The Official T-Mac Thread

[FirstTimer]

Tremendous original argument? Not really.

Yeah because my original argument of pointing to direct series and situations was flawed......

That's wonderful. What I meant by that was he was young and not the leader of the team. That hardly qualifies to me as having a major part of the blame if his team loses.

Oh really? That's what you meant? Way to backpedal and change the argument completely. I would argue that Raptors team had no leadership between him and VC. Him and VC get credit for wins they take credit for the losses/failures as well.

He didn't have Artest around him at all. Only for a few games in the 2008-09 season when Tracy actually played. That was it.

A full half a season. So TMac gets a pass for being to hurt to lead the team to anything. Great. Doesn't matter anyways I suppose since it was Yao's team by that point anyways.

Detroit played horrible in those first 4 games. I think that was the year before they got Ben and Rasheed Wallace but they had a young Hamilton, Billups, and Prince.

Wrong. They had Ben Wallace. They didn't have Sheed.

And a TMac lead Orlando team still pissed down it's leg and couldn't close them out.

And... you are wrong.

They tied for the 7th seed with Milwaukee. They got bumped down because of a tie breaker.

Good luck making that argument.

Yao was averaging nearly 22-10/25-10/22-10 those seasons. McGrady was falling off.

McGrady hasn't been a truly efficient scorer since roughlu 2003. I don;t think he's shot anywhere near 45% since he was in Orlando and has been hovering around 41-43% for years. He was a volume scorer but has become horribly inefficient at it.

So... you are counting 2009... despite the injury... and using it against T-Mac... yet not counting T-Mac as "getting out of the first round" that year...

Unfair a lil bit....?

He never even played a game in those playoffs. I find it hilarious that of 7 years of teams playing with TMac in the playoffs the teams are 0-7. With two seasons of teams not having him playing in the playoffs they are 1 for 2. TMacs teams fair better when he isn't even playing in the playoffs. Yeah he's good........................

I find it amusing that you bring up his days in Toronto, and use them in reference to his "leadership." Pretty funny stuff.

I never ONCE referenced his "leadership" skills in Toronto. I referenced him being the second best player on that team and as playing a key role on that team.

Show me ONE post where I reference his "leadership" in Toronto.

Pull yo head out yo ass kid.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Yeah because my original argument of pointing to direct series and situations was flawed......

Oh really? That's what you meant? Way to backpedal and change the argument completely. I would argue that Raptors team had no leadership between him and VC. Him and VC get credit for wins they take credit for the losses/failures as well.

I think that's a simple-minded approach, but you can think of it however you'd like. You probed for more of an explanation and I gave you mine.

A full half a season. So TMac gets a pass for being to hurt to lead the team to anything. Great. Doesn't matter anyways I suppose since it was Yao's team by that point anyways.

Gets a pass... whatever.
He got hurt.
He played hard.
It will likely keep him out of the HOF but you can't deny just how good he was in his prime.
Look at how the media treats Ken Griffey, Jr. He was one of the BEST in his prime. One of the best defensively and one of the best HR hitters. The media looks at him through the spectrum of 'what-ifs' all of the time. Try criticizing his leadership and talents... then see your response by 99% of all baseball fans.

It's the same concept.

Wrong. They had Ben Wallace. They didn't have Sheed.

Good eye. My bad on that. But it doesn't help your point that ORL should have been favored at ANY point of that series.

And a TMac lead Orlando team still pissed down it's leg and couldn't close them out.

oooo low-blow. Now can you tell me what player was better than T-Mac on either team in that series?

They tied for the 7th seed with Milwaukee. They got bumped down because of a tie breaker.

You were wrong. Man-up. DET wasn't 2nd; they were 1st. ORL was 8th; not 7th- despite being tied record-wise with the 7th seeded team.

Yao was averaging nearly 22-10/25-10/22-10 those seasons. McGrady was falling off.

McGrady hasn't been a truly efficient scorer since roughlu 2003. I don;t think he's shot anywhere near 45% since he was in Orlando and has been hovering around 41-43% for years. He was a volume scorer but has become horribly inefficient at it.

I agree that he was past his prime with HOU, but I disagree with the assertion you could call Yao the leader of that team when T-Mac was the assertive play-maker (and leading scorer of that team through at least 2007).

He never even played a game in those playoffs. I find it hilarious that of 7 years of teams playing with TMac in the playoffs the teams are 0-7. With two seasons of teams not having him playing in the playoffs they are 1 for 2. TMacs teams fair better when he isn't even playing in the playoffs. Yeah he's good........................

You're right. He was good. Name me a time Kobe made it out of the first round without either Shaq or Pau. It's the same concept. T-Mac was the best player on the floor in nearly all of those series. And in 2005 the HOU Rockets were absolutely SCREWED by the referees against Dallas.

I never ONCE referenced his "leadership" skills in Toronto. I referenced him being the second best player on that team and as playing a key role on that team.

Show me ONE post where I reference his "leadership" in Toronto.

You were talking about it for some reason as apart of your "pissing on T-Mac" lecture. Maybe you were just talking out of your ass...? You tell me.

Pull yo head out yo ass kid.

So is that like your internet forum WWE-style finishing maneuver. :wacko: I am so impressed. I'm down for the 3-count.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

your friendly, neighborhood, simple-minded T-Mac hater:

Oh, T-Mac gets the blame for those (shitty) TOR and ORL teams losing in the 1st round.

I don't care if he averaged over 31 ppg in the DET series.

I don't care if he dominated in those HOU series.

I don't care that he was in a stacked Western Conference (where the top 6 out of 7 teams in the NBA called home for 3-4 seasons).

He couldn't even get out of the 1st round.... he is CRAP!!!

same guy if he wins just ONE of those series

T-Mac is soo good. He is a great leader.

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

your friendly, neighborhood, simple-minded T-Mac hater:

Oh, T-Mac gets the blame for those (shitty) TOR and ORL teams losing in the 1st round.

I don't care if he averaged over 31 ppg in the DET series.

I don't care if he dominated in those HOU series.

I don't care that he was in a stacked Western Conference (where the top 6 out of 7 teams in the NBA called home for 3-4 seasons).

He couldn't even get out of the 1st round.... he is CRAP!!!

same guy if he wins just ONE of those series:

T-Mac is soo good. He is a great leader.

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

 

[Undisputed]

This thread turned into all out war, as I expected.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Judging by your sig, it appears you are a fan of such.

^_^ ^_^

 

[Sin Jackal]

He has put up really nice numbers in the first round and has lead the league in scoring, but that is hardly anything to brag about. Especially when you're that player and still can't make it out of the first round. The guy I was responding to was making it seem like McGrady was this really experienced player in the play-offs. The statement, "He has been up there where everyone wants to be. He's gonna be a tough matchup coming off of the bench for anybody's tired first unit or their second units" couldn't be further from the truth. Derrick Rose has been as far as T-Mac has in the play-offs, Noah has, and Luol Deng has. He hasn't been anywhere(regardless of the teams he had), just some really nice individual numbers.

I do have to give it to McGrady before he got injured, he was a great player. For some reason he just couldn't lead his teams out of the first round in the West on teams that should have.

There's only one year where I felt the Rockets actually had a shot at getting out of the first round, and they didn't. It didn't happen over and over, the Rockets were constantly without Yao, or without T-Mac, or without someone else who they needed to advance. I really can't blame T-Mac for not being able to advance when Yao, the anchor of their team, wasn't even there vs a tough Jazz team, when Scola was moderately unproven and really falling on his face when it came to putting in point blank shots at the basket.

T-Mac gets a hell of a lot more blame than he should. There's no such thing as a first round curse. KG didn't get out of the first round for like, a LONG ass time. . .people called him a selfish overrated player because of it. He obviously wasn't selfish and overrated. . .well not selfish anyway. The guy was a good player, but his teams always seemed to falter just enough to not be able to win.

I don't unfairly blame players for not advancing. Just like I don't unfairly give players too much credit for advancing (like Kobe fans do for example). Some even say if the Bulls get T-Mac, they're guaranteed to not get to the second round? That's completely ridiculous. . .everyone knows it.

Undisputed is right......T-Mac has only done really nice individually. That's why he's thinking himself first before a team. Even though I'm a fan of him.....gotta give the truth about him on that.

T-Mac was always trying to set up his team and play D' in the playoffs, at least when he was on the Rockets. I didn't watch him at all when he was with Orlando. I don't watch eastern conf' first round games besides the 4/5 matchup. The conference is so weak, there's no point in watching EC first round anymore. Teams 1, 2 and 3 always advance, and have every year for years. Even the 4th seed usually advances. It's not interesting unless you're collecting Drive to the Finals points and want to watch live.

T Mac even in his best days where he was 25+ PPG scorer could NEVER carry a team in the playoffs

Honestly, that whole deal is extremely childish and unfair to T-Mac. Kobe did exactly: Garbage when he didn't have a good team backing him up. He never got out of the first round. Nobody can win with a bad/average team. It doesn't matter how good the player is. It's not an individual sport.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

kobe had much less around him imo tho i see your point and a lot of people forget that but even when kobe was losing in the playoffs he was still performing well(the 2 OT game vs. Phoenix in 07)

as i said lebron and wade have done better in the playoffs with worse teams

regardless T Mac just cant be a first option on a team thats committed to win even in his prime....he is a pippen a sidekick....i guess the same can be said about lebron even tho lebron is a much better all around player and much better at carrying a team on his back that t mac ever was

that's what im leaving with

oh btw its not like T Mac had nothing when he was at Orlando either

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

its not like T Mac had nothing when he was at Orlando either

He had Mike Miller, Pat Garrity, Gordon Giricek, an old and useless Kemp, and Grant Hill for a couple of games.

Does that count?

 

[FirstTimer]

I think that's a simple-minded approach, but you can think of it however you'd like. You probed for more of an explanation and I gave you mine.

Bullshit you have. You've doe nothing but get TMac all over your chin this entire thread.

"Tmac didn't have much of a role in Toronto"

"He was the second leading scorer and played 30+ MPG"

"I meant he wasn't a leader"

............

LOL

Keep backpedaling.

Look at how the media treats Ken Griffey, Jr. He was one of the BEST in his prime. One of the best defensively and one of the best HR hitters. The media looks at him through the spectrum of 'what-ifs' all of the time.

Because he got hurt in Cincy. Yes. but are you seriously comparing The Kid to Tracy fucking McGrady? By the time Griffey got hurt he was already one of the best players to ever play the game and that wasn't even up for debate. McGrady was one of the top players in the NBA but was being mentioned nowhere near best players of AllTime status. Griffey gets a "pass" because before the injuries hit he was already one of the best ever. TMac never was. Griff got hurt and came back and had some VERY productive years...then tailed off. McGrady got hurt and was never the same adn tailed off drastically.

Apples meet oranges.

It's the same concept.

No, it's not.

Good eye. My bad on that. But it doesn't help your point that ORL should have been favored at ANY point of that series.

If a team is up 3-1 in a best of 7 series any statistical analysis would favor that team to win the series.

oooo low-blow. Now can you tell me what player was better than T-Mac on either team in that series?

Uhh I never implied TMac wasn't the best player in that series which makes my point even more firm. Orlando had a 3-1 lead. Had the best player in the series and couldn't close it out. McGrady couldn't lead that team to victory.

You were wrong. Man-up. DET wasn't 2nd; they were 1st. ORL was 8th; not 7th- despite being tied record-wise with the 7th seeded team.

You do realize the way NBA seeds teams is they double seed the tied spot then go to tie breakers right? Most any site will shows two (7) seeds that season then the tie break.

I agree that he was past his prime with HOU, but I disagree with the assertion you could call Yao the leader of that team when T-Mac was the assertive play-maker (and leading scorer of that team through at least 2007).

Try 2006...and Yao was averaging double doubles and McGrady was regressing. That offense ran through Yao from basically his 3rd season in the NBA on. McGrady was the best player on Houstons roster for maybe 2 seasons tops.

You're right. He was good. Name me a time Kobe made it out of the first round without either Shaq or Pau.

Really? Comparing Mcgrady(who had 4 good seasons) to Kobe Bryant, arguably the 2nd best SG ever? That's where we want to go with this?

"Show me where Jordan went without Pippen or Pippen without MJ"

Name me a time where any player went anywhere by himself. The issue is Mcgrady wasn't ALONE. He had some very solid teams around him. I'm not arguing that McGrady was surrounded by HOF'ers, but he wasn't surrounded by the 1985 Chicago Bulls either. You give Kobe some of those Houston teams(04-05, 06-07) with Yao in the playoffs and he's getting past the 1st round.

You were talking about it for some reason as apart of your "pissing on T-Mac" lecture

Actually I wasn't/never was.

Show me where I did or just quit making bullshit up.

your friendly, neighborhood, simple-minded T-Mac hater:

Oh, T-Mac gets the blame for those (shitty) TOR and ORL teams losing in the 1st round.

I don't care if he averaged over 31 ppg in the DET series.

I don't care if he dominated in those HOU series.

I don't care that he was in a stacked Western Conference (where the top 6 out of 7 teams in the NBA called home for 3-4 seasons).

He couldn't even get out of the 1st round.... he is CRAP!!!

same guy if he wins just ONE of those series:

T-Mac is soo good. He is a great leader.

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Hyperbole FTL.

Show me again one post where I ever called TMAC "crap" or put the blame soley on him? Does the rest of his team deserve some of the blame? Yes. But as the leader in Orlando, and Houston he also shoulders a majority of the responsibility for those teams success and failures. That's the nature of the beast. It's like that in every sport. Stop being dense.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Bullshit you have. You've doe nothing but get TMac all over your chin this entire thread.

"Tmac didn't have much of a role in Toronto"

"He was the second leading scorer and played 30+ MPG"

"I meant he wasn't a leader"

............

LOL

Keep backpedaling.

You mad? You were the one talking about him in Toronto, as if it was his fault they lost.

C'mon, son. You sound like one of those fans that want to blame the BEST player for the loss and hold him on your shoulders when he wins.

Because he got hurt in Cincy. Yes. but are you seriously comparing The Kid to Tracy fucking McGrady?

Yes

By the time Griffey got hurt he was already one of the best players to ever play the game and that wasn't even up for debate.

T-Mac in his prime is one of the best players to ever play the game.

McGrady was one of the top players in the NBA but was being mentioned nowhere near best players of AllTime status.

In his prime, he was certainly up in the top 20. Griffey isn't regarded much higher than top 10 of his sport.

Griffey gets a "pass" because before the injuries hit he was already one of the best ever.

Uh huh.... you're on the right track.

TMac never was.

darn. ya just blew it. Name me 10 better wing players in their prime. Bet ya can't.

Griff got hurt and came back and had some VERY productive years...then tailed off. McGrady got hurt and was never the same adn tailed off drastically.

Apples meet oranges.

Griff's my favorite baseball player ever so I get that. To be fair, McGrady hasn't gotten a chance to come back from his injuries yet. He tried to comeback prematurely and it didn't pan out.

If a team is up 3-1 in a best of 7 series any statistical analysis would favor that team to win the series.

If you are simple-minded and don't watch the games... sure. I wonder if you do that... your lack of insight about the game of basketball itself speaks volumes.

Uhh I never implied TMac wasn't the best player in that series which makes my point even more firm. Orlando had a 3-1 lead. Had the best player in the series and couldn't close it out. McGrady couldn't lead that team to victory.

There you go again with no insight. Detroit had no business losing any game to that scrub Magic team + McGrady. They realized they were screwing themselves and came to play in Games 5-7. 'Nuff said.

You do realize the way NBA seeds teams is they double seed the tied spot then go to tie breakers right? Most any site will shows two (7) seeds that season then the tie break.

and do you realize you are bringing up irrelevant points instead of just simply admitting you were wrong about ORL being an 8th seed?

yyyeeeeaaahh... funny.

Try 2006...and Yao was averaging double doubles and McGrady was regressing. That offense ran through Yao from basically his 3rd season in the NBA on. McGrady was the best player on Houstons roster for maybe 2 seasons tops.

2006 isnt even a debate.

2007 and 08 Yao averaged 1-2 more points than T-Mac while playing 48 then 55 games. T-Mac was getting about 6 assists per game compared to Yao's 9ish rebounds.

T-Mac was still better than Yao.

Really? Comparing Mcgrady(who had 4 good seasons) to Kobe Bryant, arguably the 2nd best SG ever? That's where we want to go with this?

Your whole basis is that

'wahhhh T-Mac never got out of the 1st round'

Show me where Kobe got out of round 1 without a stellar superstar alongside him? Kobe's surrounding talent has just about ALWAYS been MUCH better than T-Mac's.

You can't even tell me otherwise.

"Show me where Jordan went without Pippen or Pippen without MJ"

Exactly, son. It's a TEAM game. Bravo to you for finally realizing that.

Name me a time where any player went anywhere by himself.

Yay, bravo!

The issue is Mcgrady wasn't ALONE.

I'm so proud growing up before my own eyes

He had some very solid teams around him.

just not as good in terms of quality teammates as: Jordan, Bryant, Wade, or any other guy that has won a ring. hmmmm....

I'm not arguing that McGrady was surrounded by HOF'ers, but he wasn't surrounded by the 1985 Chicago Bulls either.

Simple-minded again. The West was STACKED from about 2004-2009. It still was in 2010...

You give Kobe some of those Houston teams(04-05, 06-07) with Yao in the playoffs and he's getting past the 1st round.

Disagree. In the 05 series T-Mac was screwed. The Rockets had that series until Gms 3-6... it was a serious screw-job.

06-07: T-Mac OWNED in that series... and the year after... are you actually blaming him for that loss? If so, ha.

Actually I wasn't/never was.

Show me where I did or just quit making bullshit up.

STUNNER!!! IM OUT!!! 1! 2!! 3!!!! FIRSTTIMER WINS!!!

Hyperbole FTL.

Har. har.

Show me again one post where I ever called TMAC "crap" or put the blame soley on him? Does the rest of his team deserve some of the blame? Yes. But as the leader in Orlando, and Houston he also shoulders a majority of the responsibility for those teams success and failures.

Huh? That sounds pretty simple-minded... again.

That's the nature of the beast. It's like that in every sport.

You see... I watch the games. I don't need the over-glorifying/over-shitting-on-players media telling me who to love and who to loathe.

I have my own thoughts and views.

I don't have much inclination to believe that you do. You seem to just go with the "T-Mac is whack" herd.

Stop being dense.

Now that's irony. So, I'm dense because I actually watch the games and appreciate how great T-Mac was...

...while you knock him. And pass him off as a scapegoat for his teams' failures in the playoffs when it was actually most of his teammates faults.

Is T-Mac greater than Jordan? No. But is he comparable to like EVERY other wing man to ever play? Yes. He was that good.

Right.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Yeah but that ignores the fact that McGrady failed 4 times to make it past the 1st Round in the Eastern Conference when he was with the Raptors(once) and Magic(three times).

His teammates were shit.

And with the Magic they were up 3-1 on the Detroit Pistons once and blew the series.

I'm sure T-Mac, and his 31+ ppg were to blame. You see a team like DET and a team like ORL back then and you'd be a fool not to pick DET on a game-to-game basis. It's a testament to how good T-Mac was that they won 3 games in that series.

 

[X]

lulz.

 

[payton 34ever]

Will you two get a room already?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceLlz7dOOvY]YouTube - Tracy McGrady: 13 points in 33 seconds[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OHUAjxPo4I]YouTube - T-Mac Dunk on Shawn Bradley[/ame]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5KjSA29Rhs[/ame]

I love how T-Mac's teams were competitive in every playoff series he's ever been in - even though that they, rightfully, should have been favored in none of them.

I believe, too, McGrady and the Rockets were absolutely screwed in 2005 in that series vs Dallas...

http://blogs.chron.com/sportsupdate/archives/2008/10/nba_referee_rep.html

 

[X]

I love how you show a video of a guy "dunking on" a guy who doesn't jump in the play.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

I love how you show a video of a guy "dunking on" a guy who doesn't jump in the play.

That video is the definition of getting "dunked on."

I get that Shawn Bradley didn't have talent. But he was always up there in the NBA in blocks/game. He was 7'6'' man... he actually did jump too but a split-second later, he was getting ridden like Paris Hilton... that's pwnage.

 

[FirstTimer]

You mad? You were the one talking about him in Toronto, as if it was his fault they lost.

No I wasn't.

Again:

You: Mcgrady had no role in Toronto.

Me: He was the second leading scorer and played over 30MPG. (That's obviously having a "role".

/discussion.

C'mon, son. You sound like one of those fans that want to blame the BEST player for the loss and hold him on your shoulders when he wins.

I never blamed McGrady exclusively for anything. I said McGrady couldn't lead his team. I blamed for Mcgrady for not being a leader and not getting it done when he should have. When you sign huge free agent deals and become "the guy" it comes with the territory.

Yes

Then please quit being a "fan" of anything.

Ken Griffey Jr =/= to Tracy McGrady. Ever. In anything.

T-Mac in his prime is one of the best players to ever play the game.

No he was not. Not even close.

The fact that you are even saying this shows that you are simply a McGrady jock rider and really are just defending him because he's your NBA boyfriend or something.

In his prime, he was certainly up in the top 20. Griffey isn't regarded much higher than top 10 of his sport.

Again. No. I wouldn't even put him in the top 75-100.

Shit, I don't even think SLAM magazine was dumb enough to put him in their top 100 last year.

McGrady was barely better than a guy like Bernard King.

darn. ya just blew it. Name me 10 better wing players in their prime. Bet ya can't.

Jordan
Kobe
Baylor
West
Bird
Gervin
Dr. J
Earl Monroe
AI
Bird
Havlecik
Rick Barry
Lebron
'Nique


There's 14.

Griff's my favorite baseball player ever so I get that. To be fair, McGrady hasn't gotten a chance to come back from his injuries yet.

Yeah he's only been trying to "come back" for 2 seasons...

If you are simple-minded and don't watch the games... sure. I wonder if you do that... your lack of insight about the game of basketball itself speaks volumes.

Yeah because clearly watching a team go up 3-1 would make me think the teams thats down 3-1 has been playing real well and had a chance....

There you go again with no insight. Detroit had no business losing any game to that scrub Magic team + McGrady. They realized they were screwing themselves and came to play in Games 5-7. 'Nuff said.

Or McGrady choked because he actually thought the series was over after game 4.

2006 isnt even a debate.

2007 and 08 Yao averaged 1-2 more points than T-Mac while playing 48 then 55 games. T-Mac was getting about 6 assists per game compared to Yao's 9ish rebounds.

T-Mac was still better than Yao.

Disagree entirely....

Your whole basis is that

'wahhhh T-Mac never got out of the 1st round'

I'm not really crying about...because I don't really care.

just not as good in terms of quality teammates as: Jordan, Bryant, Wade, or any other guy that has won a ring. hmmmm....

Except I'm not insisting McGrady win a ring....so that comparison doesn't hold any weight. I just want him to win a 1st round playoff series....which he has never done.

Simple-minded again. The West was STACKED from about 2004-2009. It still was in 2010...

No, it's not simple minded. I'm not saying for TMac to run the West. I'm asking him to finish off a first round playoff series. He never has.

Disagree. In the 05 series T-Mac was screwed. The Rockets had that series until Gms 3-6... it was a serious screw-job.

Of course it was........................................... :lmao:

06-07: T-Mac OWNED in that series... and the year after... are you actually blaming him for that loss? If so, ha.

Yes. I'm blaming TMac for not being Kobe Bryant?.....

STUNNER!!! IM OUT!!! 1! 2!! 3!!!! FIRSTTIMER WINS!!!

Still waiting..................

Huh? That sounds pretty simple-minded... again.

No, it's not simple minded. You can keep trying to dismiss it as such but the reality of sports is that "The Guy" on the team shoulders more responsibility for the success and failures of the team. I forgot Jud Buechler being judged equally with Michael Jordan for the success of the Chicago Bulls or Delonte West being equally judged for the failures of the Cleveland Cavs.

You see... I watch the games.

You really obviously don't.

I don't need the over-glorifying/over-shitting-on-players media telling me who to love and who to loathe.

And I'm not telling you to love or loathe anyone.

I have my own thoughts and views.

God Bless America.?

I don't have much inclination to believe that you do. You seem to just go with the "T-Mac is whack" herd.

I don't think he's "whack". I said he was a very good player..in this thread or another..but he wasn't a great player. I hold the word "great" aside for others...

Now that's irony. So, I'm dense because I actually watch the games and appreciate how great T-Mac was...

...while you knock him. And pass him off as a scapegoat for his teams' failures in the playoffs when it was actually most of his teammates faults.

Poor TMac...getting judged the way all players were/are judged.

Is T-Mac greater than Jordan? No. But is he comparable to like EVERY other wing man to ever play? Yes. He was that good.

Nope.

Right.[/QUOTE]

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

just something interesting i found a long time ago....i think its update on par to include the 09-10 season.....HOF monitor....>135=like HOF....T Mac is 136...other notables...tim duncan is 441...lebron is 245
databaseBasketball.com - NBA Hall of Fame Monitor, NBA Hall of Fame Formula

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Jordan
Kobe
Baylor
West
Bird
Gervin
Dr. J
Earl Monroe
AI
Bird
Havlecik
Rick Barry
Lebron
'Nique

those^ guys better than McGrady?

Sorry, no.