OT: Who Is The Most Overrated Player In The NBA?

[RamiTheBullsFan]

You have to be kidding me...he is not top 10 all time...but he is most definitely an all time great. You couldn't name another player that size with his game.

When did I say anything otherwise?

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

You have to be kidding me...he is not top 10 all time...but he is most definitely an all time great. You couldn't name another player that size with his game.

top 15-20..accolades have a bit to do with it

he's a damn good player..but i think he's a bit overrated

 

[Cloud 9]

Did anybody say Tyson Chandler? He'd be up there for me

 

[inactiveuser1]

Rubio,derrick favors, javale mcgee

 

[houheffna]

Your original scenario did not mention anything about a big man dribbling the basketball. There are plenty of times when a big has the ball at the top, swings it around, moves off the ball into post position, and receives the ball again.

And I would take Rose as the offensive PG next to Miller and Chalmers (in a play where I had to choose between James and Rose as the primary ball-handler) a lot of the time.

Again- defense is what tips the scale for James.

How many "bigs" facilitate? And win MVPs doing it?

 

[houheffna]

top 15-20..accolades have a bit to do with it

he's a damn good player..but i think he's a bit overrated

Don't agree at all. He is riding a wave from winning the title...rightfully so. Has been a franchise player his whole career. Has a game like no power forward has had in NBA history. I don't think he is at all overrated.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

Don't agree at all. He is riding a wave from winning the title...rightfully so. Has been a franchise player his whole career. Has a game like no power forward has had in NBA history. I don't think he is at all overrated.

not really his whole career..i would argue more towards his 3rd of 4th season

but i think thats more arguing longevity

and then whole game like no power forward has had in NBA history is arguing importance through precedent, which i guess makes sense..but idk if innovation or unique style can be used to conclude that dirk is top 10 all time(i got into a similar argument on here over julius erving..and someone was talking about his precedent of "superstar play")

i think dirk is damn good and he's top 15-20 all time

i dont think he is overrated career wise...thats not really what i have been arguing(unless you put him in the top 10, imo)

however, i'm looking at right now..he gets alot of dignification for having a good postseason(most notably making clutch baskets and going off in the conference finals) which he deserves..and its good for him that he got a championship

but people have short memories..and this applies in the exactly the opposite way for lebron(the finals is the biggest stage..but i cant say thats the ultimate standard by any means...maybe not the best example but kobe has a sub 40 field goal % in the finals...yet he gets all this dignification...partly because his teams have come out on the winning end)


anyway, dirk isnt the greatest defender and i feel that though he has great feet and a good outside-midrange game..he could stand to utilize an inside-outside game a little more(i.e. perhaps posting up) in order to create more opportunities for teammates through collapsing defense among other things

i feel dirk is also is not really a kind of "5 tool" player if you get what i mean.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Don't agree at all. He is riding a wave from winning the title...rightfully so. Has been a franchise player his whole career. Has a game like no power forward has had in NBA history. I don't think he is at all overrated.

Rick Carlisle overrated him by saying he was a top 10 player of all-time. He should consider himself lucky to be in the top 30. In general, I don't think he's all that overrated at all. He was actually underrated up until last year.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

How many "bigs" facilitate? And win MVPs doing it?

And how many of them (including LeBron) facilitate better than Derrick Rose? None. And that was my entire point.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

Rick Carlisle overrated him by saying he was a top 10 player of all-time. He should consider himself lucky to be in the top 30. In general, I don't think he's all that overrated at all. He was actually underrated up until last year.

yep..pretty much(though there was that stint where he won the MVP..dont think he's was overrated there or anything though)

my point to build off of what you said would be that dirk flew a bit under the radar until the playoffs last year..and then people started overrating him by reaction

 

[bleacherbum54]

And how many of them (including LeBron) facilitate better than Derrick Rose? None. And that was my entire point.

This is BS. If you said how many of them facilitate like a Nash than you would have a point. Lebron is a much better facilitator than Rose.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

This is BS. If you said how many of them facilitate like a Nash than you would have a point. Lebron is a much better facilitator than Rose.

Except for that pesky little detail that Derrick Rose averages more assists and has a better assist-to-turnover ratio than LeBron James.

 

[thechosenone]

I wonder how someone can insist on trying to persuade us about something even LeBron himself would not agree.

It is like trying to convince someone that Rose is better rebounder than Lebron because sometimes he grabs some and it is very difficult to do this for someone in his size.

I don't care if Lebron is a very good ball handler and facilitate well for his size.Comparing him to other top PGs is really funny.Even Jennings is better than him in the PG position.And you know something?Thats why he chokes so many times when the game is on the line.Because he gets the ball in a PG position and he is bad at it.Admit it or not thats the truth.And thats why Miami's first choice when the game is close is Wade.Lebron himself knows that he is not good enough at it and leave it to Wade.

PSlease stop it.If you love Lebron so much that in your eyes he is the best PG,the best SF,the best SG,the best SF and the best C of the NBA,you are in the wrong forum.

 

[houheffna]

And how many of them (including LeBron) facilitate better than Derrick Rose? None. And that was my entire point.

I believe Lebron's abilities offensively is the reason why people would take him over Rose. You are pretty much saying offensively that Rose is better than Lebron, and I disagree.

 

[houheffna]

I wonder how someone can insist on trying to persuade us about something even LeBron himself would not agree.

It is like trying to convince someone that Rose is better rebounder than Lebron because sometimes he grabs some and it is very difficult to do this for someone in his size.

I don't care if Lebron is a very good ball handler and facilitate well for his size.Comparing him to other top PGs is really funny.Even Jennings is better than him in the PG position.And you know something?Thats why he chokes so many times when the game is on the line.Because he gets the ball in a PG position and he is bad at it.Admit it or not thats the truth.And thats why Miami's first choice when the game is close is Wade.Lebron himself knows that he is not good enough at it and leave it to Wade.

PSlease stop it.If you love Lebron so much that in your eyes he is the best PG,the best SF,the best SG,the best SF and the best C of the NBA,you are in the wrong forum.

The idea that Lebron chokes in the fourth because he is handling the ball is ludicrous. Doesn't make any sense. Rose handles the ball, and he choked...more than once. That issue is mental more than anything.

Straw man argument here. He can play 5 positions. That has nothing to do with this argument.

Any GM in the league would take Lebron over any pg i the league right now as a point forward. I happen to think there are better pure pgs, but I don't think they can impact the game from the top of the key the same way Lebron can. And yes, his size have a lot to do with it...as did Magic Johnson's size.

 

[thechosenone]

Just watch him when he chokes and you ll understand it.The frequency he lose the ball,or pass the ball to noone,or travel,or fail to crossover and make bad shots is very high when he is in a PG position.

Rose chokes too.But not so often.He may need more experience.You can't say this for LeBron.He plays in the NBA for one decade now.

Yes he is the best overall player in the NBA because he can do many things and because of his size.If a GM had to chose between a top PG and having LBJ in his team he will chose him probably.That doesn't mean he is a good PG.If the same GM had in their team Hakeem,Durant,Malone and Jordan and he was to chose one more player to complete the squad of course he will chose one top PG and not LBJ.The team would perform way much better with a top PG than with LBJ as "Point Forward" lol.It is called basketball and it is played for 120 years.Every player has their role in the game and every position too.You can't change it.

Btw it's a sin having Johnson's name in the same sentence with Lebron and talking about PG skills.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

I believe Lebron's abilities offensively is the reason why people would take him over Rose. You are pretty much saying offensively that Rose is better than Lebron, and I disagree.

If Miami offered the Bulls Lebron for Rose would you do it???

If you say yes, then my other question will be: Why would you want to hand Miami a championship??


Have a nice day.

 

[houheffna]

If Miami offered the Bulls Lebron for Rose would you do it???

If you say yes, then my other question will be: Why would you want to hand Miami a championship??


Have a nice day.

From a business standpoint...no. From a basketball standpoint, most likely I would do it...but Miami would lose out in that situation. One player can be stopped by the other...so I don't think you are handing Miami anything.

 

[FirstTimer]

Rick Carlisle overrated him by saying he was a top 10 player of all-time. He should consider himself lucky to be in the top 30. In general, I don't think he's all that overrated at all. He was actually underrated up until last year.

Keep in mind the above poster thinks that Oscar Robertson is MAYBE in the top 15 of all time and wasn't sure he is better than Clyde Drexler. So everyone should just disregard his rankings

Except for that pesky little detail that Derrick Rose averages more assists and has a better assist-to-turnover ratio than LeBron James.

1. The difference isn't that large. For their careers you're talking
Lebron 7-3.4
Rose 6.8-2.9

Wow. HUGE difference there.

2.James is the better shooter and has been his entire career(even though neither are insanely great shooters), James is bigger, stronger, nearly as fast, neither are elite ball handlers and rely on their speed and quickness rather than going full out AND1 on people, James is the better/more versatile scorer.

Rose can't touch Lebron on offense. Lebron has won a scoring title and multiple MVPs playing the point position. Rose has not.

James>>Rose on offense

James>>>>>Rose on defense

 

[houheffna]

Just watch him when he chokes and you ll understand it.The frequency he lose the ball,or pass the ball to noone,or travel,or fail to crossover and make bad shots is very high when he is in a PG position.

Rose chokes too.But not so often.He may need more experience.You can't say this for LeBron.He plays in the NBA for one decade now.

Yes he is the best overall player in the NBA because he can do many things and because of his size.If a GM had to chose between a top PG and having LBJ in his team he will chose him probably.That doesn't mean he is a good PG.If the same GM had in their team Hakeem,Durant,Malone and Jordan and he was to chose one more player to complete the squad of course he will chose one top PG and not LBJ.The team would perform way much better with a top PG than with LBJ as "Point Forward" lol.It is called basketball and it is played for 120 years.Every player has their role in the game and every position too.You can't change it.

Btw it's a sin having Johnson's name in the same sentence with Lebron and talking about PG skills.

What the heck are you talking about? The game has evolved over the last 120 years. The only sport that has remained similar over that span is baseball. Football and basketball have evolved over the years. Otherwise, Magic Johnson wouldn't have been playing point guard 35 years ago! And then what happened when Kareem got hurt in the finals? I rest my case.

I guess you think tight ends are only for blocking right? Lebron can play and guard every position on the court. Now if you put together that all star group...WHY WOULDN'T YOU HAVE LEBRON PLAY THE POSITION? He can guard the position as well/better than anybody else in the league, and he dominated the league as the main facilitator with Mo Williams as his second best guy. By the way...Mo is a pg. His job was to get open when Lebron was on the floor with the ball.

You think Chalmers runs that offense? I don't think so...