Random cubs/baseball talks

[CSF77]

That said Hamels would be a strong attempt with Ross as a back up.

DeGromm honestly would cost what Mil paid for Grenke to KC. I just don’t see that

 

[beckdawg]

Divorce case ended...
Demotion ended...

Darvish having bad games, playoff series etc may not end..

If he still cant get over a bad game, series he had 10 months ago on a different team what makes you think he'll get over the bad games he had here or whatever bad game or games he'll have in the next 5 years...

It not just about feeling bad about the series he had 10 months ago, it still affecting him now and how he been pitching.
He lost confidence in himself
He didn't want to be seen by the fans

He worried cubs fans hate him because of his start here..

So, unless he can win every game and dont lose in the playoff, he going to be affected by what fans and writers say about him..

That an issue, not sure how you can think otherwise



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You're essentially saying the guy is shit and will continue to be shit because he's had 5 bad outings out of 8 and likely was hurt during them plus 2 bad WS games. At this point in 2015, Jon Lester had a 4.03 ERA. Obviously he was broke beyond repair too... I try to cut you some slack man but you're not happy unless you're complaining about something. In spring training it was about how Almora and Heyward were batting .200 and were going to have bad years. Before that it was how this team should sell at the deadline last year because they were 43-45 at the break....etc.

 

[chibears55]

You're essentially saying the guy is shit and will continue to be shit because he's had 5 bad outings out of 8 and likely was hurt during them plus 2 bad WS games. At this point in 2015, Jon Lester had a 4.03 ERA. Obviously he was broke beyond repair too... I try to cut you some slack man but you're not happy unless you're complaining about something. In spring training it was about how Almora and Heyward were batting .200 and were going to have bad years. Before that it was how this team should sell at the deadline last year because they were 43-45 at the break....etc.

NO...

Im talking about his issues with his head not his stats and not his injury

We already had incidents with him
Imploding because of a balk , how he caves under pressure, the 5th inning issues..
Then it was the Cubs fans hates him

Now Dodgers fans and not wanting to be seen and booed by them snd maybe he shouldn't start a game at Dodger stadium if they meet in playoff because he wont handle that pressure.

Its always something with him mentally..
Anything that turns south for him, seems like he not mentally strong enough to get pass it..

That discouraging knowing he gonna be here for 5 more years and he supposed to be "the guy" at the top of the rotation that the cubs are going to count on for big games

https://cubbiescrib.com/2018/06/27/chicago-cubs-yu-darvish-little-dispel-mental-weakness-stories/

My post had Absolutely nothing to do with the way he has pitched to date..

I actually think he going to be fine in that department once he gets going and gets a solid game or two under his belt...

My concern is how he has been dealing with stuff that he lets affect him mentally


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[anotheridiot]

He's human. Humans have emotion. Just because he actually talks about his emotions rather than bottling them up doesn't make him a "head case." Fans like you are the reason all you ever get out of sports figures is canned answers like taking things one game at a time. You think Addy's divorce last year didn't mess him up mentally? La Stella wanted to quit baseball because he was demoted. Both are fine now and not "head cases."

Beck, Darvish has been bottling up these emotions since the world series. He has bottled up the fact he did not want to stand on the top step at dodgers stadium and get booed. If he pitches this year, and we go to the NLCS again, its about guaranteed they will not pitch him in Los Angeles. He has not spoken of this since November, I consider 8 months bottling it up.

These are things that should have been considered when they were courting him and deciding between him and cold shouldering Arrieta. But Theo is untouchable, the master plan paid off with Heyward after two shit years, we had one shit year with Lester, lets keep signing big name free agents.

 

[beckdawg]

Beck, Darvish has been bottling up these emotions since the world series. He has bottled up the fact he did not want to stand on the top step at dodgers stadium and get booed. If he pitches this year, and we go to the NLCS again, its about guaranteed they will not pitch him in Los Angeles. He has not spoken of this since November, I consider 8 months bottling it up.

These are things that should have been considered when they were courting him and deciding between him and cold shouldering Arrieta. But Theo is untouchable, the master plan paid off with Heyward after two shit years, we had one shit year with Lester, lets keep signing big name free agents.

You're assuming it's a problem. I think you guys are making something out of nothing. 2017 wasn't his first time in the playoffs. He's been bounced several times with Texas and never was the shell of a player you guys seem to suggest he is or will become. Also conveniently lost in this head case narrative is the fact he came into wrigley in game 3 of the NLCS and totally shut down the defending champs. If he was as mentally weak as people want to make him out to be why the hell would he specifically target teams that were playoff teams in FA? That was the whole narrative on him in FA.

What annoys me is that people are already dumping on him for no reason because what the think is going on in his head. His head isn't why he was ineffective. He didn't have command of his pitches as seen in his greatly elevated walk rate. If you take out the 3 starts where he didn't have command(5/2, 4/21, 4/13) his ERA would be 2.73 with a 11.73 k/9 and a 3.42 bb/9. His head wasn't the problem in the WS. He was tipping his pitches. Houston said as much after the fact.

 

[anotheridiot]

You're assuming it's a problem. I think you guys are making something out of nothing. 2017 wasn't his first time in the playoffs. He's been bounced several times with Texas and never was the shell of a player you guys seem to suggest he is or will become. Also conveniently lost in this head case narrative is the fact he came into wrigley in game 3 of the NLCS and totally shut down the defending champs. If he was as mentally weak as people want to make him out to be why the hell would he specifically target teams that were playoff teams in FA? That was the whole narrative on him in FA.

What annoys me is that people are already dumping on him for no reason because what the think is going on in his head. His head isn't why he was ineffective. He didn't have command of his pitches as seen in his greatly elevated walk rate. If you take out the 3 starts where he didn't have command(5/2, 4/21, 4/13) his ERA would be 2.73 with a 11.73 k/9 and a 3.42 bb/9. His head wasn't the problem in the WS. He was tipping his pitches. Houston said as much after the fact.

No, you are giving too much credit. Who really cares what he did BEFORE his implosion on the biggest stage in the world series that was the whole point of this discussion starting? Thats what got him his deal. Funny how LA did not fight us to sign him wasn't it? That was my argument at least, Arrieta proved he was a playoff contributor, Darvish got lit up in the world series.

Remember the last guy that got called out for tipping pitches? His name was Rich Hill. Apparently Greg Maddux did not like him so much, so when he got traded to LA, he gave up how Hill was tipping pitches and that guy got lost for 7 years. Two years longer than the deal we signed Darvish for. But its OK, he can be like Heyward and do shit for two years and then start earning his keep when he actually decides to swallow some pride and talk to a sports psychologist. Every team has one on staff, now we finally hear what the problem is.

 

[chibears55]

You're assuming it's a problem. I think you guys are making something out of nothing. 2017 wasn't his first time in the playoffs. He's been bounced several times with Texas and never was the shell of a player you guys seem to suggest he is or will become. Also conveniently lost in this head case narrative is the fact he came into wrigley in game 3 of the NLCS and totally shut down the defending champs. If he was as mentally weak as people want to make him out to be why the hell would he specifically target teams that were playoff teams in FA? That was the whole narrative on him in FA.

What annoys me is that people are already dumping on him for no reason because what the think is going on in his head. His head isn't why he was ineffective. He didn't have command of his pitches as seen in his greatly elevated walk rate. If you take out the 3 starts where he didn't have command(5/2, 4/21, 4/13) his ERA would be 2.73 with a 11.73 k/9 and a 3.42 bb/9. His head wasn't the problem in the WS. He was tipping his pitches. Houston said as much after the fact.

Speaking for myself..
Im not dumping on him and as i said i think he going to be all right pitching wise once he gets himself going again..
And im still glad they signed him

I just brought up the mental stuff because as of now because of certain things that happened throughout this year that seems to have had some impact on him mentally , just makes you pause and wonder if this is going to be a thing with him going forward.

Only time will tell

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[Diehardfan]

Boy, you can't beat this forum for classic misinformation. It's an absolute potpourri. We have hindsight managers, wishy-washy GM's, internet doctors, family counselors, phony baseball insiders and now we have added our own psychologist.

 

[Diehardfan]

Some moron mentioned Rich Hill dropping off the scene because of Greg Maddux....here's what really happened to him.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/la-sp-dodgers-rich-hill-profile-20170127-htmlstory.html

 

[JP Hochbaum]

Beck is actually on point here.

Darvish isn't a head case, the typical American male who treats emotions as a weakness are the actual head cases.

Right now Darvish is experiencing culture clashes where American baseball fans don't allow men to show emotion or experience failure without being booed or stigmatized. When you combine this behavior with Japanese culture it takes some adjustments. That is not being a head case, that is navigating some incredibly difficult emotional and traumatic waters.

An actual headcase has chemical imbalances that cause actual behavioral problems. Darvish exhibits no behavioral problems, just some temporary emotional setbacks.

 

[chibears55]

Beck is actually on point here.

Darvish isn't a head case, the typical American male who treats emotions as a weakness are the actual head cases.

Right now Darvish is experiencing culture clashes where American baseball fans don't allow men to show emotion or experience failure without being booed or stigmatized. When you combine this behavior with Japanese culture it takes some adjustments. That is not being a head case, that is navigating some incredibly difficult emotional and traumatic waters.

An actual headcase has chemical imbalances that cause actual behavioral problems. Darvish exhibits no behavioral problems, just some temporary emotional setbacks.

Good point..

But as i said earlier..

Even if it is just a case of him being over emotional and a cultural thing.


Who to say its just a one time thing or how long this will stay with him ..

The incident in LA was 10 mos ago and he still has an affect from it to a point where he hid in back of the dugout cause he didn't want to be seen and booed..

So, what if something happens here that he gets emotional about ..

Just something that a bit of a concern..

Ok.. i said my piece..
Just see where it goes, hopefully this is or will be it for him as far as that goes


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[CSF77]

Some moron mentioned Rich Hill dropping off the scene because of Greg Maddux....here's what really happened to him.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/la-sp-dodgers-rich-hill-profile-20170127-htmlstory.html

Hill was watching Kershaw one day and decided to model himself after him. He had to first strengthen his lower body so it was from the ground floor rebuild because he was not fully using his lower body to generate the torque needed to pitch at that level. Add to it he was a 4 seem guy with a nice hammer before. He learned to become a hammer pitcher and using that pitch as his primary weapon.


A lot of people are going over the top and going full tilt drama queen here. I said it before: Guy is injured and every one is acting like a bunch of fucking vultures ready to feast.

What the **** did he do wrong? Got injured after inking a deal? Did he rape your wife also? Holy shit

 

[anotheridiot]

Some moron mentioned Rich Hill dropping off the scene because of Greg Maddux....here's what really happened to him.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/la-sp-dodgers-rich-hill-profile-20170127-htmlstory.html

Hills baseball career ended with the cubs due to him getting wrecked due to the word going around the league about pitch tipping. That is the comparison to Darvish. If you want to start a pity party for Darvish and his hurt arm and beyond modern medicine being able to identify the problem, its your call. All I brought up is how the league destroys pitchers that tip pitches. Its like the abacus dealing sewing circle here dealing with percentages of hitting into a shift.

All this moron said was he fell off the map for 7 years, which is two years longer than Darvish is signed. Lets all hope he gets an honor in 7 years when he changes his delivery and becomes man of the year in 2025 with another team.

 

[anotheridiot]

Beck is actually on point here.

Darvish isn't a head case, the typical American male who treats emotions as a weakness are the actual head cases.

Right now Darvish is experiencing culture clashes where American baseball fans don't allow men to show emotion or experience failure without being booed or stigmatized. When you combine this behavior with Japanese culture it takes some adjustments. That is not being a head case, that is navigating some incredibly difficult emotional and traumatic waters.

An actual headcase has chemical imbalances that cause actual behavioral problems. Darvish exhibits no behavioral problems, just some temporary emotional setbacks.

REally? He has been in the US since 2012 at age 25. I am pretty sure he had time to work out his "culture" clashes. Now we are really stretching for excuses. Yeah, I remember how black players claim they were berated by the bitter cub fans when they came to the cubs and could not get out of town soon enough. Nobody is stretching here, Darvish himself has said how messed up his head is, said them to the wrong people and now he has to deal with it. Inasmuch as tipping pitches per Houstons own admission in the World Series will stay with Darvish, so will this worry about being booed.

 

[anotheridiot]

Hill was watching Kershaw one day and decided to model himself after him. He had to first strengthen his lower body so it was from the ground floor rebuild because he was not fully using his lower body to generate the torque needed to pitch at that level. Add to it he was a 4 seem guy with a nice hammer before. He learned to become a hammer pitcher and using that pitch as his primary weapon.


A lot of people are going over the top and going full tilt drama queen here. I said it before: Guy is injured and every one is acting like a bunch of fucking vultures ready to feast.

What the **** did he do wrong? Got injured after inking a deal? Did he rape your wife also? Holy shit

No, maybe we just want to make sure Theo does not get off the hook for this one too. All Darvish wants to do is strike people out. To me that shows trust issues already with your team mates being able to catch a baseball and make plays. It all makes sense now. Start the timetable until he reinvents himself.

 

[Adipost]

That said Hamels would be a strong attempt with Ross as a back up.

DeGromm honestly would cost what Mil paid for Grenke to KC. I just don’t see that

No way the Cubs burn prospects on another starter, it’s Darvish or bust.

 

[chibears55]

What the **** did he do wrong? Got injured after inking a deal? Did he rape your wife also? Holy shit

Except nobody talking about his injury
Or at least im not



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[JP Hochbaum]

REally? He has been in the US since 2012 at age 25. I am pretty sure he had time to work out his "culture" clashes. Now we are really stretching for excuses. Yeah, I remember how black players claim they were berated by the bitter cub fans when they came to the cubs and could not get out of town soon enough. Nobody is stretching here, Darvish himself has said how messed up his head is, said them to the wrong people and now he has to deal with it. Inasmuch as tipping pitches per Houstons own admission in the World Series will stay with Darvish, so will this worry about being booed.

Being in the US since he was 25 is irrelevant. What is relevant was being crushed in the WS last year. For Japanese players losing like that can result in great shame for his country. HE is not just dealing with starting off slowly but also dealing with the shame he brought to Japan.

You should read up a bit on Japans culture before further commenting, you're not really paying attention to what is going on here.

 

[Diehardfan]

No way the Cubs burn prospects on another starter, it’s Darvish or bust.

I agree. They've been getting burned way too much. As much as Brett screamed it to everyone, Quintana is not a TOR guy....so the Cubs gave up their best prospect for a 4 or 5 starter. But hey, he's under team control...big fucking deal. I didn't want Darvish or Jake back....I was ok to roll with Monty and Chatwood. But since Wildwood turned out to be a turd, that wouldn't have worked either. Things just not falling into place this year....don't make it worse by compromising the future. They've had one decent stretch this year but even that wasn't totally what they are capable of. Just play it out and see what happens.

 

[Omeletpants]

Cubs fans wildly overrate their own players. Fact is this team is full of average to slightly above average players. Nothing elite and none near the best in the league. But Theo and the Cubs money will keep them 8-12th best for years to come. When you think about that, contending is not so bad. They are a fun team to watch with great chemistry, but are they dominant? Nope