Picture of Theo Baseball

[beckdawg]

this is the team with the 6th most revenue in all of major league baseball. this years team salary is what, that of the twins, indians, and athletics?

You're also talking about a team that has to pay $35 mil in interest on the debt incurred by the leveraged partnership that Zell would have forced on any new owner because he wants to avoid taxes. They also have $12.5 mil in upkeep on wrigley and that's before the proposed renovations. And on top of that they actually pay around $36.65 mil in revenue sharing to those smaller teams. Those 3 things account for ~$85 mil of their estimated $300 mil in revenue and that contributes nothing on the field. Also because of the team debt they can't pay down they are some what limited in what they can spend because the MLB has a rule that says your debt cannot be more than 10x your earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortization.

If you legitimately want to know where the money is going this article is pretty well written and informative. http://www.bleachernation.com/2014/...d-the-syncing-of-baseball-and-business-plans/

Honestly, the biggest issue is really that interest from debt because if they had another $35 mil to spend they would basically be where they were during the peak years of spending. To greatly simplify things, the reason they can't pay that down is because the way Zell structured the sale was such that he could avoid paying taxes using this leveraged partnership. If the Ricketts were to pay off that debt the government could then go after Zell for the taxes because the way leveraged partnerships are suppose to work is the seller helps finance the sale. In this case the partnership is almost certainly a fraud but so long as they continue to act like it's real there's not a ton they can do about it. And if the Ricetts were to pay down the debt the government would then have just cause to go after them.

 

[patg006]

If you legitimately want to know where the money is going this article is pretty well written and informative. http://www.bleachernation.com/2014/...d-the-syncing-of-baseball-and-business-plans/

There is nothing legitimate about where the money is going in that article.

The entire section is titled "Hypothetical Financial Breakdown for a Given Season"

Let you continue to pass it off as definite facts because you have no facts.

 

[patg006]

i think i have a realistic expectation: try to win. champions always try to win. the cubs are not even trying to win this year. or next, or the year after. they're waiting for some magical prospects to show up before they spend money. this is the team with the 6th most revenue in all of major league baseball. this years team salary is what, that of the twins, indians, and athletics?

Stop being ridiculous.

that doesn't insult you, as a supposed cubs fan? because it's insulting to me. as a guy that spent thousands of dollars on season tickets over the years, it's highly, highly insulting.

It should be highly insulting to anyone with an IQ above 50 with the ability to think independently.

 

[Boobaby1]

We're rebuilding. There really isn't much else to say. The reality is that we're not going to be signing a Prince Fielder or Albert Pujols right now. Nobody here is jizzing about Mike Olt or saying that all the kids are gonna be superstars but there is massive potential on its way up, which hasn't really been said in any recent memory of this organization. Clearly you're just as ignorant as some here if some don't hop right on board with a torch and axe demanding wins. I don't see why it is so hard to understand that this was coming before it even happened, and why it hasn't ended yet. If rebuilds took a season then you could complain but Jesus he was brought here on a tight budget and was told to upgrade the farm at all costs. He has done exactly that, if you want to ***** and whine like Pat and Fisch then ***** about Ricketts, and Ricketts alone.

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Considering the Cubs will not do what it takes versus what other teams will offer, they won't sign any marquis players. They have in fact only signed one in the existence of this franchise which is Soriano, and everybody and there mother's brother whines about that one.

People need to stop acting like when the right player comes about, that the Cubs will nab him. There are much, much heavier hitters that can puff up their chests and dwarf the Cubs.

The Cubs will always have to relegate to the smaller teams secondary players and hope and pray they can nab a fairly decent player because the good ones will extend or will go elsewhere, regardless of the state of the Cubs. Money talks 99% of the time.

 

[Jntg4]

Considering the Cubs will not do what it takes versus what other teams will offer, they won't sign any marquis players. They have in fact only signed one in the existence of this franchise which is Soriano, and everybody and there mother's brother whines about that one.

People need to stop acting like when the right player comes about, that the Cubs will nab him. There are much, much heavier hitters that can puff up their chests and dwarf the Cubs.

The Cubs will always have to relegate to the smaller teams secondary players and hope and pray they can nab a fairly decent player because the good ones will extend or will go elsewhere, regardless of the state of the Cubs. Money talks 99% of the time.

Why would you want Jason Marquis back? (Hint: You meant marquee)

 

[patg006]

Why would you want Jason Marquis back? (Hint: You meant marquee)

Why would you want to continue to the worst stretch of baseball in the history of the team that the current plan has delivered?

 

[beckdawg]

People need to stop acting like when the right player comes about, that the Cubs will nab him. There are much, much heavier hitters that can puff up their chests and dwarf the Cubs.

I've been saying seemingly forever that FA shouldn't be about adding great players but instead should be complimenting the team you have. Going toe to toe with LA or the yankees is typically going to end poorly. Like it or not they have more money to spend and if they want someone they can get them. I have always appreciated the Cardinals approach to team building. They draft/acquire talent well, develop that talent, and then either use it themselves or use it to acquire great players through trades. If you look at their success over the past decade or 15 years you're talking about getting major impact out of McGwire, Rolen, Edmonds and Holliday who were all players they traded for. Hell even Wainright(as a prospect) was someone they traded for. Their idea of a big FA signing is someone like Jhonny Peralta who they are giving $15 mil/season for the next 2 years followed by $12.5 then $10. Peralta filled a big need but he's not going to be expected to carry the team. He's a complimentary piece that makes a good team even better.

That's the approach I hope this front office takes. If they are strong in the draft as well as in IFA, they can bring in young talent and use it to acquire guys before they hit FA. They then should have more than enough money to extend whomever they see fit. Even someone like Shark who's been talked about in trades may still get extended if the difference in his values become closer from each side. It's clearly not a case of them not having the money for it. It's a case of him wanting to be paid like Homer Bailey types when he's not yet pitched to that level consistently.

If there's one thing I really appreciate about the cubs since Theo has been here it has been the ability to acquire pitching that seems pretty crappy and turn it into quality starters. Duncan made a lot of pitchers in St. Louis a lot of money by doing this. Thus far we've seen them able to coach up guys like Maholm, Wood, and Feldman into good middle of the rotation type arms. And being able to find those type of players has been a large part of St. Louis' success.

 

[zack54attack]

how about just some free agents? and hey, why not make a splash like a prince fielder? what the hell, why not?

are you another clueless sheep that just wants to believe?

i think i have a realistic expectation: try to win. champions always try to win. the cubs are not even trying to win this year. or next, or the year after. they're waiting for some magical prospects to show up before they spend money. this is the team with the 6th most revenue in all of major league baseball. this years team salary is what, that of the twins, indians, and athletics?

that doesn't insult you, as a supposed cubs fan? because it's insulting to me. as a guy that spent thousands of dollars on season tickets over the years, it's highly, highly insulting.

because you're going to sign one of those big FA's to a large contract that you will end up paying for in years ahead. Do you really want to live through the Hendry days again? Yeah, let's give a HUGE contract to a FA that will set the franchise back a few more years when they aren't ready to contend! That's the smart way!


No one is making buy those season tickets. That's your choice. You've known this team won't contend for a few years since Theo took over.

 

[Jntg4]

Why would you want to continue to the worst stretch of baseball in the history of the team that the current plan has delivered?

Jason Marquis would have been the savior, eh?

 

[SilenceS]

Jason Marquis would have been the savior, eh?

He is probably a better hitter then half our lineup! lol

 

[beckdawg]

He is probably a better hitter then half our lineup! lol

Carlos Zambrano for LF?

 

[patg006]

Jason Marquis would have been the savior, eh?

What could be the savior is if for just once you actually responded to a comment that was really made.

 

[The Bandit]

What's funny is we were never a big payroll team until that spending spree now people expect it.

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[justaChifan]

What's funny is we were never a big payroll team until that spending spree now people expect it.

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Cub's were never a big spending team until Tribune ownership.
They realized they could make huge profits off a loyal fan base with out putting too much into it. (something Ricketts noted at that time)
When the Trib realized the printed media was going down the tubes they decided to jack the sale price up of the golden goose and spend.

 

[Boobaby1]

because you're going to sign one of those big FA's to a large contract that you will end up paying for in years ahead. Do you really want to live through the Hendry days again? Yeah, let's give a HUGE contract to a FA that will set the franchise back a few more years when they aren't ready to contend! That's the smart way!


No one is making buy those season tickets. That's your choice. You've known this team won't contend for a few years since Theo took over.

Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't Tanaka's 6 yr 120 million not including the posting fee be considered a HUGE free agent contract? If they were willing to go that much for him, then obviously they thought that it was the smart way to do business even though they weren't planning on contending for a few years. I don't recall them saying it would set the team back.

And as far as the Hendry comment, do you expect me to believe that you weren't tickled pink when he had Sosa, got Prior, traded for Clement, extended Wood, inked Alou, inked Garciaparra, inked Maddux, traded for Lee, Ramirez, got DeRosa, and then traded him for Archer, rolled the dice on Dempster, and signed Soriano to name some? Okay! Oh the horror of the days when the Cubs were actually favored to win the division in over half of Hendry's tenure versus being predicted to finish in last place in every year of Theo's.

And lastly, every Cubs fan would have wanted Hendry's head had he not extended A-Ram, Lee, and big Z at the time. They were all All-Star caliber players. Hendry gets thrown under the bus, and Theo get's free passes for extending core guys that are currently hitting 3 for 26 and coming off of a piss poor season. And Soriano and A-Ram were notorious slow starters? Okay. I know it's early, but the core boys better pick it up a notch or two.

 

[CSF77]

Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't Tanaka's 6 yr 120 million not including the posting fee be considered a HUGE free agent contract? If they were willing to go that much for him, then obviously they thought that it was the smart way to do business even though they weren't planning on contending for a few years. I don't recall them saying it would set the team back.

And as far as the Hendry comment, do you expect me to believe that you weren't tickled pink when he had Sosa, got Prior, traded for Clement, extended Wood, inked Alou, inked Garciaparra, inked Maddux, traded for Lee, Ramirez, got DeRosa, and then traded him for Archer, rolled the dice on Dempster, and signed Soriano to name some? Okay! Oh the horror of the days when the Cubs were actually favored to win the division in over half of Hendry's tenure versus being predicted to finish in last place in every year of Theo's.

And lastly, every Cubs fan would have wanted Hendry's head had he not extended A-Ram, Lee, and big Z at the time. They were all All-Star caliber players. Hendry gets thrown under the bus, and Theo get's free passes for extending core guys that are currently hitting 3 for 26 and coming off of piss poor years. And Soriano and A-Ram were notorious slow starters? Okay. I know it's early, but the core boys better pick it up a notch or two.

It has more to do with age. 25 YO is around the same age as Castro and Rizzo. VS signing a 32 YO to a 10 year deal...err Pujos...who will be 42 YO making over 20 mil per to hopefully be able to hobble down to 1B.

As we have seen in the post Roids era...after 36 now is the free fall. Barry increased due to roids not to age.

 

[Boobaby1]

It has more to do with age. 25 YO is around the same age as Castro and Rizzo. VS signing a 32 YO to a 10 year deal...err Pujos...who will be 42 YO making over 20 mil per to hopefully be able to hobble down to 1B.

As we have seen in the post Roids era...after 36 now is the free fall. Barry increased due to roids not to age.

Lets see if Rizzo and Castro are still walking erect at age 37 or 38, let alone hitting 60 plus dingers and driving in over 200 runs.

And spare me the hamstringing of the team. If that was the case, they wouldn't have eaten most of his salary for an A ball prospect.

 

[CSF77]

That said Fielder made sense. They were cheap. Resigning Rammy for 3. Again 3 year deal is not a big deal. It is not 6 years in a free fall decline.

Each situation is different.

Even Sori picked it up some in his last 2. So his first 2 were good and his last 2 were good. Rest were under valued production.

If it is me. I wouldn't go over a 3 after 32. 30 YO max 6 year deal. 28 8 year deal.

I would want to get out around 36 YO in general. After that they are mostly DH or PH's at that point and kinda stupid to pay 20 mil for a DH or DL case.

There are some exceptions out there but even so those guys are making single digit.

SP same applies. 36 cut off. Look at the Phillies....they will lose their whole team very soon. That become a major over haul or a major F/A dump soon.

 

[CSF77]

Lets see if Rizzo and Castro are still walking erect at age 37 or 38, let alone hitting 60 plus dingers and driving in over 200 runs.

And spare me the hamstringing of the team. If that was the case, they wouldn't have eaten most of his salary for an A ball prospect.

Like I've said in the past on CBS: If it is me in 2012: I am aiming for Fielder because he was 28. Then Cespedes. At that point Rammy would have seen a commitment to winning and resigned. They would have contended and would be contending now.

They decided to overhaul and punt. Or in other words cut payroll and run cheaper cost.

Did I agree with them trading Sori: No I did not. I've said that it made sense to open up playing time to Lake. But seeing how they are giving Lake's playing time to Sweeney I do not agree with the logic of it.

I agree with some of what they did. Disagreed with some of what they did and are doing today.

Like starting Barney...really? I would rather have Boni at 2B and Lake in CF full time and let Sweeney and Rugg platoon in LF vs cutting Lakes AB's. How do you justify trading your best hitter for Lake when Lake is getting his PT cut anyways?

To me that holds little logic. And it shows lazy management where the easy mode is saying LHSP stack the line up the other way...ya sure that has been working well.....

The reality is it maters some but it doesn't regarding Sori. Would he alone helped us win those 3 games? Doubt it.

As it is I just want to see Olt and Lake full time and splitting up Rizzo and Schierholtz's bats in the line up vs working pointless platoons.

 

[Boobaby1]

It has more to do with age. 25 YO is around the same age as Castro and Rizzo. VS signing a 32 YO to a 10 year deal...err Pujos...who will be 42 YO making over 20 mil per to hopefully be able to hobble down to 1B.

As we have seen in the post Roids era...after 36 now is the free fall. Barry increased due to roids not to age.

As far as Pujols is concerned, the Cardinals were going to pay him 9 years and over 200 million. The friggin' Cardinals? And the Cubs fans think that Soriano's 7-132 million is the worst contract in the history of sports.

Think they will ever do what they Angels, Dodgers, Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, or Tigers are doing to net marquis players? Since the Cubs have only done it once in their existence, I will believe when I see it.