Losing Interest?

[Enasic]

The whole idea of a fan is misunderstood. We don't know these athletes. All we know is if they're enjoyable to watch and what we hear them say in the media. If they're not enjoyable to watch and they say stupid things, fans typically tend to not become fans anymore as there is no point. Athletes are pampered by the time they're in grade school so when there's some "fan backlash" I say take the good with the bad. Nothing worse than players taking it personally and expecting sympathy.

 

[Crystallas]

The whole idea of a fan is misunderstood. We don't know these athletes. All we know is if they're enjoyable to watch and what we hear them say in the media. If they're not enjoyable to watch and they say stupid things, fans typically tend to not become fans anymore as there is no point. Athletes are pampered by the time they're in grade school so when there's some "fan backlash" I say take the good with the bad. Nothing worse than players taking it personally and expecting sympathy.

Just some devils advocate here.

Do you think desirable players and other personnel want to sign and relocate to a city that leans more towards an atmosphere of being sympathetic and patient, or critical and priss?

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

I think a lot of people are losing interest because Derrick rose is terrible now. When he played at a high level, he was exciting to watch and have bulls fans hope. With him playing like a mid level player, he's boring and frustrating to watch and fans are smart enough to realize we have no shot without a true superstar. We know the best we can do is maybe push Cleveland to 7 games. Maybe.

I wouldn't say Rose is terrible now. He's having a terrible year by his standards. He is still helping them win games with the attention he still demands when it comes to his dribble penetration.

I'm not willing to say for sure that Rose's days of being an all-star caliber player are done yet. I'm not willing to make any bets on it either. We'll just see how much his vision really has been affecting him out there.

Can't really rule out the Bulls being a threat to do some damage in the post season. The talent around Rose is arguably better than it ever has been.

 

[clonetrooper264]

Can't really rule out the Bulls being a threat to do some damage in the post season. The talent around Rose is arguably better than it ever has been.

This talent is literally the same as last year lol. Some guys are playing better, but it's basically the same.

 

[RoseMVP1]

The good news is Rose TOs are down compared to previous years. What's alarming, to me, is that he sucks at finishing now, which used to be his best attribute. I'm hoping his vision has something to do with it.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

The good news is Rose TOs are down compared to previous years. What's alarming, to me, is that he sucks at finishing now, which used to be his best attribute. I'm hoping his vision has something to do with it.

Yeah, it's a different type of injury. I'm not sure what to make of it yet.

 

[The Hawk]

Its hard to have a conversation or a debate with someone when you state that the owner doesn't care about bringing in top talent to run/coach the team...and when he does bring in top talent...its called luck. How the hell is finding Phil Jackson "luck"? Do you know the story behind that? Evidently not. There was no luck. Jerry Krause saw potential in Jackson NOBODY else saw.

As far as pursuing free agents...what free agents did not come here because of management? Carmelo? Lebron? Who???

Yeah, Krause did see potential in Jackson. My point was that Reinsdorf went on the cheap to hire every coach he did. He never brought in a no doubt about it successful head coach. He does the same shit with the White Sox. Don't you see this? Who have the Bulls EVER brought in a manager or coach that was a proven successful head guy? That doesn't tell you something? Look at the history of the White Sox under Reinny. Name the successful manager that he ever brought in to lead them. Instead he hires former players, some of which had NO managing experience as in Ozzie and Ventura.

I'm telling you guys that Reinny is cheap and that is a big reason why these teams he owns do not win championships. Take away Jordan's and Pippin's greatness and Krauses ability to find and deal for talent(can't take that away from the guy), and what do you have under Reinny?

Bottom line. The Bulls were positioned when Rose magically got drafted to win several championships and maybe create a modern day dynasty. Trouble was he got hurt certainly. But in his entire career with the Bulls, he has never had a talent in the back court with him and once they dumped Luol, the problem got worse. Instead they brought a steady stream of marginal NBA players in as in 8th to 12th guy on a roster while the money keeps flowing into to Jerry fat bank account.

As for what quality players avoided Chicago because of its management?? Pretty much all of them. The better question is which high demand players were happy to come to
Chicago?

 

[clonetrooper264]

Well let's say he does have legit double vision issues...how would he know which basket to shoot at? He already got mugged at the rim when he was a healthy MVP, imagine that plus double vision plus whatever skill deterioration you want to believe he has. Could be legit, who knows?

 

[Enasic]

Just some devils advocate here.

Do you think desirable players and other personnel want to sign and relocate to a city that leans more towards an atmosphere of being sympathetic and patient, or critical and priss?

I'm not sure that atmosphere varies that much from city to city. If a player is looking for a city full of patient, sympathetic, say whatever you want and play however, we still love you fans...they're going to be disappointed every where. As a player I'd be more worried about signing somewhere I can win and play at a high level than what fans say or think. And really, if fans are upset, it's in all likelihood because the player isn't doing their job.

 

[Scoot26]

Yeah, Krause did see potential in Jackson. My point was that Reinsdorf went on the cheap to hire every coach he did. He never brought in a no doubt about it successful head coach. He does the same shit with the White Sox. Don't you see this? Who have the Bulls EVER brought in a manager or coach that was a proven successful head guy? That doesn't tell you something? Look at the history of the White Sox under Reinny. Name the successful manager that he ever brought in to lead them. Instead he hires former players, some of which had NO managing experience as in Ozzie and Ventura.

I'm telling you guys that Reinny is cheap and that is a big reason why these teams he owns do not win championships. Take away Jordan's and Pippin's greatness and Krauses ability to find and deal for talent(can't take that away from the guy), and what do you have under Reinny?

Bottom line. The Bulls were positioned when Rose magically got drafted to win several championships and maybe create a modern day dynasty. Trouble was he got hurt certainly. But in his entire career with the Bulls, he has never had a talent in the back court with him and once they dumped Luol, the problem got worse. Instead they brought a steady stream of marginal NBA players in as in 8th to 12th guy on a roster while the money keeps flowing into to Jerry fat bank account.

As for what quality players avoided Chicago because of its management?? Pretty much all of them. The better question is which high demand players were happy to come to
Chicago?

This post is filled with so much wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

 

[Enasic]

I wouldn't say Rose is terrible now. He's having a terrible year by his standards. He is still helping them win games with the attention he still demands when it comes to his dribble penetration.

I'm not willing to say for sure that Rose's days of being an all-star caliber player are done yet. I'm not willing to make any bets on it either. We'll just see how much his vision really has been affecting him out there.

Can't really rule out the Bulls being a threat to do some damage in the post season. The talent around Rose is arguably better than it ever has been.

Look at roses numbers, especially advanced metrics and tell me how he has t been terrible. If it's because of the eye, fine...but no matter how you slice it he's been awful.

 

[Crystallas]

I'm not sure that atmosphere varies that much from city to city. If a player is looking for a city full of patient, sympathetic, say whatever you want and play however, we still love you fans...they're going to be disappointed every where. As a player I'd be more worried about signing somewhere I can win and play at a high level than what fans say or think. And really, if fans are upset, it's in all likelihood because the player isn't doing their job.

That's why I said lean towards, and not going after full extremes. I didn't want to distort the argument.

 

[The Hawk]

GarPax has done nothing to build a contending team.

Except drafting a league MVP, DPOY, and a 30th overall pick that has turned into one of the top 20 players in the NBA.

Signed a free agent for less than 10M/yr who turned into an all-star starter.

And hired the coach of the year, which led the team to two straight seasons of the league's best regular season record.

Yep. They're horrible.

So he gets credit for drafting Derrick Rose? Really? That was a no brainer after those lottery balls magically came out the way they did As for the coach of the year thing, was Thibs a head coach anywhere else before he was hired? Thibs was successful, certainly but then there also is the matter of the two bozos who were his bosses. Who hired them? And who wrote the despicable letter when the coach of the year was rail-roaded out of town?

Bottom line. I think that successful organizations win championships. How many championships have the Bulls won since Jordan left? How many conference championships have they won since Jordan left? How many championships have the White Sox won under Reiny. How many AL championships have they won under Reiny?

Chicago is plagued with shitty team owners except for the beloved Blackhawks. Wirtz revolutionized what a Chicago team owner should be, namely a guy who hires top line operations management. He brought in the Bowman's father and son. He hired a top of the line head coach in "Q". He set up a great scouting system with pappy Bowman providing a wealth of knowledge there and elsewhere. The Cubs are trying to mimic the Hawks success but of course will fail because they are the fucking Cubs.

Compare Wirtz and his guys to Reinny and his guys and you can maybe see my point.

 

[Crystallas]

This post is filled with so much wrong, I don't even know where to begin.

 

[The Hawk]

its time to show they can make a trade for established talent though

this team needs something and im thinking some new faces may serve well

besides its time to trade Taj anyway

That is what I am saying also. They do need to make a deal and a major deal not just some scrubs changing hands. This should have been done right after they brought Freddie in. There are some pretty unhappy players on this team right now, I believe as in Noah, Gibson, and Brooks. There are also some guys who are struggling this year as in Gasol, Mirotic, and, of course, Rose. I would consider trading everyone except Butler that is on the roster in order to balance the team out. It, once again, should have happened before the season ever started.

This isn't going to be a pretty situation going forward unless they do something pretty significant.

 

[Enasic]

Lol this team needs a superstar and they're just going to trade average pieces and make a "major deal?" It takes two to tango. Who's available? Who wants a crippled rose or an aging gasol or Noah? I'd like to see a trade but expecting a "major deal" isn't going to happen.

 

[Enasic]

That's why I said lean towards, and not going after full extremes. I didn't want to distort the argument.

Well in that case I would lean towards the team that had the best chance of winning. Lastly, the determine factor 99.9999% of the time is $$$ and not patient fans. That's why melo signed in Ny despite the fan base wanting to kill him.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Look at roses numbers, especially advanced metrics and tell me how he has t been terrible. If it's because of the eye, fine...but no matter how you slice it he's been awful.

His 2-pt% is 39% which is terrible. His 3-pt% is 21% which is also terrible. His FT% is pretty good but he's only getting 3 attempts per game which is pretty bad. His defense has been mediocre. However, he is a viable scoring option when guarded one-on-one. And because of that, he's had a few games with nice scoring output. He's been an above average facilitating point guard so far as well. All in all, he's been nowhere near the elite level but also clearly better than the bottom third of other starting point guards.

 

[The Hawk]

I'm not sure that atmosphere varies that much from city to city. If a player is looking for a city full of patient, sympathetic, say whatever you want and play however, we still love you fans...they're going to be disappointed every where. As a player I'd be more worried about signing somewhere I can win and play at a high level than what fans say or think. And really, if fans are upset, it's in all likelihood because the player isn't doing their job.

I think that Chicago fans over-all are very good fans. Personally I think that basketball players, as a group of athletes are more spoiled and obnoxious than any other athlete in the US.. So they think about things like the weather. But think about this. Once Jordan, Pippin, and Jackson left, they talked a lot about Krumbs Krause and Reinny in a very negative way. I think that started things off pretty negatively with their peer group as in you will be not treated well by management with Chicago. I still think that is the word about Reinny right now.

 

[Raskolnikov]

Well let's say he does have legit double vision issues...how would he know which basket to shoot at? He already got mugged at the rim when he was a healthy MVP, imagine that plus double vision plus whatever skill deterioration you want to believe he has. Could be legit, who knows?

Directing discussion at others on this page as well, but my biggest fear is he doesn't have double vision and is throwing excuses at is. Let us assume he does, because if he doesn't that is a harbinger of complete doom.

So he does...he can't be that washed up and stupid. He can't. So he does, in which case, let's forgive his play, shooting, and finishing. But why is he jacking 20% 3's if he is having vision issues? Why shoot? Either way we go with this he ends up THAT fucking stupid. So...**** me.

We have an old center, Rose, and Dunleavy out plus a trade needs to be made to clean up platoon at SF/PF. We are grinding out right now, getting through a season, it's boring because it's low energy plodding along and figuring ourselves out and letting Gasol carry us.

We are waiting and seeing. But this is the last year before blow up, so let's just get behind them and see. Even before trade I like the way we match up with anyone in a series.