Fire Sale!

[Rice Cube]

I learned on here that Soto was a beast, and that he was the Cubs best player.

:lmao:

He would be if he were more consistent. But he deserved the 2008 ROY and was almost MVP caliber in 2010, but those numbers may be disguised by the fact that he hit 8th so often. It would've been nice to see what he could do higher in the order. He does have good plate discipline for the most part and a lot of power, but he's not so spectacular that he should be untouchable.

 

[nwfisch]

He would be if he were more consistent. But he deserved the 2008 ROY and was almost MVP caliber in 2010, but those numbers may be disguised by the fact that he hit 8th so often. It would've been nice to see what he could do higher in the order. He does have good plate discipline for the most part and a lot of power, but he's not so spectacular that he should be untouchable.

Definitely. I just feel that he's too injury prone to hold onto. The Cubs are failing top to bottom right now. From the owner to the players, they have to find something for 2012.

 

[DewsSox79]

I learned on here that Soto was a beast, and that he was the Cubs best player.

:lmao:

That was priceless when that was stated.

 

[bleacherbum54]

I learned on here that Soto was a beast, and that he was the Cubs best player.

:lmao:

ya when i saw CO post that i just That comment was crazy and soto has never been a beast and never will be lol

 

[X]

ya when i saw CO post that i just That comment was crazy and soto has never been a beast and never will be lol

I wouldn't say Soto's never been a beast...He's had 2 years ('08 and '10 I believe) where he's been arguably a top 3-5 catcher in baseball....I personally think now's a great time to trade him...I don't trust him a bit. Like the guy, just don't see him as a pertinent future player.

 

[Rice Cube]

I wouldn't say Soto's never been a beast...He's had 2 years ('08 and '10 I believe) where he's been arguably a top 3-5 catcher in baseball....I personally think now's a great time to trade him...I don't trust him a bit. Like the guy, just don't see him as a pertinent future player.

Yeah, by the time the Cubs potentially get good again, Soto will be older and more expensive. If they trade him now, he's still under arbitration for a couple more seasons so the cost control should bring back some better prospects than if they traded him at the end of his arbitration years or in free agency.

I like Soto too. Despite the pedestrian statistics he's a hell of a lot better than Koyie Hill

 

[DewsSox79]

he is 28 and has been injury prone. getting older with his track record, now would be the time to move him....he isnt the catcher of the future.

 

[X]

he is 28 and has been injury prone. getting older with his track record, now would be the time to move him....he isnt the catcher of the future.

agreed.

 

[Rice Cube]

As a Bay Area native and a quasi-Giants fan I would love to see them send Soto to the Giants while Posey is out.

 

[X]

As a Bay Area native and a quasi-Giants fan I would love to see them send Soto to the Giants while Posey is out.

K. Sandoval pls

 

[Rice Cube]

K. Sandoval pls

I don't think that'll happen but we might be able to snag a few of their B or C prospects

 

[bleacherbum54]

I don't think that'll happen but we might be able to snag a few of their B or C prospects

as long as they throw in my bro Caleb Hougesen in he is a 5 tool player but went to a little HS and wasnt scouted much. So he went late in last years draft rd 46 lol.

 

[Captain Obvious]

ya when i saw CO post that i just That comment was crazy and soto has never been a beast and never will be lol

Never been a beast? He was better than the bat last year than Mauer and Posey. If that's not a beast, then what is?

 

[bleacherbum54]

Never been a beast? He was better than the bat last year than Mauer and Posey. If that's not a beast, then what is?

Like they say about best pitcher in baseball argument it isn't about one season it is a full body of work BTW .280 with 17hr is not a beast that just makes you look stupid saying that.

and he wasnt better than Posey. Posey batted .305 with 18hr that is better than Geo

Same with Joe he batted .327 with 9 dingers i would take that all day over Geo.


Your argument is based off opinion mine is based off facts you look stupid saying "He was better with the bat last year than Mauer and Posey"

THATS NOT TRUE!!!

this argument is almost as stupid as saying Fonso is good at defense or Darwin Barney is terrible with the bat.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Like they say about best pitcher in baseball argument it isn't about one season it is a full body of work BTW .280 with 17hr is not a beast that just makes you look stupid saying that.

and he wasnt better than Posey. Posey batted .305 with 18hr that is better than Geo

Same with Joe he batted .327 with 9 dingers i would take that all day over Geo.


Your argument is based off opinion mine is based off facts you look stupid saying "He was better with the bat last year than Mauer and Posey"

THATS NOT TRUE!!!

this argument is almost as stupid as saying Fonso is good at defense or Darwin Barney is terrible with the bat.

HR and AVG? The stats used in 1980 don't fly anymore. You look stupid using those stats. They don't correlate to runs very well at all. Saying that he is a beast when he has the highest OPS, wOBA, and wRC+ of all catchers does not make me look stupid.

Your argument is based off of facts used out of context. Mine isn't. THAT IS TRUE!!!

Soriano is not good at defense. I never said that. I said he is a good LEFT fielder. Which he is.

Darwin Barney is terrible with the bat. He is horrible.

 

[bleacherbum54]

HR and AVG? The stats used in 1980 don't fly anymore. You look stupid using those stats. They don't correlate to runs very well at all. Saying that he is a beast when he has the highest OPS, wOBA, and wRC+ of all catchers does not make me look stupid.

Your argument is based off of facts used out of context. Mine isn't. THAT IS TRUE!!!

Soriano is not good at defense. I never said that. I said he is a good LEFT fielder. Which he is.

Darwin Barney is terrible with the bat. He is horrible.

Soto has never been a beast Albert Pujols is a beast Soto not so much. Everything you say doesn't make any sense Sori a good LF is comical same with Darwin. Same with your argument if we get Prince he will solve all the issues. You truly are a homer saying that Soto is a beast and that we would be a contender with Fielder truly

 

[Jntg4]

HR and AVG? The stats used in 1980 don't fly anymore. You look stupid using those stats. They don't correlate to runs very well at all. Saying that he is a beast when he has the highest OPS, wOBA, and wRC+ of all catchers does not make me look stupid.

Your argument is based off of facts used out of context. Mine isn't. THAT IS TRUE!!!

Soriano is not good at defense. I never said that. I said he is a good LEFT fielder. Which he is.

Darwin Barney is terrible with the bat. He is horrible.

So basically every baseball fan or general sports fan that would rather spend their time watching baseball (and maybe some other sports like hockey, soccer, football, basketball, etc.) than spending all of their time on fangraphs.com to study sabermetrics is stupid? I wouldn't say anyone looks stupid for using HR and average when those are still the most commonly used stat. I mean, unless someone looks it up to see if there are better stats, and they won't even know if there are, how would they know to use different stats? What stats do they show when a batter comes up to the plate? Average, HR, and RBI. Who would know that baseball is all in the metrics and what you actually see in the game is apparently lies? Basically you are saying that any person who likes to watch baseball, but never thinks to look up "Do the stats they show me on TV suck?" is a fucking moron. I mean, I don't know one person, except for you, that would rather study advanced stats than watch a hockey game, a football game, a basketball game, a soccer game, or a lacrosse game (depending on what sports they like, I just listed the more frequent ones). If Soriano is "a beast" in LF because "everyone else sucks", how is being an average fan stupid? Explain that, now.

 

[dabynsky]

So basically every baseball fan or general sports fan that would rather spend their time watching baseball (and maybe some other sports like hockey, soccer, football, basketball, etc.) than spending all of their time on fangraphs.com to study sabermetrics is stupid? I wouldn't say anyone looks stupid for using HR and average when those are still the most commonly used stat. I mean, unless someone looks it up to see if there are better stats, and they won't even know if there are, how would they know to use different stats? What stats do they show when a batter comes up to the plate? Average, HR, and RBI. Who would know that baseball is all in the metrics and what you actually see in the game is apparently lies? Basically you are saying that any person who likes to watch baseball, but never thinks to look up "Do the stats they show me on TV suck?" is a fucking moron. I mean, I don't know one person, except for you, that would rather study advanced stats than watch a hockey game, a football game, a basketball game, a soccer game, or a lacrosse game (depending on what sports they like, I just listed the more frequent ones). If Soriano is "a beast" in LF because "everyone else sucks", how is being an average fan stupid? Explain that, now.

Just because stats are used more frequently doesn't mean they are best. I really want to avoid a whole stats vs. scouting argument because the truth is you need both. One thing that annoys me is that the Cubs seem to lean too heavily to the scouting side of the ball. If you really want to look at the numbers a case could be made that Soto was better than Posey and Mauer (much stronger case over Posey imo).

However, what is far more interesting to me is what I noticed when looking at the stats. Geovany Soto has to be the unluckiest Cub when it comes to hitting. His BABIP currently sits at a measely .259 compared to the .324 last year. Yet his LD% has only decreased from 24.4% to 23.3% this year. He also isn't strike out at a higher percentage 25.3% this year compared to 25.8% last year. I would guess that Soto is due for a bounce back the rest of the year and hopefully some evening up from the baseball gods will put him closer to the 2010 version next year.

 

[Jntg4]

Just because stats are used more frequently doesn't mean they are best.

Ya... I said they weren't. But if the general population uses them, it isn't stupid to use them... read what I was saying again. You can't call someone stupid for using those stats when 99% of fans use those same stats. There is just a small population that researches to see if there are better stats... as I said in my post.

He wasn't being stupid, simple as that. Because if he's stupid, then almost every baseball fan is.

 

[Rice Cube]

Just because stats are used more frequently doesn't mean they are best. I really want to avoid a whole stats vs. scouting argument because the truth is you need both. One thing that annoys me is that the Cubs seem to lean too heavily to the scouting side of the ball. If you really want to look at the numbers a case could be made that Soto was better than Posey and Mauer (much stronger case over Posey imo).

However, what is far more interesting to me is what I noticed when looking at the stats. Geovany Soto has to be the unluckiest Cub when it comes to hitting. His BABIP currently sits at a measely .259 compared to the .324 last year. Yet his LD% has only decreased from 24.4% to 23.3% this year. He also isn't strike out at a higher percentage 25.3% this year compared to 25.8% last year. I would guess that Soto is due for a bounce back the rest of the year and hopefully some evening up from the baseball gods will put him closer to the 2010 version next year.

I think BABIP depends in large part on the defensive positioning. You might notice that a lot of teams have started overshifting for Soto to pull, and he does hit a lot of line drives, but they are right into the shift. Dude has power, but I can't even recall how many times I've just been exasperated that he hit the cover off the ball and was robbed. Ugh.