Kane and Toews Extension - 8 Years $88 Million?

the canadian dream

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at least Duncs makes 5.5.  In this current market he is a 8 million dollar plus blueliner soooo for those worried about toews and kanes cap hit? look at the positives at least Keith isnt clogging up more of the cap which he very well could have if he wasnt a free agent when the market was lower. like i said right now the team has locked up one of if not the best centers in the league..the best right wing in the league and possibly the best blueliner in the league. im not going to complain if you cant keep building around those three then you suck as a gm.</p>
 

Tater

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Kane/Toews contracts will probably look like a bargain in 3-4 years.</p>
 

EspoForever

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I looked at some of the math last night...forgive me if this has been beaten to death already, but it looked like the Canadian TV deal, which kicks in this season and begins to affect the cap next year (same year the new Toews and Kane contracts take effect) will boost revenue around 270M per season league wide. That's about 9 M per team. Since the cap gets 50% of HRR, then the cap will go up by around 4.5M as a result of the Canadian TV contract alone.</p>


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So Kane and Toews together have gotten a raise of around 8.4 Million over now (as they make 12.6 M per year now and will be making 21M combined next year.) </p>


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We are over cap now by around 2M I believe so that added to 8.4 has us 10M over cap, which we expect to go up 4.5 M so we'll be 6M over cap BEFORE Saad will get a large raise, as well as others coming along.</p>


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So yeah, we're back to 2011 again, and also ticket prices (face) are NOT much below what the secondary market is bearing right now. That is a significant indicator that the public is getting maxed out on ticket price increases...so as with this year, I expect the cap to be rising a LOT more slowly than it has been recently.</p>


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That is why I believe Toews and Kane have over-done it with their raise and, after this year, may not be on a competitive team for a LONG time after that. They chose a few extra million dollars a year over winning IMO.</p>
 

the canadian dream

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if kane and toews start floating then we can talk about them being in it for the money over winning. until then i dont buy into that notion with these two from what i have seen from their dedications and passions towards the game. </p>
 

Forklift

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Trev" data-cid="234451" data-time="1404927774">
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"Team will suck" might be a bit of overkill. The biggest thing will be moving some of these higher contracts out (Seabs, Sharp, Bickell even Hossa) and finding a replacement that's near par. I have faith Stan can do it and with his drafting and developing it's very realistic. If the cap goes up more it will obviously help each year.


No doubt Kane and Toews are worth every penny. Just need to hope management can keep the depth at lower prices and developing unlike the Pens are doing.</p>
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Not Hossa. Because of the backdive in his contract, if the Hawks trade him and he retires, they'll have to pay a huge cap penalty. They keep him here, and they can just put him on LTIR until his contract runs out..."back issues".</p>
 

winos5

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Forklift" data-cid="234506" data-time="1404995783">
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Not Hossa. Because of the backdive in his contract, if the Hawks trade him and he retires, they'll have to pay a huge cap penalty. They keep him here, and they can just put him on LTIR until his contract runs out..."back issues".</p>
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Agree</p>
 

phranchk

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Forklift" data-cid="234506" data-time="1404995783">
<div>


Not Hossa. Because of the backdive in his contract, if the Hawks trade him and he retires, they'll have to pay a huge cap penalty. They keep him here, and they can just put him on LTIR until his contract runs out..."back issues".</p>
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If that happens do the Hawks get a LTIR replacement for the amount of his cap hit or his salary for that season?</p>
 

Pez68

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="phranchk" data-cid="234477" data-time="1404941659">
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Yes, less money. They likely would've gotten 12 over 7 years on the open market.</p>
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So, the exact same amount of money then? How many teams could afford to pay out those signing bonsues??? VERY FEW teams have that kind of capital to dump in a huge lump sum. They didn't take less money, and they pretty much cap fucked the Hawks for the foreseeable future. Signings had to be made, and I'm glad we'll see them play out their prime here, but let's not fool ourselves. They did the Hawks ZERO favors.</p>
 

Forklift

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="phranchk" data-cid="234511" data-time="1405001342">
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If that happens do the Hawks get a LTIR replacement for the amount of his cap hit or his salary for that season?</p>
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 </p>


Yep. Same thing the Flyers/Pronger, Bruins/Savard and Lighting/Ohlund.</p>
 

phranchk

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Apparently the report of $44 million in signing bonuses was misleading. They get bonuses making up a portion of their salary every season. Next season it will be $7 million in bonuses and 6.8 in salary.</p>
 

MassHavoc

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Is there anywhere where this is all spelled out yet? Capgeek or something?</p>
 

Maiden

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I was pretty much done with the NHL a couple years ago but this could be the end for me.</p>


First it was baseball, then football, then basketball. Hockey finally caught the big 3 and completely ruined the sport for me.</p>


I'm off to the AHL, USHL, NAHL and HPHL.</p>
 

MassHavoc

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Here’s a look at how the contracts for Chicago Blackhawks forwards Patrick Kane and Jonathan Toews will each be broken down over their eight-year extensions:


(According to information told to ESPN.com’s Pierre LeBrun by a source)

2015-16 -- Signing bonus at $7 million + salary at $6.8 million = $13.8 million

2016-17 -- Signing bonus at $6 million + salary at $7.8 million = $13.8 million

2017-18 -- Signing bonus at $6 million + salary at $7.8 million = $13.8 million

2018-19 -- Signing bonus at $6 million + salary at $6 million = $12 million

2019-20 -- Signing bonus at $6 million + salary at $3.8 million = $9.8 million

2020-21 -- Signing bonus at $5 million + salary at $2 million = $7 million

2021-22 -- Signing bonus at $4 million + salary at $2.9 million = $6.9 million

2022-23 -- Signing bonus at $4 million + salary at $2.9 million = $6.9 million

Total signing bonuses: $44 million
Total salaries: $40 million


The Blackhawks will have an average cap hit of $10.5 million per season over the eight years.</p>


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From ESPN</p>
 

Chief Walking Stick

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Lol remember when $6.9mil was high for even top forwards?  Kane and Toews will be making that into their mid 30s.</p>
 

LordKOTL

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My favorite teams
  1. Portland Timbers
  1. Chicago Blackhawks
Not just that, Grim, But consider this:</p>


 </p>


Take Toews because let's be honest--you build franchises around him and player like him.  If the cap remains at 69M in 2016 (likley it won't), he'll have a cap% of 15.2%.</p>


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Khabi, in 2006, made 6.75M, with a cap of like 30.9M, he had about 17% of the cap--in other words someone though he was someone to build a franchise around.</p>


 </p>


Glad those days aren't back. </p>


 </p>


I have no probs with what Kane and Toews are making.</p>
 

cplmac

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<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="the hanadian dreamzues" data-cid="234505" data-time="1404969794">
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if kane and toews start floating then we can talk about them being in it for the money over winning. until then i dont buy into that notion with these two from what i have seen from their dedications and passions towards the game. </p>
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Nobody is doubting their effort or desire to win, the point is in taking contracts this size they have significantly limited the front offices ability to surround them with top level talent.  As good as they are and Duncan Keith is, you won't win a cup with 3 or even 6 players.  They deserved these contracts and maybe more, I don't blame them for taking the money they took but that doesn't change the fact that we're gonna be in a bind moving forward.  How many top end players are we going to have in the pipeline?  That's the only way we are going to be able to stay a perennial cup contender.  I have confidence that Bowman will do the best that can be done.</p>
 

Variable

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They'll be in a bit of a cap bind the first year or two of their new contract, but that's where you trust in your drafting. By then Oduya and Rozisval will be gone, Versteeg should be gone (hopefully this offseason), one of Sharp or Seabrook or Bickell may be gone.  And by then hopefully guys like Stephen Johns are ready to step in, or Clendening or Dahlbeck. Forwards like McNeil taking someone like Bickell's spot, Saad continuing to improve, Teuvo coming in hopefully starting this season, Hartman, Danault,etc. They have players who, by that time, should be ready for the NHL, some may be now.</p>


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Now if Toews/Kane REALLY wanted to twist the knife, they could've opted for shorter deals (like 4  years) and then be looking at an even bigger pay day when those are up. Because by then  the cap will probably be around 80 million or more, along with the contracts/cap hits increasing for new deals signed during that time. That's why you can't compare contracts signed under old CBAs to contracts being signed now. There are no real loopholes anymore to circumvent the cap. Crosby got paid 12 million last year, but with a cap hit of 8.7. If those rules weren't in place, you better believe the same thing would've happened with Toews/Kane's deals, bringing their AAV down a couple million. But you can't do that anymore. We're going to start seeing a more realistic representation of cap hits for the bigger name/star players in the league that sign new deals. And it may be hard to believe right now, but what Toews and Kane signed for, currently the highest paid players in the league, might look like a bargain two  or three years from now.</p>
 

Tater

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Toews/Kane are fools. They should have held out until the team guaranteed that Ribiero would be signed too.</p>
 

MassHavoc

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Well... let's look at it this way... They got just under 2 Bolland's each... so the two of them together are only 4 Bollands... I think that's a hell of a deal.</p>


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Who else had big signings this off-season, and how does it compare. Hell look at the money some of the good but not great goalies got? I think we shouldn't be comparing the deals to far in the future or in the past deals, let's look at how the deals compare to others that were just signed because that's the real bar. They are all workign in the same environment with the same expectations of the cap going up next year.</p>
 

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