Filling the Bears Needs

[dennehy]

I prefer drafting a shutdown guy. "A guy to develop" usually ends up being "just a guy".

As much as we all feel Fuller was much better than he had been in quite a while, opposing teams scouting and game-planning to face the Bears decided to throw to his side more frequently than going the other way. Repeatedly.

He's not a true # 1 shutdown CB by any means.

I'd be happy retaining him (assuming it's a fair price), but drafting a CB and essentially making Fuller your #2 would result in a much better defensive backfield. Kidding yourself that he is a #1 leaves us vulnerable. Until we are actually shutting down good QB's, we need improvement. With or without Fuller and Prince, we need a true #1 CB. If he's there at 8, take him. Fitzpatrick would really give us a solid backfield.

I'm not saying that's the only choice. FA offers a couple options, and would alleviate the need to draft. But we need to improve there.

There are less than 15 "true #1 shutdown corners" in the NFL. Fuller, at least last year, was right behind those guys. If there are 32 #1 CBs, he's absolutely one, without question.

I think everyone would like to have a better CB, but the problem is the Bears need better players at pretty much every position.

 

[MonkeyPox]

Massie needs to be replaced. This is not really debatable, is it? We cannot open a season with him as starter.

This. 1000 times this.

 

[bears5150]

You have to have good OL men and drafting them is the key. We could have had DeCastro in steed of McCllelen a few years back hope they don't make that mistake again. Good OL and DL make every position around them better.

 

[xer0h0ur]

There are less than 15 "true #1 shutdown corners" in the NFL. Fuller, at least last year, was right behind those guys. If there are 32 #1 CBs, he's absolutely one, without question.

I think everyone would like to have a better CB, but the problem is the Bears need better players at pretty much every position.

Hold the phone. Behind? There are like a handful of cornerbacks in the NFL that graded out better than Fuller on the season in their pass coverage. Except Fuller offers more than just coverage. He was the only cornerback in the NFL to have at least 65 tackles and at least 20 passes defensed. He ended the year with more than that and two interceptions. Find me another cornerback that wants to tackle as much as Fuller did and I'll show you the guy who should be starting opposite of him. Its not often you find a corner with a safety's hitter mentality.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Massie needs to be replaced. This is not really debatable, is it? We cannot open a season with him as starter.

Not sure if you couldn't catch the implication or just wanted to echo that Massie needs to be upgraded. What I am saying is that I don't believe that many rookie right tackles in the past decade have been THAT good. I mean at least we hired one of the best o-line coaches in the country so I have more confidence in him coaching up a rookie. I just don't expect it.

 

[remydat]

Massie needs to be replaced and Sitton and Long are injury risks at this point. We need depth. Whether that means the new guys sit behind Massie and Sitton this year or whether they end up supplanting one or both of them, the point is we need to depth.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Long has been a China Doll with injury after injury. Sitton has barely missed any time since being signed. Hardly would call him an injury risk. Don't know why people need to make up a narrative to simply say they want the next man up to be on the roster by the end of the draft. Nothing wrong with saying that.

 

[remydat]

Sitton is an injury risk because he missed games this year and is getting older. Guys who haven't missed games in the past can still be injury risks because they get older.

Not sure why this is a difficult concept. He had ribs, ankle and concussion injuries. He also had ankle issues in 2016 as well so it is a recurring issue.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Reason for missing time is what makes a player an injury risk. Missing time for someone stepping on your ankle...kind of stupid to call them an injury risk for that. Long's injuries on the other hand are something else entirely.

 

[remydat]

Again the ankle injury is recurring so not sure your point.

I am sure he has been hit or stepped on before. Why did he get injured this time? Maybe because he is more susceptible to ankle injuries now because it is a recurring issue.

Like what is your point? If you do not want to think he is an injury risk then do you bro. But I certainly have evidence to suggest he is an injury risk.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Again the ankle injury is recurring so not sure your point.

I am sure he has been hit or stepped on before. Why did he get injured this time? Maybe because he is more susceptible to ankle injuries now because it is a recurring issue.

LOL, Jordan Howard stepped on his ankle last year. What the shit is he supposed to do about someone stepping on him? I don't remember exactly what it was this year although I remember they put him into concussion protocol this year.

 

[remydat]

LOL, Jordan Howard stepped on his ankle last year. What the shit is he supposed to do about someone stepping on him? I don't remember exactly what it was this year although I remember they put him into concussion protocol this year.

Who said he has to do something? It is a risk. No one said anything about him being able to prevent it.

Yes Howard stepped on his ankle last year and this year he had an ankle injury again that caused him to miss time. Hence why it is a risk. Maybe the injury to his ankle last year made him more susceptible to getting injured this year. Just like the concussion this year increases the chances of a concussion in the future.

That is the point.

 

[dabears70]

Also take it for what its worth as this was through 12 games of the season:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-top-25-offensive-linemen-of-the-2017-nfl-season

"10. JOSH SITTON, G, CHICAGO BEARS – 86.6 OVERALL GRADE

PFF Elite Stat: Sitton has allowed just 10 QB pressures on 335 snaps in pass protection.

There is no better pass blocking guard in the game than Josh Sitton, and despite battling injuries along with the rest of the Chicago offensive line, he has once again been excellent in that area when on the field, but has been better than he has in the past as a run blocker, paving the way for Jordan Howard on the ground. Sitton has surrendered 10 total pressures in 12 games and had some dominant run blocking performances."

By that list he would be the 4th highest graded guard behind Brandon Brooks, Zach Martin and David Decastro who were 3, 2, and 1 respectively.

Can't be right cause most on this board say he's breaking down and is too old. They say we need to replace him. They say we should cut him.

Fucking CCS...................

 

[TL1961]

Hold the phone. Behind? There are like a handful of cornerbacks in the NFL that graded out better than Fuller on the season in their pass coverage. Except Fuller offers more than just coverage. He was the only cornerback in the NFL to have at least 65 tackles and at least 20 passes defensed. He ended the year with more than that and two interceptions. Find me another cornerback that wants to tackle as much as Fuller did and I'll show you the guy who should be starting opposite of him. Its not often you find a corner with a safety's hitter mentality.

I like Fuller, and very much like his physical tackling.

But rating a CB on the number of passes defended is seeing it backwards. Teams don't throw to the side of the opponent's # 1 CB as often as they throw to the other side. If you're getting a lot of passes thrown your way, you're the #2. While I was not expecting much from Amukamara, when he and Fuller are in the game together, teams target Fuller.

Where are you getting the rankings you cited?

 

[xer0h0ur]

I like Fuller, and very much like his physical tackling.

But rating a CB on the number of passes defended is seeing it backwards. Teams don't throw to the side of the opponent's # 1 CB as often as they throw to the other side. If you're getting a lot of passes thrown your way, you're the #2. While I was not expecting much from Amukamara, when he and Fuller are in the game together, teams target Fuller.

Where are you getting the rankings you cited?

I have no idea how many times I need to keep posting this before people realize this targets narrative is 100% baseless.

"Fuller has played a team-high 536 snaps at cornerback this season. He's been targeted 113 times, allowing just 57 catches with two touchdowns and two interceptions. Opposing quarterbacks are recording just a 68.8 rating when throwing in his direction this season."

https://247sports.com/Bolt/Franchis...r-Kyle-Fuller-and-the-Chicago-Bears-112830598

That was through 15 games and even when including the final game of the season it didn't change it much at all.

 

[remydat]

Yeah but is 113 targets on 536 snaps a lot? And where does the 68.8 rating rank among CBs.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Well can't have it both ways. Either you're saying he has been targeted a lot or he hasn't been targeted a lot.

 

[TL1961]

Yeah but is 113 targets on 536 snaps a lot? And where does the 68.8 rating rank among CBs.

I can't say where that ranked, but that IS good. QB ratings list had guys ranked in the 20's with QB ratings > 75, so the average has to be quite a bit better than 68.8. So Fuller's rating in that respect is quite good.

 

[shoopster]

Well can't have it both ways. Either you're saying he has been targeted a lot or he hasn't been targeted a lot.

As Shelly Levine might say, "you are a shithved, zerohour" . . .

 

[remydat]

I can't say where that ranked, but that IS good. QB ratings list had guys ranked in the 20's with QB ratings > 75, so the average has to be quite a bit better than 68.8. So Fuller's rating in that respect is quite good.

Yeah i used to get PFF ratings but not anymore so wasn't sure if you had access to full stats to check