What if Pace traded up for Watson...

Mongo_76

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Trubisky did NOT play with "basically the same players" as Marquise Williams did the year prior. Key players on that 2015 Tar Heels team that went 11 - 1 that weren't on or had limited contributions to that 2016 team:

Quinshad Davis - UNC's all time leader in receptions(at the time) and touchdowns graduated with Marquise.

Mack Hollins - #1 in NCAA in yards per reception(24.8) in 2015. Missed the last 6 games in 2016 with a broken collarbone.

Elijah Hood - UNC's best running back missed multiple games in 2016 and played injured the majority of the season.

Landon Turner - 2015 1st team All American right guard graduated with Marquise. His expected replacement missed the 2016 season due to injury.

Caleb Peterson - Left guard who started 30 straight games missed the final 8 games of the 2016 season because of injury.

UNC also lost offensive coordinator Seth Littrell after the 2015 season. Fedora went with co-offensive coordinators for the 2016 season and it went horribly.

Ryan switzer was the only returning playmaker, and he had his best year by far with Trubisky taking the snaps

Thank you for posting this. I've seen the "he played with the same offense as Williams" narrative spewed over and over. It's not only completely false from a player perspective, it's almost Special person to think this when you consider the fucking Offensive AHC left to go to North Texas to be a HC. (as you pointed out).

To also add on to all your points, the Elija Hood injury was crippling to the RPO in that offense. in 2015, he had 1400+ yards, 17 TD's.., and was being discussed as a day 2 draft pick. In 2016, 850 yards, 8TD's, and not only missed games (including the bowl game), but also couldn't go every down - sometimes missing entire quarters. He gave up a ton of snaps due to the lingering issues from the concussion and what people think is a leg injury, (although it hasn't been disclosed yet). He went from a potential Day 2 to a late 7th round pick...
 

satchice

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Not trying to take a thing away from Watson, the man won a NC and went to 2. H e did some amazing things in college no doubt. My point is:

1 - Yes Watson has a better resume, but when you compare both players first full year as a starter, they are very similar.
2 - this idea of Watson is a winner in college so he will win in the NFL is garbage. Their is NO corolation from wins in college to wins in the pros, their just isn't. their is also no corolation between big stats in college and big stats in the pros. Each player must be looked at in a vacuum.

I actually thing both QBs maybe good to great in college, but with where we are and. What O we run, MT was the right pick.

Couldn't of said it better myself. The only thing I would change is the bolded. I think you should of replaced we for the NFL.
 

remydat

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My question over this was if Houston got to 2, like some SF reports are stating, would they have still taken Watson?

Unknown. I suspect the price to move in the top 5 from that far back was probably 3 first round picks rather than the 2 they ended up paying for 12. So not sure they were ever seriously in the running for trading into the top 5. Probably just fishing.

Once you get past the Jets, the only teams they had to fear were the Bills and the Browns as they were rumored to be interested in a QB but both of them traded so even that risk was small as most likely the Texans probably called the Bills at one point and once the Bills said they were willing to deal then the Texans would know that the Bills likely weren't looking QB.

So don't think any of the above tells us anything about who they had rated higher as their calls to 2 seemed more exploratory in nature.
 

run and shoot

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Couldn't of said it better myself. The only thing I would change is the bolded. I think you should of replaced we for the NFL.

trubs and Watson are from 'spread offense'. Fact

now.......

satchice.....please explain the NFL comment. Please be very specific about why you would change what CNiel36 said.
 

remydat

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Trubisky did NOT play with "basically the same players" as Marquise Williams did the year prior. Key players on that 2015 Tar Heels team that went 11 - 1 that weren't on or had limited contributions to that 2016 team:

Quinshad Davis - UNC's all time leader in receptions(at the time) and touchdowns graduated with Marquise.

Mack Hollins - #1 in NCAA in yards per reception(24.8) in 2015. Missed the last 6 games in 2016 with a broken collarbone.

Elijah Hood - UNC's best running back missed multiple games in 2016 and played injured the majority of the season.

Landon Turner - 2015 1st team All American right guard graduated with Marquise. His expected replacement missed the 2016 season due to injury.

Caleb Peterson - Left guard who started 30 straight games missed the final 8 games of the 2016 season because of injury.

UNC also lost offensive coordinator Seth Littrell after the 2015 season. Fedora went with co-offensive coordinators for the 2016 season and it went horribly.

Ryan switzer was the only returning playmaker, and he had his best year by far with Trubisky taking the snaps

I would agree on the OL but the WRs are pretty much the same. All that really happened is that Switzer and Hollins swapped production which even without the injury would have happened because Williams was more inaccurate underneath and favored throwing deep so his game was more suited to throwing to Hollins. By contrast, Trubisky excells in the short to intermediate game and put Switzer in position to use is RAC ability. However, combined, Switzer and Hollins combined for about 1,400 yards both years. It's just that Williams used Hollins more and Trubisky used Switzer more owing to those receivers playing more to those QB's strengths. Both those guys were 4 round picks so really it's a wash between the two.

As for Quinshad Davis, the dude was an undrafted WR that never played a game in the NFL. He is not some uber talented WR. In 2015, Davis, Howard and Proehl combined for about 1,300 yards. In 2016, Howard and Proehl alone combined for 1,400 yards. So again, this was not some massive difference in talent. This was simply the case that guys that are comparable players just became a larger part of the offense with an additional year of experience.

As for RB, Logan was always a better NFL prospect than Hood because Hood is a physical back but slow. He never had the explosion or speed to be a top RB choice. Logan was a 5th round pick because he is one of the fastest RBs in his class and had return ability. He averaged 5.4 yards per carry to Hood's 5.7. The biggest difference in UNC's run game was the fact that Williams himself rushed for 948 yards last year so he made UNC a more balanced offense. Trubisky had that ability but he chose to pass more which made him the better NFL prospect (he is always looking to pass even when scrambling) but didn't necessarily make him the best college QB because running in college is a bigger part of the offense in college.

So it was basically the same players at WR and RB. Guys like Proehl, Switzer and Howard just fit what Trubisky does best so that's why their production increased.
 

Teddy KGB

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In one corner ya have a Qb who played in 2 NC's ( won 1). Had a 33-3 w-l . Passed for 4109yds 67.8% comp. 35Td's 13 ints in 2015 and in 2016 upped his stats by passing for 4593yds, 67.0% comp. 41Td's and 17ints.

In the other corner, ya have a Qb who loss more the double the games ( in 1 season ) than the other guy had in 3 seasons, doesn't have the Td or yardage production of the other guy, lost 4 of his last 5 games ( including a bowl game), but this guy is allegedly the best Qb in the draft.

Whats wrong with this picture?


You realize if Trubs is successful and Watson a bust, this post won't age well...
 

run and shoot

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Originally Posted by run and shoot View Post
In one corner ya have a Qb who played in 2 NC's ( won 1). Had a 33-3 w-l . Passed for 4109yds 67.8% comp. 35Td's 13 ints in 2015 and in 2016 upped his stats by passing for 4593yds, 67.0% comp. 41Td's and 17ints.

In the other corner, ya have a Qb who loss more the double the games ( in 1 season ) than the other guy had in 3 seasons, doesn't have the Td or yardage production of the other guy, lost 4 of his last 5 games ( including a bowl game), but this guy is allegedly the best Qb in the draft.

Whats wrong with this picture?



You realize if Trubs is successful and Watson a bust, this post won't age well...

If Watson busts I'll be the 1st to say I was wrong about him.

However.....

At the end of the day, I want the Bears to win another SB. Hence, I don't care how this "ages".
 

run and shoot

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Quote Originally Posted by satchice View Post
Couldn't of said it better myself. The only thing I would change is the bolded. I think you should of replaced we for the NFL.


trubs and Watson are from 'spread offense'. Fact

now.......

satchice.....please explain the NFL comment. Please be very specific about why you would change what CNiel36 said.

Please answer the question
 

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