If we lose out...

[Chris Sojka]

Based on your last post I'm not so sure you belong in the group that isn't.

Based on what you have posted I am not sure you deserve to be taken seriously?

You just said we aren't fans for not caring about whether we take 8th place or 16th place? When we are the only ones concerned and talking about what it takes in order to put us in 1st place...

Winning games isn't winning super bowls...

I care about superbowls... you care about pointless bullshit that no one remembers...

I cant remember the exact records of the last 25 seasons... all i know is we haven't won the superbowl since 1985... thats the only thing that matters...

 

[BearsWillWin]

The probability of getting an impact player keeps getting lower the further down the draft you go. Additionally if you are looking to make any kind of trade how high your picks are (specifically in the first couple rounds) makes a huge difference.

One, remove trades from the equation because making a trade is an assumption only.

There is no evidence to say you get a better player higher in the draft. For every hit there are several misses and there are a ton of busts.

I'm not you can't find great players...........I'm saying losing now doesn't equal automatic success later. But clearly you idiots keep glossing over that fact.

 

[BearsWillWin]

For the Bears you've got to believe that Emery can do right there. Essentially if the Bears tank then Emery has more ammo come the offseason. If you believe in Emery then that's a good thing.

If I believe in Emery..........I really don't want them to tank because if he knows how to find talent draft position will matter less.

 

[Chris Sojka]

Tom Brady
Aaron Rodgers
Jerry Rice
Lance Briggs
Brandon Marshall
Matt Forte
Jay Ratliff

Or wait.......let's flip this

Ki-jana Carter
David Carr
Courtney Brown
JaMarcus Russell
Curtin Enis
Steve Emtman
Aunbray Bruce

Want me to keep going?

Ok... what is your point? how many other 4th round picks turned out to be Brandon Marshall... How many 6th rounders do you think turned out to be like tom brady?

Ohh wait i get it.... you think we should trade all our draft picks for the entire 6th round picks... because then we will be able to draft the next tom brady in the 6th round...

 

[Probie2429]

Not in the first round.

For one, he's already had an ACL injury. Two, he has legal problems and character questions.

And.......we have 2 1000 yard receivers and a pretty good tight end.

Meanwhile............we have possibly the worst defense in football.

I understand that this defense needs work. Problem is that if this team decides to go with Cutler, they are in a win now mode. Forte and Marshall are also approaching the end of their prime years. You pick the best player that gives you a shot at contributing right away in a big way. A two headed monster at TE is how this offense goes from good to elite.

I don't think a DE/DT in the middle of the 1st round is going to be a meaningful contributor next year. This is where your 2nd/3rd round picks come in as rotational players on the defensive side of the ball. If you can get one of the better rated offensive players (be it TE, G, etc.) instead, you pull the trigger. The defense does need to be rebuilt, but it can be done via other means such as FA.

 

[BearsWillWin]

Based on what you have posted I am not sure you deserve to be taken seriously?

Was that a question?

You just said we aren't fans for not caring about whether we take 8th place or 16th place? When we are the only ones concerned and talking about what it takes in order to put us in 1st place...

No evidence to suggest that finishing 16th rather than finishing 8th gives you a better chance to finish 1st next year. None.

But please keep pretending there is.

Winning games isn't winning super bowls...

Losing games doesn't put you closer to the Super Bowl.

I care about superbowls... you care about pointless bullshit that no one remembers...

Again, losing now doesn't put you closer to a superbowl later. Nothing you can say will make that correct.

I cant remember the exact records of the last 25 seasons... all i know is we haven't won the superbowl since 1985... thats the only thing that matters...

By your logic all those seasons we finished 4-12, 5-11, or 6-10 in that time, and there have been more than a few, should have put us closer to a SB and made us better the following season.

What happened?

 

[Chris Sojka]

We drafted Cedric Benson with the 4th overall pick in the draft....

we went to the superbowl that year?

we were the 4th worst team in football the year we drafted Benson... we went to the superbowl that year?

What? really? Huh?

 

[BearsWillWin]

Ok... what is your point?

That great players have been found in every round. So saying you need a higher pick to get a better player isn't true.

I thought that was obvious. I guess it isn't.

how many other 4th round picks turned out to be Brandon Marshall... How many 6th rounders do you think turned out to be like tom brady?

Just as many as top 5 picks have turned out to be Peyton Manning.

Ohh wait i get it.... you think we should trade all our draft picks for the entire 6th round picks... because then we will be able to draft the next tom brady in the 6th round...

Please show where I said anything remotely close to that. Strawman arguments will get you no where.

 

[Chris Sojka]

Was that a question?



No evidence to suggest that finishing 16th rather than finishing 8th gives you a better chance to finish 1st next year. None.

But please keep pretending there is.



Losing games doesn't put you closer to the Super Bowl.

Again, losing now doesn't put you closer to a superbowl later. Nothing you can say will make that correct.



By your logic all those seasons we finished 4-12, 5-11, or 6-10 in that time, and there have been more than a few, should have put us closer to a SB and made us better the following season.

What happened?

Walter Payton and Dan Hampton were also drafted with the 4th overall pick in the draft... in 1985 they helped us win a superbowl...

WTF are you talking about?

 

[patg006]

Of course they are. They're just smarter, less meatballish fans. Unless you think 2013 is the final NFL season before Earth is taken out by a giant meteor, you should want the team to be able to get better as much as possible going forward.

Right, because talent cant be found all over the draft. It's only the top picks worth tanking for.

Idiot.

 

[BearsWillWin]

We drafted Cedric Benson with the 4th overall pick in the draft....

we went to the superbowl that year?

we were the 4th worst team in football the year we drafted Benson... we went to the superbowl that year?

What? really? Huh?

And Thomas Jones was the starting running back. And we had a top 3 defense.

Huh? What? Drafting Benson had NOTHING to do with going to the Superbowl? Huh?

Nice try genius.

 

[BearsWillWin]

WTF are you talking about?

Losing now doesn't equal automatic success later.

That will be at least the 20th time I've typed that. I don't expect it to sink in anymore now than it did the previous 19 times.

 

[patg006]

Ok... what is your point? how many other 4th round picks turned out to be Brandon Marshall... How many 6th rounders do you think turned out to be like tom brady?

Ohh wait i get it.... you think we should trade all our draft picks for the entire 6th round picks... because then we will be able to draft the next tom brady in the 6th round...

Not the point he's making, genius.

He's saying talent can be found all over the draft, not just in the top 15, which even in a 'lose out' scenario the bears wont get Clowney anyways.

 

[bearmick]

Losing games doesn't put you closer to the Super Bowl.

Getting a higher draft pick increases your chances of acquiring an impact player, whether through a direct pick or by having more draft capital to trade with.

You keep denying this completey obvious fact. I don't know why.

If draft position makes no difference, then there's literally zero difference in terms of likelihood of impact player between the first overall pick and Mr Irrelevant. If there is a difference between those two positions, then it proves that there is indeed an advantage with a higher pick, otherwise the onus is on your to tell us where he cutoff is. If pick #7 is the same as pick #22, then is it also the same as pick #150? How about #75? Where is the cutoff? Either answer that or cease the silliness.

 

[Chris Sojka]

That great players have been found in every round. So saying you need a higher pick to get a better player isn't true.

I thought that was obvious. I guess it isn't.



Just as many as top 5 picks have turned out to be Peyton Manning.

Please show where I said anything remotely close to that. Strawman arguments will get you no where.

I wasn't arguing that great players aren't found in every round you dope...

Do you think there is a better draft pick than Clowney as far as defensive ends go this year?
A better QB than Luck last year?

who is the next great late round pick? I am now asking you since you seem to think there are so many players falling and you seem to know which ones will end up being great and having hall of fame careers...

Please enlighten us... Clearly you predicted Tom Brady being the best QB ever...

 

[bearmick]

Right, because talent cant be found all over the draft. It's only the top picks worth tanking for.

Idiot.

It's less likely the later you go.

Cuntwipe.

 

[BearsWillWin]

Getting a higher draft pick increases your chances of acquiring an impact player, whether through a direct pick or by having more draft capital to trade with.

You keep denying this completey obvious fact. I don't know why.

It's not true. A look at draft history will tell you that.

 

[bearmick]

It's not true. A look at draft history will tell you that.

You ignored my question because you can't answer it.

 

[BearsWillWin]

I wasn't arguing that great players aren't found in every round you dope...

I wasn't arguing that we should load up on 6th round picks. But that didn't stop you from trying to pretend I did.

Do you think there is a better draft pick than Clowney as far as defensive ends go this year?
A better QB than Luck last year?

Moot point. We have no chance at Clowney outside of trading up this year. 6-10 won't get you Clowney and that is the worst this team can finish.

who is the next great late round pick? I am now asking you since you seem to think there are so many players falling and you seem to know which ones will end up being great and having hall of fame careers...

Please enlighten us... Clearly you predicted Tom Brady being the best QB ever...

Clearly you enjoy trying to argue points I never made.

Let me say it again.......

Losing now doesn't equal automatic success later. So no fan should be rooting for losses.

 

[BearsWillWin]

If draft position makes no difference, then there's literally zero difference in terms of likelihood of impact player between the first overall pick and Mr Irrelevant. If there is a difference between those two positions, then it proves that there is indeed an advantage with a higher pick, otherwise the onus is on your to tell us where he cutoff is. If pick #7 is the same as pick #22, then is it also the same as pick #150? How about #75? Where is the cutoff? Either answer that or cease the silliness.

Draft position doesn't mean as much as fans think it does. If it did the team drafting #1 every year would be instantly better the next year. It happened with the Colts but how often does it happen?

My point, which no one can refute, is losing now doesn't equal success later and that is why rooting to lose for draft position is stupid.