Chicago Cubs Hot Stove Offseason Thread

[Captain Obvious]

he is an average pitcher at best. he had one good year in 2009.

What are you basing this off of?

 

[DewsSox79]

What are you basing this off of?

his stat lines.

if you think he is an ace or a number 2 you are 100% wrong. you keep bringing up 2009 in your posts, great! he had a good year in one year. he is a 34 year old pitcher that is going to get paid way too much. period.

 

[Captain Obvious]

his stat lines.

if you think he is an ace or a number 2 you are 100% wrong. you keep bringing up 2009 in your posts, great! he had a good year in one year. he is a 34 year old pitcher that is going to get paid way too much. period.

The same stat line that has seen a WAR below 2 a total of once? Look at his stats, he's only had one bad year, last year. He's only had 3 years where his FIP has been below average. One was last year.

Now, I'm not saying he'll be his same 2009 self, but he can definitely be worth 3 or 4 wins, especially in the NL.

 

[Capt. Serious]

How does Vazquez suck? This outta be good...

Apparently you haven't seen his career stats brah.

2 of the last 3 seasons, he's had an ERA over 4.60

 

[Captain Obvious]

Apparently you haven't seen his career stats brah.

2 of the last 3 seasons, he's had an ERA over 4.60

Okay? ERA sucks. It only takes into account earned runs. It doesn't say how well a pitcher pitches, it takes into account how the defense behind him plays as well. It's not indicative of the pitcher, it's more of the team.

 

[DewsSox79]

Okay? ERA sucks. It only takes into account earned runs. It doesn't say how well a pitcher pitches, it takes into account how the defense behind him plays as well. It's not indicative of the pitcher, it's more of the team.

nyy ranked 3rd in all of baseball in fielding percentage. with the least amount of errors. so i guess the "team" opinion of ERA is out the window when he posts a 5.32 ERA on the best defensive team in baseball.

 

[DewsSox79]

So ERA is this team stat? Right? So why would his ERA be so high if it is a team stat when the yankees fielding percentage was 3rd in the MLB and they had the fewest errors in the MLB? please explain in detail the logic behind your opinion.

So for the most part hypothetically, the cubs will pretty much be the same team as 2010 as far as defense. lets say castro improves, and whoever fills in at 1b will not be the same "glove" as dlee....so we will wash that out. so again in theory the defense will be the same as last year. The cubs had the 3rd highest amount of errors and are tied for dead last in fielding percentage. you get where im going with this?

 

[Jntg4]

Thanks dews. I'm not saying he has no chance to be decent or good this season, but last season was just and I don't want to throw money at a risk like that.

And ok, Nady's had 1 bad year too.

 

[Got teeth? Keith doesn't.]

he is an average pitcher at best. he had one good year in 2009.

2001, 2002, 2003, and 2007 weren't good?

 

[Got teeth? Keith doesn't.]

nyy ranked 3rd in all of baseball in fielding percentage. with the least amount of errors. so i guess the "team" opinion of ERA is out the window when he posts a 5.32 ERA on the best defensive team in baseball.

Yankees as the best defensive team in baseball? BAHAHAHA :lmao:

11th in UZR and UZR/150, 16th in range runs above average, 12th in double play runs above average, 17th in OF arm runs above average, ranked 9th according to the Fans Scouting Report, this team was an average defensive team dewie...

 

[Jntg4]

He was just basing it off of errors and FP%. And he was terrible regardless.

 

[DewsSox79]

Yankees as the best defensive team in baseball? BAHAHAHA :lmao:

11th in UZR and UZR/150, 16th in range runs above average, 12th in double play runs above average, 17th in OF arm runs above average, ranked 9th according to the Fans Scouting Report, this team was an average defensive team dewie...

please. :facepalm:
stop using sabre for everything. jesus.

 

[DewsSox79]

2001, 2002, 2003, and 2007 weren't good?

long ass time ago! he is now 34 years old. yay he was descent in 2007!

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

this is some descent coke....oh and the yankees are an offensive juggernaut...obviously

 

[Lefty]

His 2010 FIP was 5.56. Granted, a good chunk of that can be attributed to Yankee Stadium, but his game lends itself to intrusions by the ballpark: he is the very definition of a fly ball pitcher, giving up more FB's for his career than GB's. And really, is HR/FB in 2010 wasn't astonishing, it was actually right around the average, so moving him from a HR-friendly park to another probably isn't going to change all that much.

 

[Got teeth? Keith doesn't.]

Way to delete my post, asshat. Had nothing worse in that post than what you have been posting towards me today.

 

[DewsSox79]

Way to delete my post, asshat. Had nothing worse in that post than what you have been posting towards me today.

hypocrit is not a bad word

 

[Got teeth? Keith doesn't.]

long ass time ago! he is now 34 years old. yay he was descent in 2007!

Your point? You were referring to how many good years he had and you were very wrong.

please. :facepalm:
stop using sabre for everything. jesus.

Alright, I'll go back to using BA and RBI's to judge players! yay!

*edited so that it doesn't offend wee widdle dewies feelings.

 

[DewsSox79]

Your point? You were referring to how many good years he had and you were very wrong.



Alright, I'll go back to using BA and RBI's to judge players! yay!

*edited so that it doesn't offend wee widdle dewies feelings.

bold- very random, with no thought behind your comment.

the point of this discussion is that javier is not a "great" pitcher, and would not be 100% for sure a better pitcher on the cubs. the discussion is also based on CO era being a team stat.

Javier Vazquez Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com shows he is not an ace pitcher or a great pitcher.

 

[Captain Obvious]

nyy ranked 3rd in all of baseball in fielding percentage. with the least amount of errors. so i guess the "team" opinion of ERA is out the window when he posts a 5.32 ERA on the best defensive team in baseball.

Errors and fielding percentages are the worst thing you can go off of. If playing X makes it to 10 balls and makes 0 errors and Player Y makes it to those same 10, plus another 10, but makes 2 errors in the process, who would you rather have? The guy that got you 18 outs or the guy that got you 10?

So ERA is this team stat? Right? So why would his ERA be so high if it is a team stat when the yankees fielding percentage was 3rd in the MLB and they had the fewest errors in the MLB? please explain in detail the logic behind your opinion.

So for the most part hypothetically, the cubs will pretty much be the same team as 2010 as far as defense. lets say castro improves, and whoever fills in at 1b will not be the same "glove" as dlee....so we will wash that out. so again in theory the defense will be the same as last year. The cubs had the 3rd highest amount of errors and are tied for dead last in fielding percentage. you get where im going with this?

To the first part of your post, the Yankees could have just stood there and not moved and let every ball get by and had a perfect fielding percentage... but the pitcher's ERA would have sucked. On the other hand, they could have just played bad when he pitched, or the fly balls were to the gap and the OFers just didn't get to them. Or... there are just so many "or"s that could go there. Which is why ERA sucks, because there are too many variables.

To your second part, see what I posted above about 18 and 10 balls.

Thanks dews. I'm not saying he has no chance to be decent or good this season, but last season was just and I don't want to throw money at a risk like that.

And ok, Nady's had 1 bad year too.

Actually, for a 1B bat, he's only had one good year. It was of course before he had TJ. The surgery has obviously had an effect on him and you would be stupid to think that he can return to that old 2008 form.

Yankees as the best defensive team in baseball? BAHAHAHA :lmao:

11th in UZR and UZR/150, 16th in range runs above average, 12th in double play runs above average, 17th in OF arm runs above average, ranked 9th according to the Fans Scouting Report, this team was an average defensive team dewie...

Thank. You.

please. :facepalm:
stop using sabre for everything. jesus.

Okay, so we should use obsolete stats to make a point that has been outdated?

long ass time ago! he is now 34 years old. yay he was descent in 2007!

And 2008. And 2009. In 2009, he was great. In 2006-2008, he was very very good.

His 2010 FIP was 5.56. Granted, a good chunk of that can be attributed to Yankee Stadium, but his game lends itself to intrusions by the ballpark: he is the very definition of a fly ball pitcher, giving up more FB's for his career than GB's. And really, is HR/FB in 2010 wasn't astonishing, it was actually right around the average, so moving him from a HR-friendly park to another probably isn't going to change all that much.

Except you can't go off of one season, for the guy. At Wrigley, he will get the occasional benefit of the wind blowing in, too. However, if you look at his FIP, his worse season was last year. If he goes from the hardest division, to the easiest division, I don't see that continuing.

bold- very random, with no thought behind your comment.

the point of this discussion is that javier is not a "great" pitcher, and would not be 100% for sure a better pitcher on the cubs. the discussion is also based on CO era being a team stat.

Javier Vazquez Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com shows he is not an ace pitcher or a great pitcher.

You can't say that anyone would be 100% for sure better. Again, too many variables. I don't think that Javy would be a great pitcher for the Cubs. However, I do think that he could be a really really good pitcher for the Cubs.

We aren't looking for an ace, we just need someone to solidify the rotation. Who else on the open market would be better?