Latest on Poles from the X source haters love to hate on - Sear(s)Tower

[Mighty Joe Young]

This is so cute.

This is literally a conglomeration of news and rumors that have come up and offers up absolutely zero inside information.

The first bit is from the Kevin Warren press conference where Warren made it abundantly clear Poles will remain.

The second part comes from the Ian Rapaport NFL network reporting.

The third bit comes from the Albert Breer piece from earlier this week.

It's just a collection of already reported news and information with his spin and him adding sources within the building of which he has none.

Given how many wrong and bad takes you've had, I don't think you're the right guy to deliver that message.

 

[UChiLAbear]

I just want to know where he goes to get said knowledge? I think at this point he’s not going to learn

Exactly...if he doesn't know at his age, he's never going to learn. The torch has been handed down and the continuation of the "curse of the eloping daughter." The saga continues.

 

[DanielCCSBears]

Given how many wrong and bad takes you've had, I don't think you're the right guy to deliver that message.

You know what my most recent wrong take was? The Bears were more likely to lose their next 9 games and I said that before the Washington debacle. The past three years this team has only managed to beat really bad teams with two exceptions the Lions and the 49ers with Trey Lance starting in the great flood game.

There has been zero signs of progress at any point and a completely asinine overestimation of the talent on this team by the board. From Gervon Dexter is having an All Pro level season after 4 games to Roschon Johnson is the next Leveon Bell it's been an absolute flood of meatball takes one game after another. Most of which have been completely wrong.

 

[UChiLAbear]

But the Bears arent telling HC candidates they can pick their GM and have final say. It sounds like if they are willing to get their guy then they understand Poles has to go. Therefore they will find a GM who fits with the new HC. More than likely a guy they already have some type of relationship with already or mutual understand of how to build a team.

What's the difference?

 

[Discus fish salesman]

You know what my most recent wrong take was? The Bears were more likely to lose their next 9 games and I said that before the Washington debacle. The past three years this team has only managed to beat really bad teams with two exceptions the Lions and the 49ers with Trey Lance starting in the great flood game.

There has been zero signs of progress at any point and a completely asinine overestimation of the talent on this team by the board. From Gervon Dexter is having an All Pro level season after 4 games to Roschon Johnson is the next Leveon Bell it's been an absolute flood of meatball takes one game after another. Most of which have been completely wrong.

You are the only person that has compared roschon to bell.

 

[UChiLAbear]

That is a distinction without a difference IMO.

You are firing the GM because of me ansd going out of your way to hire a GM I endorse. So you have already signaled to me I have the leverage so year I want roster control. At that point if Bears are willing to fire Poles why would they reject giving roster control?

The only way firing Poles doesnt create this situation IMO is if you fire him independently. The minute you tell the HC you are firing Poles to appease the HC, they now have the power. So better be comfortable with that if you go that route.

Unless structure has changed, and I bet my life it hasn't, the HC can make suggestions to the GM about what positions he would like drafted, but there is no way in heck the HC is telling the GM whom to draft and in what round. Also, the GM has final say of the roster not the HC.

 

[MikeDitkaPolishSausage]

What's the difference?

Because Remy is suggesting the new HC will want full control. I’m suggesting that won’t happen. That’s a pretty big difference. If a new HC wants full control they will make that known. There has been no speculation that someone like Johnson wants full control.

 

[UChiLAbear]

Because Remy is suggesting the new HC will want full control. I’m suggesting that won’t happen. That’s a pretty big difference. If a new HC wants full control they will make that known. There has been no speculation that someone like Johnson wants full control.

I guess I read it wrong. My apologies.

 

[MikeDitkaPolishSausage]

I guess I read it wrong. My apologies.

You are good!

 

[Nelly]

If the Bears don’t want to operate that way then they don’t hire that type of HC. Pretty simple. If Johnson is their guy and he doesn’t click with Poles than it’s actually smart to get a GM that will work with him. Nothing there says the HC wants full control. Only that the HC wants a GM he can easily work with on a daily basis.

It would be so Bears to operate this way. If you signal at all that the president or ownership will fire someone who's supposed to be your boss because you won't work with him then he's not really your boss. You hold all the cards, including against ownership. It immediately sets up a dysfunctional relationship where the GM can't really operate as a GM because the coach has leverage over him with the brass cause it already happened. In that instance, might as well make the coach the GM as well, or at least give him full roster control.

If they're going to keep Poles then the coach should be solely Poles' decision. This is how successful organizations work. They hire a guy to do a job and let him do his job without micro-managing. If he doesn't do a good enough job then therefore you know it's his fault because you gave him autonomy to do what you asked, and as such, fire him. The Bears are anything but, with a near-dead owner who's limp-wristed son is technically running things and hired a boss-man type in Warren who didn't hire Poles and therefore it's really Warren hiring the coach who then could maybe get the GM fired if he doesn't like him and so on. This is why we don't win football games. Success or failure starts at the top.

 

[Dstone5553]

It's not an unreasonable expectation that the guy who is in charge knows a thing or two about a thing or two.

When it comes to billionaire football owners who inherited everything they have?

Really?

I'd rather he choose someone, anyone, who's actually a success and have them make all his decisions for him.

Leave when he goes to the John up to him but everything else...

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

When it comes to billionaire football owners who inherited everything they have?

Really?

I'd rather he choose someone, anyone, who's actually a success and have them make all his decisions for him.

Leave when he goes to the John up to him but everything else...

Yes. Really.

Are you under the impression that I'm thinking George should be out on scouting trips? Are you under the impression I want him making draft picks?

He chose Ernie Accorsi and Bill Polian, who recommended Ryan Pace and Ryan Poles, and by extension, Jon Fox and Matt Eberflus. Maybe, just maybe, if he bothered to pay attention and learn some things, he might be choosing better people to make those decisions.

Is this some sort of radical approach I think he should take?

 

[bamainatlanta]

You are the only person that has compared roschon to bell.

And he’s the only one that has deduced that Dexter is an all-pro.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

You'll get an offensive coach and you'll enjoy it! As well as lots of resources into the offense, since they already put a ton in the defense and it's one of the worst units in the league.

Bobby Slowick Jr.

 

[bamainatlanta]

You are the only person that has compared roschon to bell.

@cameronkrazie86 he just won’t let this go will he

 

[remydat]

Unless structure has changed, and I bet my life it hasn't, the HC can make suggestions to the GM about what positions he would like drafted, but there is no way in heck the HC is telling the GM whom to draft and in what round. Also, the GM has final say of the roster not the HC.

I am saying HC that have picked their GMs usually have roster control. Shanny for example has roster control in San Fran. Lynch cannot make a move that Shanny disapproves of. It is in his contract.

Jim Harbaugh was hired first and basically chose his GM who was an exec with his brother's team. He has final roster control

Jim Harbaugh To Have Final Say In Chargers' Roster Decisions

New Chargers head coach Jim Harbaugh will have the opportunity to make key personnel moves for the franchise

clutchpoints.com

So again I cant really think of any example where a HC essentially picks his GM but doesnt have final say on the roster.

Once you give the HC power to decided his GM then you are telling the HC they are more important than the GM. So typically they want that embedded in their contract by being given full roster control. The GM then just becomes the guy that does all the legal work for them but the HC makes the final decision.

 

[DaaBears]

NFL politics worse than United States politics.

 

[Bearly]

Here's the thing - at the very least, this dude has a track record of this year and last year of getting things right.

Haters can kick back and say "anyone can say XYZ was going to happen!" yet they always say this after the fact, and not before.

I think this guy has some legit sources around the league because he's been accurate. The fact that he hasn't tried to spin a couple of correct "guesses" into further notoriety or a career lend even moreso to his legitimacy in my opinion.

Don't understand the title of this thread since most here think this may be a reasonable source. Please don't confuse this link with some of the ones you use in other forums.

That said, this guy has a habit of stating the most probable.

 

[DefNextYear]

I am saying HC that have picked their GMs usually have roster control. Shanny for example has roster control in San Fran. Lynch cannot make a move that Shanny disapproves of. It is in his contract.

Jim Harbaugh was hired first and basically chose his GM who was an exec with his brother's team. He has final roster control

Jim Harbaugh To Have Final Say In Chargers' Roster Decisions

New Chargers head coach Jim Harbaugh will have the opportunity to make key personnel moves for the franchise

clutchpoints.com

So again I cant really think of any example where a HC essentially picks his GM but doesnt have final say on the roster.

Once you give the HC power to decided his GM then you are telling the HC they are more important than the GM. So typically they want that embedded in their contract by being given full roster control. The GM then just becomes the guy that does all the legal work for them but the HC makes the final decision.

Is there a good reason that this isn't the structure more often? I'm not asking to spread a coach thin and make him do all the work... but the coach can count on the GM to head scouting and work financials among whatever else. They can discuss players and what to do, but the HC makes the final call on the players he wants on his team. It's like college football that way. And ultimately, the HC makes more money than the GM... which means he should have more control and authority. It's a direct vote of importance. Anyway, my first sentence isn't facetious... I'm genuinely curious why a GM has authority over a HC, especially in a setup where there's a president above both of them. To me, HC seems more important to warrant at least being an equal.

 

[Moses Moreno]

Is there a good reason that this isn't the structure more often? I'm not asking to spread a coach thin and make him do all the work... but the coach can count on the GM to head scouting and work financials among whatever else. They can discuss players and what to do, but the HC makes the final call on the players he wants on his team. It's like college football that way. And ultimately, the HC makes more money than the GM... which means he should have more control and authority. It's a direct vote of importance. Anyway, my first sentence isn't facetious... I'm genuinely curious why a GM has authority over a HC, especially in a setup where there's a president above both of them. To me, HC seems more important to warrant at least being an equal.

Simply put, it comes down to egos. Larger than life HCs have amounts of power that a GM centric team wouldn't have and aren't afraid to speak their mind and that doesn't work well with fragile ownership who want everything to be hunky dory.

GMs speak 5-10 times a year, HCs speak 2-3 times a week in season - if the HC leads the charge the ownership group has less control over messaging because it's the HC's vision and execution that's doing the work.