he puts up Hammel's production with Hendricks and they set up for making a strike at Price.

4 years no. I see next year them over .500

So basically all they have to do is hope they strike gold on all their top prospects, something that rarely happens, and then we cross our fingers and hope Theo can put together a real pitching staff that includes a legit ace.

Seems so simple.

 

[brett05]

I'm holding out for Leater next year. They should have plenty of payroll flexibility to make a 20 mil offer per. Add to it he is proven in the play offs.

The Cubs need to start making moves like that soon.

Trading shark is fine. He wanted ace cash and has never been a proven play off comity. He will have that opportunity now. It will show his true value going into his F/A.

I don't see any Castro deals for another year now but if they are in the hunt next year anything could happen.

I would expect next years team to have Alcantara in CF and Baez at 2B. Bryant at 3B or RF.

That really sets up Russell and Soler as trade chips for top end SP or Castro as a flip for more system arms.

But that is a year down the road. Cubs if good will look to add. If bad look to subtract. Pretty basic stuff here.

You're more than likely not getting a top end sp for Bryant let aloneca deal for Soler and russell

 

[brett05]

With the smoke starting to clear from this trade it looks as if the Cubs really made a haul. They got the A's 2012 and 2103 first round draft picks and the top two prospects in their system. They got a young pitcher that could be the next Jake Arrieta. The Cubs have to have the #1 minor league prospects in all of baseball now. Will be interesting to see this team in three years.

There's something to brag about

 

[BearsWillWin]

The best part of this is that if Theo traded Rizzo and Castro to New York tomorrow for a case of baseballs and a year supply of sunflower seeds........someone on this website would find a way to turn the deal into a positive.