***BREAKING: Brandon Marshall traded to the Jets***

FatBabiesHaveNoPride

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They aren't, at all. However, you are a consistent hyper-generalization machine so it doesn't surprise me that you see it that way.

And yet you love Bernstein - a guy who makes any of my 'hyper-generalization' pale by comparison.

'ALL MEN WHO ABUSE WOMEN WILL DO IT AGAIN. MARSHALL WILL ABUSE WOMEN AGAIN'

'ALL SOUTHERNERS ARE RACIST'

'ALL PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT THE REDSKINS ARE RACIST'

And I can keep going...
 

bearmick

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And it does 'really matter'. It matters a hell of a lot to the person fielding the abuse, regardless of gender.

No, I meant does my personal opinion and the reasons behind it matter that much in the context of a football discussion? It was a rhetorical question. The answer is it doesn't.
 

Shepard

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I remember this picture. It was when Cutler threw a wide open pass to Marshall and he dropped it. Would have been in field goal range and . A first down

No it wasn't. It was the hail mary that incomplete pass that ended the game and the Packers took down the division.

Marshall left it all out there that day.
 

bearmick

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And yet you love Bernstein - a guy who makes any of my 'hyper-generalization' pale by comparison.

'ALL MEN WHO ABUSE WOMEN WILL DO IT AGAIN. MARSHALL WILL ABUSE WOMEN AGAIN'

ALL SOUTHERNERS ARE RACIST

'ALL PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT THE REDSKINS ARE RACIST'

And I can keep going...

Well I don't think all southerners are racist. Nice job disproving your own point about me parroting Bernstein's opinions by immediately providing one I don't agree with. LOL.
 

FatBabiesHaveNoPride

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Richard Sherman and Kam Chancellor were both 5th round draft picks by the Hawks. So 5th round picks aren't throwaways. Russell Wilson was a third round pick. It can be done in the later rounds.

You're right in that the Seahawks paid $10 million to Matt Flynn thinking he would be their starter, but Wilson -- a draft choice they thought "might" work out in the future -- beat Flynn out in training camp and during the preseason and the organization put their gut feelings ahead of the money they paid Flynn. Flynn sat on the bench for $10 million. And Wilson lit it up making less than $1 million. How many organizations would bench a QB they just paid $10 million to?

We were talking about QB - someone mentioned 'elite QB' in light of a 5th round pick.

So, yes, you can get very good players at various positions in the 5th.

What you can't get is an 'elite' QB. The only elite QB taken 5th or later is Tom Brady and that was 15 years ago. Look at the list of QBs taken 5th or later over the last 10 years. It's not pretty. There's almost zero chance a late round QB becomes an 'elite QB'. Hell, there's a very low chance that a 5th or later QB pick even plays in the NFL.

As for Wilson, he was a relatively high (12th) pick in the 3rd. Big difference between that and the 5th. And even at that, he's a statistical anomaly.
 

Milton Waddams

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http://chicagofootball.com/2015/03/06/hub-arkush-brandon-marshall-trade-addition-by-subtraction/a360rmf/

Hub Arkush: Brandon Marshall trade addition by subtraction

The bottom line on the Chicago Bears trade of Brandon Marshall to the New York Jets is it’s addition by subtraction regardless of what the mid-to-late round draft choice compensation is, and the Bears are the big winners.

Marshall’s presence had become more than a distraction to his coaches, teammates and the Bears front office. He was like a cloud hanging over the team and the inescapable stamp of dysfunction put on it by former general manager Phil Emery.

Yes, Marshall was an All-Pro in terms of production and individual honors and will probably continue to be one of the top five pass catchers in the NFL.

But exactly how many wins and trips to the playoffs did that translate to for the Bears?

In fact, how many wins and playoff trips has it translated to for any of the three teams he has played with over his nine-year NFL career?

You got it, zero and zero.

Pro football is the ultimate team sport and Marshall is as serious a team-buster as I’ve seen in 37 years covering the game. He has demonstrated a half-life of about two or three seasons with any team he’s been with – Marshall was injured a good part of his rookie campaign in Denver – and the outcome is always the same.

The reasons are sensitive and difficult to discuss while trying to remain fair to Marshall, who may not be a bad person.

The Marshall we’ve seen in Chicago has actually been a good person but a bad teammate due to his self diagnosed and proclaimed mental illness. Mental illness is as difficult a disease or combination of diseases as there are to deal with. Marshall clearly suffers from some form or another and for that he deserves our sympathy, not our scorn.

But the reason I have to qualify him as perhaps not a bad person is in the early years of his career he compiled a record of domestic abuse of women that rivals almost any we’ve seen in the NFL recently.

He seems to have found an answer to that problem with no new incidents for a number of years now, but it’s in the eyes of the beholders as to whether that can ever be forgotten or a person with that record can be a good man.

The real problem with Marshall today is there are many folks who struggle with mental illness and find ways to become good people and good teammates. Marshall is nowhere near there yet.

His constant need for the spotlight, often at the expense of teammates and the team, and me–first attitude about everything creates an impossible environment in the locker room, on the sidelines, and in the huddle. That is why he absolutely had to go.

Here is the most important part of all of this and it’s the really good news. New general manager and head coach Ryan Pace and John Fox get it.

It appeared obvious in the tone and between the lines of most of their comments that the business of healing their football team couldn’t begin with Marshall here, and now they’ve wasted no time in getting the job done.

Yes, it leaves the Bears now in need of number one and number three receivers. But there are plenty of free agents like the recently wooed Brian Hartline who can be fine threes, and if ever there was a draft to find a number one this could be it.

Recent trends have suggested West Virginia’s Kevin White could come off the board first and Alabama’s Amari Cooper could slip to seven. Marshall for Cooper and a draft pick, that’s a trade I’ll make every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

And Marshall fans don’t despair. I have no idea what new Jets GM Mike Maccagnan could be thinking but Marshall is in the Big Apple where he obviously wanted to be, and now in the same locker room with Percy Harvin and Geno Smith.

The folks at TMZ and the National Enquirer must have all died and gone to Heaven.
 

Jester

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No. I may be misguided in this but I don't view female on male violence as equal. I do think she's a fucking headcase but I reserve a lower opinion for men who beat women. Not that this really matters. I was answering Schm's question.

That really doesn't make any sense at all actually, but that's more for a discussion in beliefs and ideology
 

FatBabiesHaveNoPride

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It blows losing a great WR when you root for a team that's basically never had one in your lifetime. We'll see how it turns out I guess. Obviously we're not privy to everything that goes on inside the building. Sometimes it's addition by subtraction. Harvin was a good player for SEA. They had more talent on the field with him than they did when they shipped him out. But he was a pain in the ass distraction. He was more of a problem on the field than Marshall was. Behind the scenes, who knows. Guys rarely change teams 3/4 times unless there's something wrong. Owens was a great player, but every team wanted him gone. He wanted to win. He trained hard and played hurt like BM does. But he was always a problem. And it was always everybody else, not him.

Bernstein wasn't the only one talking this. Hub wrote that article about it. Both Hub & Mark Potash were talking about this a couple months ago on Chicago Tribune Live or whatever the hell that show is called. Hub said you have to get rid of Marshall. Potsy said that it would be a good indicator of what kind of staff you have (Pace/Fox). If their first order of business is moving on from Marshall, you might have something. If they keep him, not so much. I have a hard time believing every reporter just had a hard on against Marshall. They've dealt with mercurial guys before. They're close enough to know what things are like behind the scenes.

I'll miss #15 on the field. Hopefully this makes the BEARS better in the long run.

Didn't read the Potash stuff, but Hub and Bernstein effectively share the same ultra lefty brain. Add Rosenbloom to that mix as well. They will all literally have the EXACT same opinions.
 

Desperado34

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Lemming said like 3 words and was either cut off or somerhing happened lol wtf
 

FatBabiesHaveNoPride

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No, I meant does my personal opinion and the reasons behind it matter that much in the context of a football discussion? It was a rhetorical question. The answer is it doesn't.

Then why have you brought it up so much?
 

Shepard

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The argument of "how many playoff games did Marshall get us to?" is a really stupid argument.

Our failures had NOTHING to do with Brandon. He was as responsible as anyone why our Sundays were somewhat watchable.
 

shoopster

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Hub: "Pro football is the ultimate team sport and Marshall is as serious a team-buster as I’ve seen in 37 years covering the game."

That is a statement there ...
 

gpphat

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My favorite teams
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  1. Virginia Commonwealth Rams
Well I don't think all southerners are racist. Nice job disproving your own point about me parroting Bernstein's opinions by immediately providing one I don't agree with. LOL.

I appreciate you not considering me a racist
 

PrideisBears

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Jay threw a pick not an incomplete pass.

If was the pass before tge hail merry. People so wuick to defend Marshall its insane
 

Jester

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The argument of "how many playoff games did Marshall get us to?" is a really stupid argument.

Our failures had NOTHING to do with Brandon. He was as responsible as anyone why our Sundays were somewhat watchable.

This is just a generic argument fans use when they want to attack a player on stats and don't have a lot of other ammo. Yeah, it's Special person, but it's used a lot around here for sure.
 

rob923

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http://chicagofootball.com/2015/03/06/hub-arkush-brandon-marshall-trade-addition-by-subtraction/a360rmf/

Hub Arkush: Brandon Marshall trade addition by subtraction

The bottom line on the Chicago Bears trade of Brandon Marshall to the New York Jets is it’s addition by subtraction regardless of what the mid-to-late round draft choice compensation is, and the Bears are the big winners.

Marshall’s presence had become more than a distraction to his coaches, teammates and the Bears front office. He was like a cloud hanging over the team and the inescapable stamp of dysfunction put on it by former general manager Phil Emery.

Yes, Marshall was an All-Pro in terms of production and individual honors and will probably continue to be one of the top five pass catchers in the NFL.

But exactly how many wins and trips to the playoffs did that translate to for the Bears?

In fact, how many wins and playoff trips has it translated to for any of the three teams he has played with over his nine-year NFL career?

You got it, zero and zero.

Pro football is the ultimate team sport and Marshall is as serious a team-buster as I’ve seen in 37 years covering the game. He has demonstrated a half-life of about two or three seasons with any team he’s been with – Marshall was injured a good part of his rookie campaign in Denver – and the outcome is always the same.

The reasons are sensitive and difficult to discuss while trying to remain fair to Marshall, who may not be a bad person.

The Marshall we’ve seen in Chicago has actually been a good person but a bad teammate due to his self diagnosed and proclaimed mental illness. Mental illness is as difficult a disease or combination of diseases as there are to deal with. Marshall clearly suffers from some form or another and for that he deserves our sympathy, not our scorn.

But the reason I have to qualify him as perhaps not a bad person is in the early years of his career he compiled a record of domestic abuse of women that rivals almost any we’ve seen in the NFL recently.

He seems to have found an answer to that problem with no new incidents for a number of years now, but it’s in the eyes of the beholders as to whether that can ever be forgotten or a person with that record can be a good man.

The real problem with Marshall today is there are many folks who struggle with mental illness and find ways to become good people and good teammates. Marshall is nowhere near there yet.

His constant need for the spotlight, often at the expense of teammates and the team, and me–first attitude about everything creates an impossible environment in the locker room, on the sidelines, and in the huddle. That is why he absolutely had to go.

Here is the most important part of all of this and it’s the really good news. New general manager and head coach Ryan Pace and John Fox get it.

It appeared obvious in the tone and between the lines of most of their comments that the business of healing their football team couldn’t begin with Marshall here, and now they’ve wasted no time in getting the job done.

Yes, it leaves the Bears now in need of number one and number three receivers. But there are plenty of free agents like the recently wooed Brian Hartline who can be fine threes, and if ever there was a draft to find a number one this could be it.

Recent trends have suggested West Virginia’s Kevin White could come off the board first and Alabama’s Amari Cooper could slip to seven. Marshall for Cooper and a draft pick, that’s a trade I’ll make every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

And Marshall fans don’t despair. I have no idea what new Jets GM Mike Maccagnan could be thinking but Marshall is in the Big Apple where he obviously wanted to be, and now in the same locker room with Percy Harvin and Geno Smith.

The folks at TMZ and the National Enquirer must have all died and gone to Heaven.

"The real problem with Marshall today is there are many folks who struggle with mental illness and find ways to become good people and good teammates. Marshall is nowhere near there yet."

Why do Bears followers always denigrate their players once they are traded away? How hypocritical when they're rooting for them while they're in Chicago and then they call them shit and question whether they're a good man after they leave -- saw that big-time with Rex Grossman, but also with Kyle Orton. Not a good man? Marshall had his problems, but who's to say he's not a good man today? Who is some guy named Hub to tell someone else they're not a good man?

Bears fans used to be a lot more loyal to their former players when I was younger. You guys are close to or may have even exceeded the Philly fans.
 

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