It's Another VogelBomb! 2013 Minor League Thread

[Boobaby1]

A Price deal would require at least 2 of the Cubs "Big Four" and then Vogelbach and one of their better pitching prospects would likely be good.

I understand the ML team is awful and Price would give them the ace they have been lacking since Wood/Prior but I would rather see if their "Big 4" can boost the offense. The rotation is actually not too bad. They need another arm or so before they can compete but they need to fix the holes in the batting order first. There is a good chance Price hits FA, I'd rather see the Cubs buy him.

If the Cubs go after and get Cano, or Ellsbury that would open up some of these prospects to trade. Cano's contract could go anywhere. Some people saying 6-8 years at $20-25 million per. If they are able to get him for 4/5 years I would like to see them go after him as well as Ellsbury.

You have to figure that the Cubs indeed will not go after someone like Cano regardless of the length of contract. I don't think he fits what the Cubs are trying to do right now. If Cano were 27 or 28 years of age...maybe. He will be 31 when contract time rolls around, and I'm sure that will throw up big red flags in Command Central for a player like him.

You know that the Cubs are more likely to have Baez, Castro, and Alcantara all as potential second basemen or shortstops in the near future, so look for much of the same as far as stop gaps go. They may splash on someone like Elsbury because of recent ties, maybe a outfielder in the range of Michael Morse, some pitching and bullpen help, and once again, call it a year.

Personally, I would have rather picked up Chase Utley (had he not signed already) for the short term to try and compete as a power hitting 2nd basemen until the farm starts to arrive versus laying out a huge contract for Cano, and I also would much rather them spend 20 to 25 million (if they were to spend) on a bona fide ACE for the staff which I feel is much needed and pressing at this point.

Who knows? Maybe this will be the year that we get shocked by the FO opcorn:

 

[CSF77]

Who knows? Maybe this will be the year that we get shocked by the FO

Doubt it.

They may sign a new closer but Gregg already said he would like to come back.
Back up catcher.
2B again doubt it. They are going to have to find a spot for Baez and Castro on the same team.
3B as above but add Olt and Bryant to the mix.

OF: I believe they stick with the status que in general. The amount of AB's a RH hitter in a platoon is not worth much in payroll. Which is why I do not believe Lake will be on the short end of one. His game has potential of growing. RF would be more of the same limited types making 1 mil at most.

But with Lake there is potential for F/A. He can play 3B/2B and any OF spot. They could move him to 2B and sign a LF like Jacoby Ellsbury (30). That might be a reach but less than signing Cano for 25 mil per.

Looking at the line up it lacks a #4 hitter right now. With Bryant and Baez not even at Iowa yet it makes sense to sign a potential one.

What makes the most sense is signing Nelson Cruz undervalue coming off of his suspension on a 1 year deal. He will want to build up value again. At that point move Lake over to 2B. CF/RF retain Gillespie/Schierholtz in RF. Lake can man CF vs LH with Dejesus. 2B I'd give some AB's to Murphy. I'd have to give it to Olt out of S/T and push up Bryant/Baez to step in. Vitters is another potential.

So a line up of:
CF Dejesus
2B Lake
1B Rizzo
LF Cruz
RF Schierholtz
3B Olt
SS Castro
C Castillo


Rotation: Not sure yet. With Rusin I'd wait for him to fall before calling him out. LH starters can get away with less talent as long as they have command. Have to see. Rather have Arretta in the rotation vs Villanueva at this point. Higher upside. But nice to have Villanueva around for the what if factor.

 

[Boobaby1]

Doubt it.

They may sign a new closer but Gregg already said he would like to come back.
Back up catcher.
2B again doubt it. They are going to have to find a spot for Baez and Castro on the same team.
3B as above but add Olt and Bryant to the mix.

OF: I believe they stick with the status que in general. The amount of AB's a RH hitter in a platoon is not worth much in payroll. Which is why I do not believe Lake will be on the short end of one. His game has potential of growing. RF would be more of the same limited types making 1 mil at most.

But with Lake there is potential for F/A. He can play 3B/2B and any OF spot. They could move him to 2B and sign a LF like Jacoby Ellsbury (30). That might be a reach but less than signing Cano for 25 mil per.

Looking at the line up it lacks a #4 hitter right now. With Bryant and Baez not even at Iowa yet it makes sense to sign a potential one.

What makes the most sense is signing Nelson Cruz undervalue coming off of his suspension on a 1 year deal. He will want to build up value again. At that point move Lake over to 2B. CF/RF retain Gillespie/Schierholtz in RF. Lake can man CF vs LH with Dejesus. 2B I'd give some AB's to Murphy. I'd have to give it to Olt out of S/T and push up Bryant/Baez to step in. Vitters is another potential.

So a line up of:
CF Dejesus
2B Lake
1B Rizzo
LF Cruz
RF Schierholtz
3B Olt
SS Castro
C Castillo


Rotation: Not sure yet. With Rusin I'd wait for him to fall before calling him out. LH starters can get away with less talent as long as they have command. Have to see. Rather have Arretta in the rotation vs Villanueva at this point. Higher upside. But nice to have Villanueva around for the what if factor.

I'd bet a ton of money that the Cubs would never entertain Nelson Cruz in any capacity. If they were quick to rid Zambrano off the team at any cost, and with the duplicate offenders of Braun and A-Rod taking PED's that we know about or suspect, I don't look for the FO to ever take that chance.

As far as the line-up goes, the Cubs are more than likely going to bring in a name. Doesn't have to be a Robinson Cano, but they can ill afford to go even less on offense and payroll than this year IMO. The fans will abandon this remedy rather quickly.

Marketing is what they will have to do, and that will have to be in the form of some players. It's a question of who? opcorn:

 

[JosMin]

Prospect Graph:
MLB Chicago Cubs: OF Junior Lake
AAA Iowa Cubs: 3B Mike Olt, RHP Kyle Hendricks, OF Josh Vitters
AA Tennessee Smokies: SS Javier Baez, 2B Arismendy Alcantara, 3B Christian Villanueva, OF Matt Szczur, OF Brett Jackson
A+ Daytona Cubs: 3B Kris Bryant, RHP C.J. Edwards, RHP Pierce Johnson, 1B Dan Vogelbach
A- Kane County Cougars: OF Albert Almora, LHP Rob Zastryzny, 3B Jeimer Candelario, 2B Gioskar Amaya, SS Marco Hernandez
SS Boise Hawks: RHP Paul Blackburn, RHP Duane Underwood, RHP Juan Paniagua, RHP Dillon Maples, RHP Trey Masek
R AZL Cubs: Expecting RHP Jen-Ho Tseng
R DSL Cubs: Expecting OF Eloy Jimenez
R VSL Cubs: Expecting SS Gleyber Torres

Dat AA squad :fap:

 

[chibears55]

if im going to take a wild guess at what the opening day position players will look like ill go with this...

C. castillo and i think they will try and bring back navarro

1B. rizzo

2B. barney will be back (ARB) ... Alcantara in the wing

SS. castro

3B. Olt or vitters .... Baez in the wing

LF. dejesus .... bryant in the wing

CF. Lake .... or ellsbury... Almora in wing

Rf. schierholtz .... RH bat ... soler in the wing


winterball with tell us more about what position they want baez and bryant to play..

their moving lake to Cf so they can see how he handles it there, so my guess is they may be planning on keeping him there to hold it down til Almora is ready.

 

[Flacco4Prez]

if im going to take a wild guess at what the opening day position players will look like ill go with this...

C. castillo and i think they will try and bring back navarro

1B. rizzo

2B. barney will be back (ARB) ... Alcantara in the wing

SS. castro

3B. Olt or vitters .... Baez in the wing

LF. dejesus .... bryant in the wing

CF. Lake .... or ellsbury... Almora in wing

Rf. schierholtz .... RH bat ... soler in the wing


winterball with tell us more about what position they want baez and bryant to play..

their moving lake to Cf so they can see how he handles it there, so my guess is they may be planning on keeping him there to hold it down til Almora is ready.

I don't think the Cubs will do much in terms of FA. I mean FA has changed in recent years with the new CBA. Next year is the year some of these pieces that the Cubs have assembled will be ML ready. We will have a much better idea if Baez, Soler, Bryant, Olt, or Alcantra will be ML caliber players long term this time next year. Not all of those guys will be called up but a few of them should be. It would be nice to get a top of the line starter or a bat to fear for the lineup but I don't see it happening now. I could possibly see Ellsbury which would be a good but not great signing. It gives the Cubs flexibility to trade some of their prospects or survive if one busts.

 

[SilenceS]

I don't think the Cubs will do much in terms of FA. I mean FA has changed in recent years with the new CBA. Next year is the year some of these pieces that the Cubs have assembled will be ML ready. We will have a much better idea if Baez, Soler, Bryant, Olt, or Alcantra will be ML caliber players long term this time next year. Not all of those guys will be called up but a few of them should be. It would be nice to get a top of the line starter or a bat to fear for the lineup but I don't see it happening now. I could possibly see Ellsbury which would be a good but not great signing. It gives the Cubs flexibility to trade some of their prospects or survive if one busts.

They have to sign FA. They have to fill out a roster and they have to find a clean up hitter. If they walk in to 2014 with David Dejesus batting 4th. I will never watch another game.

 

[CSF77]

I would convert Vogelbach into a catcher. There is no gaurentee that the NL will adopt the DH. That would increase his stock immensely. 2nd I would trade Castro after Baez is ready to promote. He is good for 2 quality arms which they need to stock pile. I believe that in 2014 we will see Baez.

 

[CSF77]

if im going to take a wild guess at what the opening day position players will look like ill go with this...

C. castillo and i think they will try and bring back navarro

1B. rizzo

2B. barney will be back (ARB) ... Alcantara in the wing

SS. castro

3B. Olt or vitters .... Baez in the wing

LF. dejesus .... bryant in the wing

CF. Lake .... or ellsbury... Almora in wing

Rf. schierholtz .... RH bat ... soler in the wing


winterball with tell us more about what position they want baez and bryant to play..

their moving lake to Cf so they can see how he handles it there, so my guess is they may be planning on keeping him there to hold it down til Almora is ready.

Cheap fix: Vitters LF, Olt 3B, Lake 2B. Makes the line up: Dejesus, Lake, Rizzo, Vitters, Schierholtz, Olt, Castro, Castillo. Baez, Szczur, Alcantara in Iowa. Next wave Soler, Almora and Bryant.

 

[SilenceS]

I would convert Vogelbach into a catcher. There is no gaurentee that the NL will adopt the DH. That would increase his stock immensely. 2nd I would trade Castro after Baez is ready to promote. He is good for 2 quality arms which they need to stock pile. I believe that in 2014 we will see Baez.

I do too, but Im pretty confident it will be at third.

 

[CSF77]

I do too, but Im pretty confident it will be at third.

Depends on if Olt can get back to old form. Worst case is they move Baez to LF just to get his bat in the line up.

 

[beckdawg]

It's far to early to talk about moving positions with prospects honestly save for the log jam at 3B. Vogelbach isn't blocked at all save for Rizzo at the Major League level. He's in A+. You're easily talking 3 years at the earliest before he's ready for the majors to start a year. Also, I really doubt they move Baez, Almora, Soler, and Bryant. They conceivably have room for 3 of those in the OF. And Baez can easily slide into SS with Castro moving to 2B if needed. Supposedly he's the better defender of the two according to what I've read.

As for anyone else, they are trade material. The cubs probably need to trade for a #1 as they don't appear to have one in their farm system currently. So, future #1 picks in the next few years in some of the lower guys in the system will likely go there.

 

[chibears55]

Jake Arrieta will get the start friday with Villanueva moved to bullpen..

looks like were going to see Arrieta and Rusin finishing out the year..
i think i said last week, id like to see Rusin come up and get some starts now.. dont look like ricketts are being cheap here :wacko:


i like carlos villanuva in the bullpen role as a long reliever/spot starter

 

[SilenceS]

It's far to early to talk about moving positions with prospects honestly save for the log jam at 3B. Vogelbach isn't blocked at all save for Rizzo at the Major League level. He's in A+. You're easily talking 3 years at the earliest before he's ready for the majors to start a year. Also, I really doubt they move Baez, Almora, Soler, and Bryant. They conceivably have room for 3 of those in the OF. And Baez can easily slide into SS with Castro moving to 2B if needed. Supposedly he's the better defender of the two according to what I've read.

As for anyone else, they are trade material. The cubs probably need to trade for a #1 as they don't appear to have one in their farm system currently. So, future #1 picks in the next few years in some of the lower guys in the system will likely go there.

Baez has less range then Castro and has less of an arm. He can rare back and throw one, but has bad feet. The concensus between almost all scouts and experts is Baez will be at third over Bryant and Olt when he is ready. Bryant will be an OF.

 

[SilenceS]

Jake Arrieta will get the start friday with Villanueva moved to bullpen..

looks like were going to see Arrieta and Rusin finishing out the year..
i think i said last week, id like to see Rusin come up and get some starts now.. dont look like ricketts are being cheap here :wacko:


i like carlos villanuva in the bullpen role as a long reliever/spot starter

We went through this. Arrieta was not coming up until they could save him from being a super 2. That's exactly what they did.

 

[Parade_Rain]

I would convert Vogelbach into a catcher. There is no gaurentee that the NL will adopt the DH. That would increase his stock immensely. 2nd I would trade Castro after Baez is ready to promote. He is good for 2 quality arms which they need to stock pile. I believe that in 2014 we will see Baez.

That's an interesting suggestion. Does he have the arm and quickness for it?

 

[SilenceS]

That's an interesting suggestion. Does he have the arm and quickness for it?

No, he has an average arm at best. He also is not very quick from side to side. He would never be able to make the transition. His options are limited to first or trade. DH if the NL adopts it or if he really just mashes. Stick him in left with a plus plus defender in center and just hope he can get to some balls. But, that is a long shot.

 

[Parade_Rain]

No, he has an average arm at best. He also is not very quick from side to side. He would never be able to make the transition. His options are limited to first or trade. DH if the NL adopts it or if he really just mashes. Stick him in left with a plus plus defender in center and just hope he can get to some balls. But, that is a long shot.

As opposed to trade bait, would it be worth it then to keep him in the Cubs system in case Rizzo just doesn't get his stuff together?

 

[CSF77]

The Cubs are lacking impact players at the catching position in the Minor Leagues. Epstein said they have talked about converting a few kids to catcher, and have targeted three players. That will begin this fall during instructional league.


http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp...tebook_id=56865664&vkey=notebook_chc&c_id=chc

 

[CSF77]

The key word is impact. 3 guys: Vogelbach would be ideal. Jeimer Candelario and Christian Villanueva also. 3B is a long shot for both.

Might be a pitcher if he hits well. Who knows.