Update On The "Great Moves".

[KBisBack!]

McPhail wasn't made GM until 2000.

Derp.

I said McPhail came to the Cubs in 1994.

Reading comprehension is good.

McPhail was President of the Cubs starting in 1994.

You know the same position that Epstein now holds.

Clearly you don't have a clue what you are talking about as usual.

Troll on.

 

[FirstTimer]

I said McPhail came to the Cubs in 1994.

Reading comprehension is good.

McPhail was President of the Cubs starting in 1994.

You know the same position that Epstein now holds.

Clearly you don't have a clue what you are talking about as usual.

Troll on.

President under the Trib =/= to President Functions under private ownership, especially in regards to the way Theo is a president vs MacPhail. Job functions are different.

 

[KBisBack!]

You must be unfamiliar with the 2005-2006 tear downs/re-tooling and the events of the last few years..namely last season

With the Red Sox??

The 2005-2006 seasons where they still ranked second in payroll?

Or last year when they were third in payroll?

Or if you are talking about the Cubs, the Ricketts were even the owners in 2005-2006 so that has nothing to do with the point made.

Troll on.

 

[KBisBack!]

President under the Trib =/= to President Functions under private ownership, especially in regards to the way Theo is a president vs MacPhail. Job functions are different.

Semantics as usual after the facts showed clearly you didn't know what you are talking about as usual.

Troll on.

You thought McPhail didn't join the Cubs until 2000 which is why you incorrectly stated it was almost a decade after winning the WS in Minn.

Exposed.

 

[FirstTimer]

With the Red Sox??

The 2005-2006 seasons where they still ranked second in payroll?

The Cubs are still $104 million in payroll this season.

It's possible to "tear down" and "retool" and still have a high payroll.

Derp.

 

[FirstTimer]

You thought McPhail didn't join the Cubs until 2000

Wrong. As usual.

I said MacPhail "didn't take the job" until nearly a decade after his last title. Which is true. President under the Trib was more a financial position(hence MacPhail was also CEO at the time). Under Ricketts the entire FO structure was changed and Epsteins position is more of an executive GM title with the financials being handled separately.


You'd have the understand reality to realize all this though

 

[JosMin]

Semantics as usual after the facts showed clearly you didn't know what you are talking about as usual.

Troll on.

You thought McPhail didn't join the Cubs until 2000 which is why you incorrectly stated it was almost a decade after winning the WS in Minn.

Exposed.

 

[dabynsky]

Well this is an awesome exchange of ideas as usual. I can't wait to see how arguing about the similarities and differences between MacPhail era leadership structure versus Epstein era leadership structure turns out.

 

[SilenceS]

Wrong. As usual.

I said MacPhail "didn't take the job" until nearly a decade after his last title. Which is true. President under the Trib was more a financial position(hence MacPhail was also CEO at the time). Under Ricketts the entire FO structure was changed and Epsteins position is more of an executive GM title with the financials being handled separately.


You'd have the understand reality to realize all this though

Cite this?

 

[KBisBack!]

The Cubs are still $104 million in payroll this season.

It's possible to "tear down" and "retool" and still have a high payroll.

$104 million is not a high payroll anymore though.

It ranks 14th in baseball.

Middle of the pack.

Not high.

Keep trolling on.

 

[FirstTimer]

Cite this?

You seriously need me to cite the fact that Andy MacPhail was the CEO of the Cubs?

 

[SilenceS]

You seriously need me to cite the fact that Andy MacPhail was the CEO of the Cubs?

I want you to cite what is different in their jobs not just an assumption of what was different.

 

[FirstTimer]

$104 million is not a high payroll anymore though.

It ranks 14th in baseball.

Middle of the pack.

Not high.

Keep trolling on.

Good use of math. Shall we ignore the next team after the Cubs is $13 million dollars away at 91? Then it quickly drops off the table?

But yeah $104 million is chump change and not a high payroll.

:andruw:

 

[KBisBack!]

President under the Trib was more a financial position(hence MacPhail was also CEO at the time).

Facts and sources to supported this subjective statement?

McPhail was brought to the Cubs because of his track record of developing the farm system and building teams built around homegrown talent.

Sound familiar?

Anyone old enough to remember McPhail's hiring knows he was brought in to do the same exact thing that Theo says he wants to do.

Reality > agenda

 

[KBisBack!]

Good use of math. Shall we ignore the next team after the Cubs is $13 million dollars away at 91? Then it quickly drops off the table?

But yeah $104 million is chump change and not a high payroll.

When there are 13 teams with a higher payroll, that is 43% of the league, it doesn't matter if it is over $100M. It is not a high payroll in comparison to the rest of the league.

Keep trying to move the goalposts.

Troll on.

 

[FirstTimer]

I want you to cite what is different in their jobs not just an assumption of what was different.

It's not an assumption. Being the President and CEO of a team run by the tribune and having a GM under you is not the same thing as being the President of baseball operations, with no CEO title and having a GM under you.

Do you REALLY forget how things are run?

The entire FO was restructured. MacPhails "president/CEO" job basically got broken up amongst the Ricketts and Crane Kenney(who is now President of Business Operations). The baseball side got redone so now you have a President of Baseball Operations alone(Epstein) and the GM(Hoyer). Under the Trib MacPhail was essentially a combination of the financial marketing side, and CEO overseeing baseball spending. Hendry was basically Exec GM/GM.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/stor...-cubs-working-extending-crane-kenney-contract

Ricketts restructured the Cubs' front office in October with the hire of Theo Epstein as the team's president of baseball operations. That development shifted Kenney's title from team president to president of business operations. Kenney has had Ricketts' trust since purchasing the team from Sam Zell and the Tribune in October of 2009.

Ricketts broke the baseball and business side of things up. Under MacPhail it was a lumped together fucking mess for the most part with GM's kind of sort of reporting to MacPahil who sort of reported to the Trib but MacPahil had little to do with day to day roster moves etc. He was basically a yes man or clearing house between Lynch/Hendry and the Trib.

 

[FirstTimer]

When there are 13 teams with a higher payroll, that is 43% of the league, it doesn't matter if it is over $100M. It is not a high payroll in comparison to the rest of the league.

Keep trying to move the goalposts.

Troll on.

The goal posts aren't being moved.

The Cubs have a high payroll.

Sorry. $100 million dollars is a lot of money. Both relative to the minimum wage you make and what most of the other teams in baseball are spending.

 

[KBisBack!]

You seriously need me to cite the fact that Andy MacPhail was the CEO of the Cubs?

PRESIDENT and CEO.

Not just CEO.

He was brought in to be President of the team, build the farm system system and build the major league team around home grown prospects.

The exact same thing that Theo is trying to do that most of you think is an easy and simple task that has no chance of failing.

It is an accurate and relevant comparison that doesn't fit the agenda of how there is no chance this plan will fail.

 

[KBisBack!]

The goal posts aren't being moved.

The Cubs have a high payroll.

Sorry. $100 million dollars is a lot of money. Both relative to the minimum wage you make and what most of the other teams in baseball are spending.

When 43% of the league is spending more than the Cubs are that is not a high payroll.

Sorry.

 

[FirstTimer]

PRESIDENT and CEO.

Not just CEO.

He was brought in to be President of the team, build the farm system system and build the major league team around home grown prospects.

The exact same thing that Theo is trying to do that most of you think is an easy and simple task that has no chance of failing.

It is an accurate and relevant comparison that doesn't fit the agenda of how there is no chance this plan will fail.

And President under the Trib is different than President under Ricketts as shown by the simple fact that when Rickett's came in he split the business side from the baseball side!

Hence why Crane kenny holds the job he currently has.

MacPhail President/CEO =/= to Theo President of Baseball Operations