Jordan: I could score 100 in current NBA

[Gustavus Adolphus]

I think AAU turns more players being a planet into a sun.

What in the holy **** does this even mean??

 

[Lefty]

That players that play on AAU teams become self-sustaining nuclear fusion reactors? That eventually those players might collapse to a dense-enough size that they warp space-time back on itself? Your guess is as good as mine.

 

[jayswagger10]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95-HIjyZL2o]YouTube - MICHAEL JORDAN MIX JAY-Z - FOREVER YOUNG[/ame]

 

[houheffna]

What in the holy **** does this even mean??

Trust me, he doesn't know what it means...along with all the other stuff he said...

 

[Lex L.]

I don't think Kersey and Buck Williams could have done anything with Nowitzki. Its not like there were any Nowitzkis running around back then.

Dallas couldnt win against that team on Dirk alone. Theyre problem wouldnt have been on offense. I like all you guys who claim that Dirk is so unguardable, yet, what has Dallas won with him? And, mind you, this is in an NBA that gives players like Dirk a lot more space.

But moreover, if the 06 Heat would have played against the 90 Pistons, Wade would not have been nearly as effective as he was against the Mavs. And same with facing the 92 Bulls. The Bulls would have clamped down on him and with Jordan on the other side, Wade wouldnt have had a chance to show how clutch he was, just like Drexler and anyone else didnt.

How would you build a team differently around Drexler?

I was talking about the bogusness of your premise. Teams are typically built around star players. So it might vary depending on the GM and so this idea of treating them as interchangeable parts to contrive some measurement criteria is somewhat laughable.

Terry Porter would have worked with Wade well. Shaq would have been great with Drexler...

Those Portland teams pushed tempo. Im not sure how Shaq would have fit in with that style of play at that point in his career.

I don't think Drexler could take his game to that extra level as Wade did, because he just wasn't as good. Wade gave an all time performance...not every player can do that. Reggie Miller? Yes. Drexler? not so much. But again, that was one area.

Once again, this observation is drastically distorted by the fact that during the vast majority of Wades time in the league, perimeter players have been given more space. And, obviously, Drexler played well enough for Portland to make it to the NBA finals twice, which is more than Miami has made it.

And also, there have been times when Reggie Miller was no where to be found.

Wade is superior defensively, Wade is a better ballhandler and could create off the dribble better than Drexler could. And Wade is superior in the clutch...that was the whole point...

Once again, Wade plays in an NBA where perimeter players are given more space. And when you look at output, Wade isnt really THAT much better if he is at all.

 

[Lex L.]

What in the holy **** does this even mean??

It means that the prevalence of AAU has diminished the hold HS coaches have on players and it hinders their ability to mold them. The HS kids have become single standing entities almost. Im not saying HS coaches wouldnt build their teams around elite talents if there was no AAU. Of course they would. But AAU gives the players another option and so they dont have to listen to HS coaches as much. And the HS coaches know this and there is more coddling. The players at the HS level have more leverage now, which has its good and bads but one of the bad elements is that theyve become hired guns and if the player thinks he doesnt need to polish his game when the coach tries to make him, the player can often get away with ignoring the coach.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

It means that the prevalence of AAU has diminished the hold HS coaches have on players and it hinders their ability to mold them. The HS kids have become single standing entities almost. Im not saying HS coaches wouldnt build their teams around elite talents if there was no AAU. Of course they would. But AAU gives the players another option and so they dont have to listen to HS coaches as much. And the HS coaches know this and there is more coddling. The players at the HS level have more leverage now, which has its good and bads but one of the bad elements is that theyve become hired guns and if the player thinks he doesnt need to polish his game when the coach tries to make him, the player can often get away with ignoring the coach.

No I get that, but what the hell does that metaphor mean?

 

[houheffna]

Dallas couldnt win against that team on Dirk alone. Theyre problem wouldnt have been on offense. I like all you guys who claim that Dirk is so unguardable, yet, what has Dallas won with him? And, mind you, this is in an NBA that gives players like Dirk a lot more space.

But moreover, if the 06 Heat would have played against the 90 Pistons, Wade would not have been nearly as effective as he was against the Mavs. And same with facing the 92 Bulls. The Bulls would have clamped down on him and with Jordan on the other side, Wade wouldnt have had a chance to show how clutch he was, just like Drexler and anyone else didnt.


I was talking about the bogusness of your premise. Teams are typically built around star players. So it might vary depending on the GM and so this idea of treating them as interchangeable parts to contrive some measurement criteria is somewhat laughable.



Those Portland teams pushed tempo. Im not sure how Shaq would have fit in with that style of play at that point in his career.



Once again, this observation is drastically distorted by the fact that during the vast majority of Wades time in the league, perimeter players have been given more space. And, obviously, Drexler played well enough for Portland to make it to the NBA finals twice, which is more than Miami has made it.

And also, there have been times when Reggie Miller was no where to be found.



Once again, Wade plays in an NBA where perimeter players are given more space. And when you look at output, Wade isnt really THAT much better if he is at all.

There has been times when Reggie Miller was no where to be found? I don't know what that means. Miller is one of the great clutch players in NBA history. Check youtube. No player showed up ALL the time, but Reggie showed up a heck of a lot more than Drexler did.

Based on output, Wade is better. That has been explained to you clearly...you really don't want to get it.

Shaq wouldn't have fit Portland's system, but Kevin Duckworth would? OKAY!!!!!

 

[Lex L.]

No I get that, but what the hell does that metaphor mean?

Like I said, its like players have become more single entities to themselves. Im sure from time to time that youve heard these guys are their own corporations. Well, this kind of speaks to that.

The sun metaphor describes them as single entities that everything else revolves around. If they dont buy into the coaches program in HS, they can go somewhere else and they can take their talents elsewhere to some AAU team that better enhances their brand in their eyes.

 

[Lex L.]

There has been times when Reggie Miller was no where to be found? I don't know what that means. Miller is one of the great clutch players in NBA history. Check youtube. No player showed up ALL the time, but Reggie showed up a heck of a lot more than Drexler did.

Yeah, I know about what he did against the Knicks. OK.

Based on output, Wade is better. That has been explained to you clearly...you really don't want to get it.

No, that has not been shown. All that youve accomplished is prove that youre nothing more than a parrot.

Shaq wouldn't have fit Portland's system, but Kevin Duckworth would? OKAY!!!!!

I dont think Duckworth expected to be as involved in teh offense as Shaq would have. Shaq is/was better than Duckworth clearly and so to expect to be more involved is justified. But Portland played a lot of tempo which isnt ideal for someone who wants to be as heavily as involved in the offense as someone like Shaq. Also, at no point did I say Duckworth was ideal for that system but when youre talking about pushing tempo, you have to calibrate it to the level of involvement the center expects and also what theyre paid.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Like I said, its like players have become more single entities to themselves. Im sure from time to time that youve heard these guys are their own corporations. Well, this kind of speaks to that.

The sun metaphor describes them as single entities that everything else revolves around. If they dont buy into the coaches program in HS, they can go somewhere else and they can take their talents elsewhere to some AAU team that better enhances their brand in their eyes.

Yeah, that is a dumb metaphor.

Your logic on AAU is also dumb.

 

[Lefty]

No, that has not been shown.

:rolling:

 

[Lex L.]

Yeah, that is a dumb metaphor.

Your logic on AAU is also dumb.

Thats nice.

 

[Bullsman24]

ok i'd agree with hou, i think wade is better than drexler.

HOWEVER

dwyane wade is virtually without a doubt the second best player in the NBA today. perhaps rankings may get screwed up with james and wade on the same team, but i would say that lebron and wade are the two most talented and best players in the league RIGHT NOW. (for the record i'm leaving durant out of the top 2 b/c of the way he disappeared in the playoffs mostly).

clyde drexler was nowhere near the second best player in the league in 1990. ahead of him clearly is:

magic
michael
isiah
olajuwon
bird
malone
barkley
ewing

to name a few. yet we're still able to have an argument with a player outside the top ten in the nba at jordan's time and a top two player today.

and just to throw it out there, wade is very fragile and if he was guarded the way jordan was against the pistons, he might have broken every bone in his body.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

As much as I admire all that Reggie Miller did, Clyde Drexler is way, way, WAY better.

 

[Bullsman24]

As much as I admire all that Reggie Miller did, Clyde Drexler is way, way, WAY better.

reggie was a fantastic player but i think the reason clyde is better is that he was able to create his own shot with ease while reggie effectively used his teammates to get open. both fantastic at what they did though.

 

[Lex L.]

ok i'd agree with hou, i think wade is better than drexler.

HOWEVER

dwyane wade is virtually without a doubt the second best player in the NBA today. perhaps rankings may get screwed up with james and wade on the same team, but i would say that lebron and wade are the two most talented and best players in the league RIGHT NOW. (for the record i'm leaving durant out of the top 2 b/c of the way he disappeared in the playoffs mostly).

clyde drexler was nowhere near the second best player in the league in 1990. ahead of him clearly is:

magic
michael
isiah
olajuwon
bird
malone
barkley
ewing

to name a few. yet we're still able to have an argument with a player outside the top ten in the nba at jordan's time and a top two player today.

and just to throw it out there, wade is very fragile and if he was guarded the way jordan was against the pistons, he might have broken every bone in his body.

Magic, Jordan, Malone, and Olajuwon are probably the best players in the history of the league at their positions. And Tim Duncan no Duncan is not a PF.

And also, I think Bird was starting to break down around 90.

 

[Diddy1122]

Ok there's some serious revisionist history going in this thread. And Hou I am surprised at how much you are trashing Clyde's career. Everyone here is acting like the guy was Xavier McDaniel. Clyde is one of the 50 best all-time & for good reason. He could do everything on the court; score, rebound, pass, block & steal. The guy is the 3rd best rebounding guard EVER in the history of the NBA. I remember him nearly having a quadruple double in a game when he was with the Rockets.

And c'mon people, you are making out those Portland teams to be the equivalent of Wade's Heat in '06, which is so far from the truth it's beyond the realm of stupidity. Those Blazers teams had Terry Porter, Jerome Kersey, Buck Williams, Danny Ainge, young Cliff Robinson, & yes, Kevin Duckworth, who I have news for all you youngins out there, was a GOOD center. Injuries cut his career short. Hell the Blazers were a top 5 offense for the majority of Clyde's time there, not to mention one of the best rebounding teams. The faced some very tough competition come playoff time in the Lakers, Pistons, Bulls etc. & unfortunately, much like the Knicks, Pacers, & Jazz they never got the big prize thanks to one Michael Jeffrey Jordan.

 

[Crystallas]

As much as I admire all that Reggie Miller did, Clyde Drexler is way, way, WAY better.

That's apples and oranges to me. If you had 2 gutted teams, I'd rather have peak Reggie than Clyde. But if you had a decent cast I would take Drexler, Clyde stepped down and up to help his teams, Reggie was a loose cannon that loved the spotlight. Clydes rookie year was awesome to watch and he was ridiculously mature for the age and level he played at. Rookie Reggie... albeit, he did have to overcome a lot in Indy after the fans were set on Alford, he was still the same annoying Reggie LOL.

 

[Crystallas]

Ok there's some serious revisionist history going in this thread. And Hou I am surprised at how much you are trashing Clyde's career. Everyone here is acting like the guy was Xavier McDaniel. Clyde is one of the 50 best all-time & for good reason. He could do everything on the court; score, rebound, pass, block & steal. The guy is the 3rd best rebounding guard EVER in the history of the NBA. I remember him nearly having a quadruple double in a game when he was with the Rockets.

And c'mon people, you are making out those Portland teams to be the equivalent of Wade's Heat in '06, which is so far from the truth it's beyond the realm of stupidity. Those Blazers teams had Terry Porter, Jerome Kersey, Buck Williams, Danny Ainge, young Cliff Robinson, & yes, Kevin Duckworth, who I have news for all you youngins out there, was a GOOD center. Injuries cut his career short. Hell the Blazers were a top 5 offense for the majority of Clyde's time there, not to mention one of the best rebounding teams. The faced some very tough competition come playoff time in the Lakers, Pistons, Bulls etc. & unfortunately, much like the Knicks, Pacers, & Jazz they never got the big prize thanks to one Michael Jeffrey Jordan.

Don't forget about Rick Adelman. He was no chopped liver at that time. Duckworth was better for them than Bowie. That was a damn good team, but without Adelman(for that point and time) much of the team would be at each other's throats, and I don't think we would have seen 2 finals appearances from them.