Game of Thrones Thread

The Hawk

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Yes but you went ahead and took concepts of Medieval/feudalism society and assumed it was true for Westeros, you cannot do that.

You cannot "apply quite a bit" of Medieval history to Martin's story.... only Martin can do that, you are not RR Martin, you cannot just say "Oh well Westeros is kinda like Medieval Europe, so I can apply stuff I know about Medieval society to Westeros".

That is what you have been doing, taking historical concepts that Martin DID NOT explicitly borrow and then presumed they are relevant to Westeros.

Idk why im bothering explaining this to you, as you won't understand it.

YOu are like the guy trying to pick the fly shit out of the pepper mill. I really do not know what you are trying to convey other than trying to insult me. To deny that martin did interweave medieval concepts into his books is asinine. Martin himself stated that he did.
 

The Hawk

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You have been taking historical concepts and applying them to Westeros as if you can apply 100% of Medieval history to Westeros.

You are too dumb to talk.

Bullshit. Show me an example where I have been taking and applying 100% of Medieval history to Westeros. You are the dumb one. A board Don Quixote tilting at windmills, no less. You and 51 are one trick ponies whose hatred of me causes you to embarrass your own sorry asses.
 

The Hawk

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Yes but you went ahead and took concepts of Medieval/feudalism society and assumed it was true for Westeros, you cannot do that.

You cannot "apply quite a bit" of Medieval history to Martin's story.... only Martin can do that, you are not RR Martin, you cannot just say "Oh well Westeros is kinda like Medieval Europe, so I can apply stuff I know about Medieval society to Westeros".

That is what you have been doing, taking historical concepts that Martin DID NOT explicitly borrow and then presumed they are relevant to Westeros.

Idk why im bothering explaining this to you, as you won't understand it.

Name one example of something that I said about Westeros that could not be applicable to medieval culture. Be exact because I am sure that I know a lot about medieval history and would hate to make you look like an idiot once again:)
 

The Hawk

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I think we all fully grasp what historical features RR Martin borrowed, but since he also has Dragons and Ice Zombies and a fantasy world on a made up planet where the people never advanced socially or technologically over the course of 1000 years, we can safely say that you cannot presume anything applicable to society in human Medieval times is applicable to RR Martin's fantasy society.

Hence you assuming any sexual/rape concepts you might find in human Medieval history are applicable to RR Martin's fantasy society is false, you cannot assume that, sorry.

Yes you are SORRY. Sorry in not being able to fathom common sense that what happened culturally in medieval times cannot be logically applied to Martins' fantasy world.Martin intentionally does this because the reader already has a knowledge about medieval culture and he doesn't have to spend time educating them into the acts and beliefs of the people in the story.
 

nc0gnet0

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I actually never said that she was raped by her brother. What I am saying is that it is possible that she was raped by her brother. Clearly she was abused by her brother and he certainly lusted for her. But no writing by Martin describes her of being raped by her brother and people can argue that she was raped on her wedding night by Drogo. That is an open for debate kind of thing. Feminists certainly consider it rape. I've said what I think about it being a sort of cultural thing.

Hopefully this will be the last post on the subject and you will just drop it. Virsery's never "raped" Dany. Did he physically abuse her? Yes. Two different things. This is confirmed in Grmm's books by the simple fact on Dany's wedding night, Illyrio Mopatis, kept vigil over Dany's tent, to assure her maidenhead was not taken by Viserys, before she was wed to Drogo. So, it was never even "possible" that Dany was raped by Visery. End of story.

Next up is the argument of what constitutes rape in a mid-evil society. Rape, simply defined is forcing one to have sex against there will. Your confusing the definition, which doesn't change, regardless of the societal norms, with its legality.

So was raping your wife on your wedding night legal in Westeros? Yes, but that does not change the fact it was still rape.
 

Bears_804

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Too many pages of parallels/not parallels to real history and who raped or didn't rape who. :yep:
 

number51

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New rule if you make 6 posts in a row you are banned from that thread.

Back to back posts are fine, 3 okay, 6 go away you are an insane attention whore, and you're just ruining a thread with spam.

Four of the 6 were replies to Ares, multi quote it and make the response one long rambling wall of gibberish that is easily ignored.
 

Ares

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New rule if you make 6 posts in a row you are banned from that thread.

Back to back posts are fine, 3 okay, 6 go away you are an insane attention whore, and you're just ruining a thread with spam.

Four of the 6 were replies to Ares, multi quote it and make the response one long rambling wall of gibberish that is easily ignored.

I've made it a policy to just breeze past Hawk posts in this thread.... I recommend everyone does the same.
 

ShiftyDevil

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New rule if you make 6 posts in a row you are banned from that thread.

Back to back posts are fine, 3 okay, 6 go away you are an insane attention whore, and you're just ruining a thread with spam.

Four of the 6 were replies to Ares, multi quote it and make the response one long rambling wall of gibberish that is easily ignored.

It's like being in high school debate and The Hawk is doing the Gish Gallup, only the Hawk is your 50 year old drunk uncle that lets his eye linger a little too long on his nieces.
 

Ares

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It's like being in high school debate and The Hawk is doing the Gish Gallup, only the Hawk is your 50 year old drunk uncle that lets his eye linger a little too long on his nieces.

Hawk is like a one-eyed 90 year old....
 
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Spunky Porkstacker

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It's like being in high school debate and The Hawk is doing the Gish Gallup, only the Hawk is your 50 year old drunk uncle that lets his eye linger a little too long on his nieces.

Ya had to go there...I have not thought about Uncle Leroy in ages. He used to show up at my sisters apt. with a six pack of Schlitz thinking he was going to get lucky. :cringe:
 

ShiftyDevil

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Ya had to go there...I have not thought about Uncle Leroy in ages. He used to show up at my sisters apt. with a six pack of Schlitz thinking he was going to get lucky. :cringe:

Did he tell you to leave your door unlocked at night?
 

Tjodalv

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The Hawk

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Okay, years later when they had writing they wrote down stories/legends. Still it does seem like they have been stuck in that same era for a long time. Come on guys printing press?

His world his rules. Maybe too much magic not enough science, like the Repu... nope!

Truly one of the dumbest responses in history. Congratulations:(
 

The Hawk

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Actually, if your saying the timeline roughly started at or around the time of the first men and the invasion of the Andels, this would be the rough equivalent of the bronze age, and legend transfers it into the iron age. As to the actual period of time that elapsed between the long night, and current date/time in which the story is set, there is a great deal of uncertainty.

" According to tradition, Jeor Mormont was the 997th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch - according to the legend that the Watch was founded a full 8,000 years ago, when the Wall was allegedly constructed. Samwell Tarly points out that they have no real way of knowing if there have actually been 997 Lords Commander, or even if the Watch is truly 8,000 years old. While reading through the Castle Black library, Samwell says that the most complete list of Lord Commanders he ever found only consisted of 667 names - and he has no way of confirming if dozens if not hundreds of those names were ever real men, or simply legendary figures who were later added into the lists. While Mormont is still considered the 997th Lord Commander, there are simply huge gaps in the list, with allegedly 330 Lords Commander whose names have simply been forgotten. It isn't clear exactly how far back in time an accurate historical count extends: history becomes relatively accurate after the Targaryen Conquest, but it hasn't been stated what number the Lord Commander at the time (Harren the Black's brother) was."

What I am getting at is recorded history suggests that it is closer to 2000-3000 years, and so, things aren't progressing as slowly as you might think.

What is hilarious, is Ares all or nothing approach regarding what Martin writes. He is so off of the wall in his "historical" relevance it is amazing.
 

The Hawk

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Hopefully this will be the last post on the subject and you will just drop it. Virsery's never "raped" Dany. Did he physically abuse her? Yes. Two different things. This is confirmed in Grmm's books by the simple fact on Dany's wedding night, Illyrio Mopatis, kept vigil over Dany's tent, to assure her maidenhead was not taken by Viserys, before she was wed to Drogo. So, it was never even "possible" that Dany was raped by Visery. End of story.

Next up is the argument of what constitutes rape in a mid-evil society. Rape, simply defined is forcing one to have sex against there will. Your confusing the definition, which doesn't change, regardless of the societal norms, with its legality.

So was raping your wife on your wedding night legal in Westeros? Yes, but that does not change the fact it was still rape.

We do not know that he didn't rape her. Name me one thing declared in the books where it said that he didn't rape her. As for your OPINION of Dany getting raped on her wedding night, that is a very big conversation with different opinions on both sides. I read several articles about that very subject on the internet. I didn't know it but it is a very heated debate.

I say that based on my knowledge of medieval times and the culture of the time, that it was not "rape". Even in this day and age, Muslim "law" dictates that a man can insist sex at any time from his wife and it does not require "consent". It is legal and not considered RAPE. In fact, it is almost impossible for a woman to prove rape in Muslim countries. "RAPE" is a difficult act to prove even in Western culture is it not?
 

The Hawk

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You have been taking historical concepts and applying them to Westeros as if you can apply 100% of Medieval history to Westeros.

You are too dumb to talk.

Hey, dumb ass......... where did I do that? You are so fucking stupid, it is unbelieveable.
 

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