Devine Hester taking shots at Cutler

Mongo_76

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WTF, drops are non caught catchable balls. Are you suggesting Ryan is making him actually catch the ball better? How would he do that?

If using drops/receptions+drops:
Hester has a career 11.2drop % vs Royals 5.4%.

The conventional method reveals 7.2% vs 3.4% favoring Royal.


That doesn't take in account how many times Hester was not close to a ball because he fucked up his route.

Statistically the are not all that close as you proclaim. They have each had 7 years as a receiver and Hester has under 2/3's as many TD's and 75% the receptions of Royal. Watching the two actually play, it isn't even that close.


I love how people pull only the stats they want on here...

Now for the whole picture:

Eddie Royal has 3750 yards over his career on 566 targets. Hester has 3310 yards on 449 targets over his career.

They are very comparable statistically over their career.


I'd probably take Royal over Hester. But this isn't a night and day as you all are trying to make it out to be.
 

Menchifus

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After all these years as a WR, Hester still doesn't know where to line up? I would have bad body language too if I had to tell my #1 WR where to line up and have to tie my LT's shoe also. What is this, Little League??? Be careful what you day or do, you might hurt your teammates' feelings and the coach will have to talk to your parents.
 

botfly10

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When will people learn to post the original article instead of a blog summarizing the original article....? The link is ALWAYS right there in the text...

Devin Hester glad he can be on same page with Matt Ryan


i


Despite the offensive woes the Atlanta Falcons experienced during Saturday’s 13-9 preseason loss at Miami, one positive was the chemistry between Matt Ryan and Devin Hester on two pass plays totaling 21 yards.

Hester, who entered the preseason unsure of his role in Kyle Shanahan’s offense, looked comfortable running his routes while using his elusiveness to gain extra yards after one of the catches. Such cohesion with Ryan has been brewing throughout practice. Several times this preseason, Ryan has pulled Hester aside for extended conversations about why there was miscommunication on a given route. Even during Saturday’s game, Ryan was animated pre-snap in making sure Hester was lined up correctly on a play that resulted in an 8-yard completion from Ryan to Hester.

Hester, who is adjusting to playing all the receiver spots rather than just the slot, recalled one of those practice scenarios with Ryan.

"We did like a down, out and up type deal,’’ Hester explained, "and in the past when we ran the out, if the corner played over the top, he’d back-shoulder it to me. And so I was expecting him to back-shoulder it, and he threw it deep. And he said, 'You were right on that one, but the next time it comes up, if that guy’s playing over the top of you, let’s back-shoulder it.’ Four plays later, that came up, and we back-shouldered it and made a good play on it.

"It’s just little small things that come with practice and timing. You get all your kinks and knots out in practice. That was one of those instances where we did something in previous years. We just had to get back on the same page.’’

The manner in which the dialogue between Ryan and Hester transpired is important to note. Hester realizes he doesn't run every route perfectly. When he does make a mistake, at least he knows Ryan’s approach to correcting the matter won’t be condescending.

Such wasn’t the case during Hester’s time alongside Bears quarterback Jay Cutler in Chicago. The main reason why Hester asked not to play offense during his final year with the Bears was because of his strained relationship with Cutler.

"If we weren’t on the same page, Jay just didn’t say anything to me,’’ Hester said. "He just wouldn’t (throw) to me. That’s just how he was.

"With Matt, if he sees something that he feels needs to be changed, he’ll come to you and say, 'Hey man, what do you think about doing it this way? It will give us a clearer look, and I’ll be able to get the ball to you.’"

Leadership is a quality Ryan displays on a daily basis despite not being overly vocal. Falcons coach Dan Quinn, in his first year, has gotten a better feel for that quality in Ryan this preseason, including observing those exchanges with Hester.

"Matt has that kind of respect because we all see the amount of time that he puts into it, and I think as a teammate, you get a lot of regard and respect for those guys,’’ Quinn said. "Say, 'Look how hard this guy’s going for it in terms of preparation, the energy he brings, the detail that he goes with it.’ I respect those both ways, from the quarterback to the receivers.’’

Hester, the most accomplished kickoff returner in league history, certainly appreciates having Ryan as his quarterback, regardless of how many offensive snaps or targets he gets come game day.

"He’s just an all-around quarterback,’’ Hester said of Ryan. "He goes through his progressions. He makes the right reads. He doesn’t care who’s out there, he just expects guys to make plays. Whoever the defense gives the opportunity to make the play, that’s who he goes with.’’

And the Falcons know Hester is capable of making plays with the ball in his hands.


espn.go.com/blog/nfcsouth/post/_/id/61672/devin-hester-glad-he-can-be-on-same-page-with-matt-ryan
 

The Hawk

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Unfortunately the cover2 defense wants good tackling physical CB's that can press coverage. Hester was never gonna ever get a shot in Lovie's system. I agree nicle back could work.

Good point.
 

iueyedoc

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I love how people pull only the stats they want on here...

Now for the whole picture:

Eddie Royal has 3750 yards over his career on 566 targets. Hester has 3310 yards on 449 targets over his career.

They are very comparable statistically over their career.


I'd probably take Royal over Hester. But this isn't a night and day as you all are trying to make it out to be.
So he is within 12% of Royal in one stat.
Just ignore that Royal has had 3 seasons with more receptions than Hester's best, one with 37 more. And if you only "probably" would take Royal over Hester as a receiver, you are football ignorant.
 

MrOuija

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So he is within 12% of Royal in one stat.
Just ignore that Royal has had 3 seasons with more receptions than Hester's best, one with 37 more. And if you only "probably" would take Royal over Hester as a receiver, you are football ignorant.

Both are 3rd receivers at best, does it really matter?
 

iueyedoc

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You need to learn a bit more about confidence and harmony. I have to get to the driving range now. Maybe later there will be time to explain more. You are at least one of the posters that will at least dig a bit and put a little meat behind it rather than just say shit without even looking it up. Just think about Tim Jennings pre-Lovie, Tim Jennings during Lovie, and Tim Jennings post-Lovie, and that should give you a pretty good hint as to where I am going with this. Later.
Jennings and how a coach uses a player is completely irrelevant to a receiver catching a ball. Jennings can't play the physical press style CB, it's not confidence, it's physical inability. And just to be clear, 2 more drops by Hester over 16 games would have made him statistically the same, it's not like his drops went from a dozen to 2.

The argument that a good QB can make a receiver statistically better is true, I agree, just look at some of the WR's with NE and the Den, but you are saying the drops are related to JC's aloof attitude towards Hester. That is just silly.

Den,GB, NO and Indy were all lower half of the NFL in drop % last year, while Cle, Ten, Buff, Chi,and Hou were in the 10 best.

Hardly a very good correlation to quality of QB and WR corps drops.
 
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DaaBears

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Jennings and how a coach uses a player is completely irrelevant to a receiver catching a ball. Jennings can't play the physical press style CB, it's not confidence, it's physical inability. And just to be clear, 2 more drops by Hester over 16 games would have made him statistically the same, it's not like his drops went from a dozen to 2.

The argument that a good QB can make a receiver statistically better is true, I agree, just look at some of the WR's with NE and the Den, but you are saying the drops are related to JC's aloof attitude towards Hester. That is just silly.

Den,GB, NO and Indy were all lower half of the NFL in drop % last year, while Cle, Ten, Buff, Chi,and Hou were in the 10 best.

Hardly a very good correlation to quality of QB and WR corps drops.

As a team, each of Denver, GB, NO and Indy have very aggressive offenses, while Cle, Ten, Buf, Chi an Hou certainly did not last year. The Bears for example as we all know substituted running plays with little backfield passes to Forte, that obviously are going to be caught at an extremely high percentage thus distorting the statistics. Also, the four teams that you mention have 4 of the more accurate passers in the game, nearly everything is viewed as catchable by those compiling those statistics. Enough about that.

Getting back to Hester. He feels like he is tune with Ryan. They work together as a team, he feels comfortable. He isn't cutting one way, and the ball leading him the other. Maybe he looking for the throw to come in high or low on a certain pattern, if it comes there, don't you think that he has a better chance of catching it? Of course he does, but in either case, high or low, the subjectivity of whether the ball is catchable is the same.

Honestly, I think you are mixing my comments with others, and making it seem like I am just speaking as a Cutler hater.

What I am saying is Hester is saying he feels more comfortable with Ryan, and the stats support this. I have a brand new puppy looking for my undivided attention as I type this, which is not easy, so I really need to keep this short.
 

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The stats support Hester being comfortable with Ryan? They are almost identical with his last season as a WR here despite Atlanta having White out for a period of time and Jones being banged up. Did I miss how these stats supporter this?

Edit: never mind forgot his 2012 yr. His stats are identical to 2011
 
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iueyedoc

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As a team, each of Denver, GB, NO and Indy have very aggressive offenses, while Cle, Ten, Buf, Chi an Hou certainly did not last year. The Bears for example as we all know substituted running plays with little backfield passes to Forte, that obviously are going to be caught at an extremely high percentage thus distorting the statistics. Also, the four teams that you mention have 4 of the more accurate passers in the game, nearly everything is viewed as catchable by those compiling those statistics. Enough about that.

Getting back to Hester. He feels like he is tune with Ryan. They work together as a team, he feels comfortable. He isn't cutting one way, and the ball leading him the other. Maybe he looking for the throw to come in high or low on a certain pattern, if it comes there, don't you think that he has a better chance of catching it? Of course he does, but in either case, high or low, the subjectivity of whether the ball is catchable is the same.

Honestly, I think you are mixing my comments with others, and making it seem like I am just speaking as a Cutler hater.

What I am saying is Hester is saying he feels more comfortable with Ryan, and the stats support this. I have a brand new puppy looking for my undivided attention as I type this, which is not easy, so I really need to keep this short.
I think his routes could improve if he feels confident he is on the same page with Ryan, but catching the ball is a reflex action that I don't see being influenced by comfort with the QB. And again 2 drops vs 4 in 16 games is not a statistically significant difference, just as if he has 6 drops this year it wouldn't be correct to assume he is three times less comfortable with Ryan this year than last.

Anyway, thanks for the civil discussion, a rarity these days.
 

DaaBears

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I think his routes could improve if he feels confident he is on the same page with Ryan, but catching the ball is a reflex action that I don't see being influenced by comfort with the QB. And again 2 drops vs 4 in 16 games is not a statistically significant difference, just as if he has 6 drops this year it wouldn't be correct to assume he is three times less comfortable with Ryan this year than last.

Anyway, thanks for the civil discussion, a rarity these days.

Yes, same here, agreed nice and civil. But PIB wants to start with me, so unfortunately my dog is going to pay the price.
 

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I love how people pull only the stats they want on here...

Now for the whole picture:

Eddie Royal has 3750 yards over his career on 566 targets. Hester has 3310 yards on 449 targets over his career.

They are very comparable statistically over their career.


I'd probably take Royal over Hester. But this isn't a night and day as you all are trying to make it out to be.

Your whole picture doesn't disclose the fact that Royal really wasn't a starter after Cutler left while Hester was one for three years. Starters get more targets. Also Royal got hurt in San Diego
 

DaaBears

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The stats support Hester being comfortable with Ryan? They are almost identical with his last season as a WR here despite Atlanta having White out for a period of time and Jones being banged up. Did I miss how these stats supporter this?

Edit: never mind forgot his 2012 yr. His stats are identical to 2011

I will just give you these numbers that should speak for themselves.

Devin Hester

Drop as a percent of targets

2010 - 9.6 %
2011 - 8.9%
2012 - 10.0 %
2014 - 3.4 %

Receptions as a percent of targets

2010 - 54.7%
2011 - 46.4%
2012 - 57.5%
2014 - 64.4%
 

PrideisBears

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Yes, same here, agreed nice and civil. But PIB wants to start with me, so unfortunately my dog is going to pay the price.

Lol the pay the price thing again. All I want to know is how did his numbers really improve from his time here. That's all. I'm being civil, not calling you insane, or saying you will pay the price or anything. I just don't see improvement from Hester as a WR despite being in a better situation


Edit. I see the numbers. How about targets, yards and td's? I'll admit he has improved as far as what you've shown
 

DaaBears

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Lol the pay the price thing again. All I want to know is how did his numbers really improve from his time here. That's all. I'm being civil, not calling you insane, or saying you will pay the price or anything. I just don't see improvement from Hester as a WR despite being in a better situation

Here. This looks pretty conclusive to me.

Devin Hester

Drop as a percent of targets

2010 - 9.6 %
2011 - 8.9%
2012 - 10.0 %
2014 - 3.4 %

Receptions as a percent of targets

2010 - 54.7%
2011 - 46.4%
2012 - 57.5%
2014 - 64.4%
 

PrideisBears

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Here. This looks pretty conclusive to me.

Devin Hester

Drop as a percent of targets

2010 - 9.6 %
2011 - 8.9%
2012 - 10.0 %
2014 - 3.4 %

Receptions as a percent of targets

2010 - 54.7%
2011 - 46.4%
2012 - 57.5%
2014 - 64.4%

Again I saw them and said he has improved as far as those numbers but what about yards, td's and targets? I'm actually driving and using talk text
 

DaaBears

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Again I saw them and said he has improved as far as those numbers but what about yards, td's and targets? I'm actually driving and using talk text

When you get done driving, feel free to run whatever analysis you want. I did mine.
 

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