Carcillo

[Rex]

Yes Pirri isn't second line nhl center material yet. Q must think so also seeing he still plays Kane there.



teams do not win cups nor do they go far in playoffs without bonified #2 centers. I guess Kane can do that for us but I personaly prefer him on rw. Sharp can play center but he is the only real #1 lw we have on the team so he can't be moved now.

I like what Pirri brought to the table. why not give him more than two games?

 

[the canadian dream]

I like what Pirri brought to the table. why not give him more than two games?

Sure give him 3rd line center duties and let Bolland play 2nd line.



Pirri has been average at best. Nothing has stood out to me really to be honest. No issues with giving him more games but why does it have to be top 2 line minutes?



I honestly really don't care what the team does. We have a top record in the league so something must be going right. But when guys like Toews cool off it almost feels like the rest of the team cools off sometimes. Toews is the reason we have the record we do right now. Just would like to see the center position get more support. Kane does what he can when he plays there and he plays hard but I think the team does better when Kane is on rw. That's all. Sure throw Pirri second line center. Don't think it's going to support Toews much though.

 

[R K]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmBuU3CkCUs





Whats the difference here?

 

[Ton]

Sure give him 3rd line center duties and let Bolland play 2nd line.



Pirri has been average at best. Nothing has stood out to me really to be honest. No issues with giving him more games but why does it have to be top 2 line minutes?



I honestly really don't care what the team does. We have a top record in the league so something must be going right. But when guys like Toews cool off it almost feels like the rest of the team cools off sometimes. Toews is the reason we have the record we do right now. Just would like to see the center position get more support. Kane does what he can when he plays there and he plays hard but I think the team does better when Kane is on rw. That's all. Sure throw Pirri second line center. Don't think it's going to support Toews much though.

Agreed. Ultimately this team still lacks support at the 2nd line C role. It's been a hole for many years now, so that's why I'd like them to try Bolland there. Who knows, maybe Kruger/Pirri can grow into the shutdown role. At some point these guys (speaking Bolland) need to be given a shot at a more productive role. It's time to see if he can do it, he's been in this organization for a number of years he deserves his shot over these kids.



That's how top notch organizations do these things, look at the Wings: Datsyuk wasn't a top line guy his entire career, he worked his way up--same with Holmstrom, Cleary, Franzen, Fillpula etc.. etc.. It's important to reward and promote from within than seeking options from the outside. If Bolland can't work there, then we know we need to find a new option for the 2nd line C role, the point is they have to try it first.



Also, it's easier to find a shut-down center than it is to find a productive 2nd line C, Bolland can play both... maybe even the 2nd line can be the shutdown line. Worked pretty well in 08-09 with Ladd/Bolland/Havlat. What's the difference if it's Sharp/Bolland/Hossa?



When Kruger returns, I would love to see a line-up with Toews, Bolland, Kruger and Mayers as the centers in that order. I think that would give us a solid line-up and slot everyone in their proper positions (Kane).



Q is stubborn though. As far as I'm concerned most NHL teams get an injury at center and just promote the next guy in line. Q tries to get wingers to play center and avoids putting Bolland there at all costs... I honestly wonder how Dave feels about being screwed like that. Not only that but Kruger was given a shot before him.

 

[Rex]

didn't they play Bolland as 2nd line Center last season until he got hurt? when he went on that offensive tear?

 

[the canadian dream]

Seabs met him shoulder to shoulder.



I actually don't see anything wrong with Umbergers hit there. Shoulder to shoulder. You can push off with the shoulder still can't you?



Big differences btw the "hits". Carcillo litteraly pushed Gilbert arms extended.

 

[Rex]

Carcillo didn't hit/push from behind though, and Seabrook didn't have the puck. The only difference I see in the two is that Seabrook wasn't hurt.



And Umburger isn't Carcillo

 

[R K]

Let me check, does Seabrook have the puck? Nope.



Sorry but I think some of the onus on that hit is Gilbert. While I think it was a dumb play by Carcillo I think there have been WAY worse hits this year.



They were even up going in for the puck. Suppose it's Carcillos fault Gilbert had no balance. Just like it was Seabrooks fault he had no balance.



Neither player had the puck. Iterference on both without a doubt.



And Carcillo and Gilbert are even all they was down the ice. Carcillo hits him from the side, not behind IMO.

 

[the canadian dream]

How did Umberger hit Seabs from behind if they met shoulder to shoulder?



Agree neither situations the player had the puck. Both situations was a battle to get to the puck.



the 8 second mark on the Umberger/Seabs incident shows it better than any of those other angles. The other angles make it look worse because the camera is behind the players.



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycSf7eYy9KU[/media]



39 second mark here.



Clearly two different type of "hits"



take the "both players didn't have the puck" scenerio out. We can all agree thats simillar on both incidents and Umberger should have been called for that.



No onus on Gilbert what so ever. He was pushed by Carcillo..arms stretched out. You can't defend yourself against that. This is why in 2 years time no touch icing will be implemented. Count on it.



Yah agree also Carcillos name gets in the mix here also. Not going to argue against that. And yes Gilbert getting hurt also probably gets an extra 2 games. But the 2 "hits" are completely different.

 

[IceHogsFan]

I find him to be consistent in his approach, his explanation of the reasoning and the fact overall that the NHL is doing these videos to explain their actions.



http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=60&id=147177

 

[R K]

no Shanahan and Rex said Carcillo hit Gilbert from behind. I disagree. He hit him sideways and due to Gilbert not having balance he flew.



I'm just playing devils advocate here. Neither player has the puck, both hits are "technically" interference. Nor had either player touched the puck.



Gilbert himself knew who the player was and that he was there. Yet he continued on that course. It was not an icing.



It was, interference.

 

[R K]

I find him to be consistent in his approach, his explanation of the reasoning and the fact overall that the NHL is doing these videos to explain their actions.



http://video.nhl.com...id=60&id=147177

Other than the penalties aren't consistent. Bourque only 5 games, after being suspended last week. This time what was in NO question not a hockey play.

 

[the canadian dream]

I'll agree 100% on the penalties not being consistent on the ice. That's a huuuge issue!!!

 

[klemmer]

I can't believe that there's any question about the length. It was a chickenshit play.

 

[IceHogsFan]

I can't believe that there's any question about the length. It was a chickenshit play.

Ding!



The video and explanation along with Carcillo slowing down and looking at him...........

 

[jakobeast]

How did Umberger hit Seabs from behind if they met shoulder to shoulder?



Agree neither situations the player had the puck. Both situations was a battle to get to the puck.



the 8 second mark on the Umberger/Seabs incident shows it better than any of those other angles. The other angles make it look worse because the camera is behind the players.



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycSf7eYy9KU[/media]



39 second mark here.



Clearly two different type of "hits"



take the "both players didn't have the puck" scenerio out. We can all agree thats simillar on both incidents and Umberger should have been called for that.



No onus on Gilbert what so ever. He was pushed by Carcillo..arms stretched out. You can't defend yourself against that. This is why in 2 years time no touch icing will be implemented. Count on it.



Yah agree also Carcillos name gets in the mix here also. Not going to argue against that. And yes Gilbert getting hurt also probably gets an extra 2 games. But the 2 "hits" are completely different.

Spot on. I am not as detailed as you are TCD but it was pretty much what I was saying. Big difference in "hit". Hamburger makes contact with Seabs shoulder on shoulder. Carcillo shoves him. That is the big difference.



I agree about the consistency or lack thereof as well.



And because Gilbert knew he was there means he deserves to be violently pushed from behind, or from the side, or whatever, into the boards?



And after watching it multiple time, Carcillo wasn't playing for the puck either. He starts gliding and lining up Gilbert. He knew what he was gonna do.

 

[IceHogsFan]

I'll agree 100% on the penalties not being consistent on the ice. That's a huuuge issue!!!

Edit: I thought you were referring to suspension/ fines when you were addressing the penalty on the ice.





Carry on.

 

[Chief Walking Stick]

HEY!



Umberger deserves a few free passes.... that dude gets abused more than anyone with big hits, LMAO.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3Gvfr9GUC0

 

[the canadian dream]

Spot on. I am not as detailed as you are TCD but it was pretty much what I was saying. Big difference in "hit". Hamburger makes contact with Seabs shoulder on shoulder. Carcillo shoves him. That is the big difference.



I agree about the consistency or lack thereof as well.



And because Gilbert knew he was there means he deserves to be violently pushed from behind, or from the side, or whatever, into the boards?

Good point Jako. If he had led up then he gets labeled as soft and not willing to go to the boards. Players never seem to be able to win. You let up and avoid contact then you become labeled as soft..you go into the dirty areas then you get hurt because the opposition isn't playing within the rule books.



And yes Klem...on ice calls have to become more consistent. I don't blame the players for getting mixed messages esp when it comes to interference. Off ice suspensions are a different story although I do take some issue with the idea of "past history" as dictating suspensions. Should be even across the board wether you have a history or not. Carcillo gets 7 games (which frankly i find too light..yah i said it) then the next player who makes the same **** up gets 7 games. Don't care if it's Perros or Datsyuk. I was hoping the "past history" stuff was going to be eliminated.

 

[Rex]

no Shanahan and Rex said Carcillo hit Gilbert from behind. I disagree. He hit him sideways and due to Gilbert not having balance he flew.



I'm just playing devils advocate here. Neither player has the puck, both hits are "technically" interference. Nor had either player touched the puck.



Gilbert himself knew who the player was and that he was there. Yet he continued on that course. It was not an icing.



It was, interference.

Rex never said that at all. Rex said "Carcillo didn't hit/push from behind though"