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"are you really that dense" is particularly clever as you miss the point.
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"are you really that dense" is particularly clever as you miss the point.
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good point.
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Does this mean they have to give The World Cup back now?
Shantz My Pants
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Because my point was if they do find him guilty to rape, we still have to take it with a grain of salt because as you state only 2% ever let all the facts out and settled with no plea deal?
If they find him guilty of rape, beyond a reasonable doubt, he's guilty. No way in hell if he does get charged his defensive attorney wouldn't go through every piece of evidence to prove the contrary. This isn't a civil suit right now, it's a criminal investigation. If he gets charged it's not by the female, it's by the state of New York.
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italianbeef
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Depends on who you ask. The definition below pretty much says that any woman who has sex after drinking was raped, because her judgement was impaired.
http://www.care.uci.edu/general/Sexual-Assault---Defining.aspx
Rape: A specific form of sexual assault that includes an act of sexual intercourse (vaginal, anal, or oral penetration), accomplished against a person who does not consent to the sexual contact, or is incapable of consenting. This includes situations in which a victim is...
Forced to engage in intercourse
Threatened with harm if they do not participate
Prevented from resisting due to intoxication from alcohol or drugs
Incapable of giving consent because of a disability
Asleep or unconscious to the nature of the act
...
Alcohol is the most commonly used chemical in drug facilitated sexual assault. In large part this is due to the fact that alcohol is easily accessible and a chemical that many people use in social interactions.
Effects on the Victim:
Ability to protect herself or himself is reduced
Impaired judgment
May not realize that a situation has become dangerous
May have trouble handling or avoiding conflict
Perceptions of others not as clear
Difficult to set limits
Ability to resist, both physically and verbally, may be impaired
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Why are you linking something from the University of California?
Maybe link something regarding the state of NY or the county in which this allegedly happened.
Is Kaner going on a rape tour that no one knows about?
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Shantz My Pants
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Bearin' Down
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Rask, we get it, you have been unfairly treated by the judicial system of Colorado. However, you are not Patrick Kane, pursuant to the salary thread you are broke as shit so you can't afford a good attorney, Colorado is not new York, and there is no real incentive for the state to go after you to a greater extent than Patrick Kane. So, what you're continually yammering about, no offense meant, is unrelated to the circumstance at hand.
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italianbeef
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I was just refuting Trev's claim in general.
DMelt36
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If the way that you (not you specificially, beef, a "you" as a person in general) have sex with a woman is that you get her so shitfaced that she loses the ability to say no ... yeah, I'd consider that rape.
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Again...I think you are overestimating the omniscience and pursuit of "justice" by the justice system. This and many of the comments sound to me like some are ready to believe there is a high likelihood Kaner raped somebody as soon as he is charged.
Ask a lawyer about it. Much of what I'm repeating was told to me by the Public Defenders office.
italianbeef
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The "Effects on the Victim" clarifications make that very subjective, though.
Passed out is one thing. "Impaired judgement" quite another.
One beer on an empty stomach can impair a smaller person's judgement.
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yes....but what happens in judicial practice is the extension of the rules and the lines get blurred around the area of "she didn't say no" and "she was too impaired to make a rational decision." Nothing is black or white, and even if it is the lawyers on both sides will end up muddying the waters.
We will likely never know what happened, though we will hear allegations, and defense. Prepare to deal with this for at least half the 2015/2016 season. Maybe all of it.
Shantz My Pants
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You didn't refute shit. If a girl is shit faced blackout drunk and can't consent then it's rape. Just because you are drunk doesn't make it any better for you.
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Now we will never be able to trade Patrick Kane for Ryan Miller 
Was dat better beefster?
Was dat better beefster?
Bearin' Down
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I don't need to ask a lawyer about it. The state of New York will want to try Kane if they charge him. They will not want him to enter into a plea deal as it creates bad press as it promotes the notion that the rich get off easily.
However, Kane can afford good representation. This will allow for the potential creation of doubt. Kane isn't going to happily forgo his life and millions for a shorter sentence. He can afford to litigate.
Having said all that, charges won't be brought until they can uncover no more evidence or until they have enough to convict. This isn't your case. The state's opponent is formidable.
italianbeef
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Again, they didn't define it as "shit faced blackout drunk". One could read the below and claim that a 100-lb girl who had one beer was too impaired to say no, because her judgement was impaired.
Alcohol is the most commonly used chemical in drug facilitated sexual assault. In large part this is due to the fact that alcohol is easily accessible and a chemical that many people use in social interactions.
Effects on the Victim:
Ability to protect herself or himself is reduced
Impaired judgment
May not realize that a situation has become dangerous
May have trouble handling or avoiding conflict
Perceptions of others not as clear
Difficult to set limits
Ability to resist, both physically and verbally, may be impaired
Shantz My Pants
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They haven't even defined it yet or what the **** has happened.
My whole point to what rask said and then you jumped into was if they find him guilty, is it then fair to jump to a conclusion? Because how he said it made it seem that even still he's 2% likely to be guilty.
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DMelt36
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It is subjective, but ... c'mon man. You've likely seen drunk girls before. There comes a point when men who aren't pieces of shit look at a girl's state of drunkenness and should be able to determine "No, I do not need to take that girl home."
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