**OFFICAIL** Bears 2024 Regular Season News & Schleisse - FTO Preferred - No ALTS! Derailing Is Discouraged!

[remydat]

I never said they won’t have to. I merely stated that there’s no need for that team to get into a bidding war with itself. That the free and open market will determine Kylers worth

To state that it will take first round pick(s) as some guaranteed cost for him is living outside of reality when it comes to asset valuation in sports, economics, anything

I never said they would get in a bidding war with themselves or that it would take first round picks. I responded to a guy saying Murray is not worth more than a 4th in a league where Wentz ended up costing a 1st and the great Nick Foles cost a 4th.

I also said IF he is considered a franchise QB that teams will pay. That is a big if and it is entirely possible he is not considered a franchise QB in which case he will go for less. The point was teams dont get discounts on perceived franchise QBs based on actual trades in the real NFL.

 

[knoxville7]

I never said they would get in a bidding war with themselves or that it would take first round picks. I responded to a guy saying Murray is not worth more than a 4th in a league where Wentz ended up costing a 1st and the great Nick Foles cost a 4th.

I also said IF he is considered a franchise QB that teams will pay. That is a big if and it is entirely possible he is not considered a franchise QB in which case he will go for less. The point was teams dont get discounts on perceived franchise QBs based on actual trades in the real NFL.

Basically what you’re saying is what he gets traded for will determine if he’s viewed as a franchise QB or not. Which I would disagree with.

Also, the fact that wentz and foles went for what they did, has zero bearing on what Murray will go for.

If 1 team views him as a franchise level QB, you think they should automatically give up equal to or more what wentz got? That makes no sense if no other teams want him

Like, I can think kyler is a franchise QB but still not give up what you deem to be franchise level cost in a trade for him, due to being the only team that views him in such a light.

 

[remydat]

Basically what you’re saying is what he gets traded for will determine if he’s viewed as a franchise QB or not. Which I would disagree with.

Also, the fact that wentz and foles went for what they did, has zero bearing on what Murray will go for.

If 1 team views him as a franchise level QB, you think they should automatically give up equal to or more what wentz got? That makes no sense if no other teams want him

Like, I can think kyler is a franchise QB but still not give up what you deem to be franchise level cost in a trade for him, due to being the only team that views him in such a light.

No I am not saying that at all. You have it backwards. I am saying if he is perceived as a franchise QB he will likely cost franchise QB compensation.

Trades occur in the NFL where previous trades impact future trades just as previous contracts impact future contracts. Teams are aware of what comparable players have been traded or signed for and it factors into the compensation they ask for or are willing to offer. That is how market dynamics work. How else do you think the market determines value? Magic?

If 1 team views him as a franchise level QB they should not automatically give up more than what Wentz got. What is more likely is when it is all said and done they will likely have to give up similar value because it is unlikely only one team will be interested and it is unlikely the Cards are going to eat all that money to give him away for cheap.

If the Cards draft a rookie QB they can still keep Murray as that rookie will be on a rookie contract. Murray's dead cap is 97m for 23 and 81m for 24. They save some of that if they trade him but not enough to make it worthwhile to sell him off cheap.

So there are any number of variables here which is why in the end these guys tend to go for more than fans expect. Same thing happened with Rodgers. GB werent going to accept less when they have to eat a **** ton of money that would be more than his actual cap hit if they kept him.

 

[UChiLAbear]

Answer a question for me if you would.
Why do we use the acronym UDFA instead of UFA? Last time I checked "Undrafted" is one word, so why the D?
Not a great, earth shaking issue I know, but every time I see UDFA I always wonder why

Answer a question for me if you would.
Why do we use the acronym UDFA instead of UFA? Last time I checked "Undrafted" is one word, so why the D?
Not a great, earth shaking issue I know, but every time I see UDFA I always wonder why.

not sure if anyone answered yet...however, UFA stands for Unrestricted Free Agent, referring to a Vet who can sign with any team. You already know what UDFA stands for. For example....Jack Sanborn was a UDFA signing.

 

[pdxbearsfan]

The Rich Cohen 85 Bears book.

Thanks

 

[HearshotKDS]

Sorry to interrupt whatever the **** goes on in this thread now, Robert Schmitz with a nice video on Jaylon Johnson:

 

[Hawkeye OG]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678564989202776064

 

[cameronkrazie86]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678564989202776064

The CHAIN GANG would become obsolete!

 

[remydat]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678564989202776064

The NFL can tell you the velocity of a pass and the angle it was thrown at as well. Lest we forget all the talk about Watson's lack of velocity when he was coming out of college.

But just like MLB struggles with whether a player was safe or out on a tag, the NFL struggles with whether the ball has crossed the goalline or not.

So comparing apples and oranges. It is easier to measure velocity or angles when the distance between point A and B is large enough to calculate such things. It is much harder to determine if a tag beat the runner touching a bag or the ball crossing a goalline because the distance between point A and B is much smaller. Not to mention in the case of the NFL there are 22 players potentially obscuring your view.

 

[Hawkeye OG]

Dumb comparison. NFL can tell you the velocity of a pass and the angle it was thrown at as well.

But just like MLB struggles with whether a player was safe or out on a tag, the NFL struggles with whether the ball has crossed the goalline or not.

So comparing apples and oranges.

ok. It was just a tweet i thought was funny/liked, I don't need to know your entire life story

 

[bamainatlanta]

ok. It was just a tweet i thought was funny/liked, I don't need to know your entire life story

He must be a blast at parties

 

[cameronkrazie86]

He must be a blast at parties

If you really want to know, I'm sure expert detective @run and shoot could find out!

 

[remydat]

ok. It was just a tweet i thought was funny/liked, I don't need to know your entire life story

Yes and I was explaining why it was a pretty dumb comparison. That was not directed at you but the person that made the comparison.

He must be a blast at parties

I am provided there are sharks for me to punch.

 

[bamainatlanta]

In all seriousness, it really was an awful comparison

 

[Payton!34]

We dont actually know that. You are assuming what has been publicly reported is all the information that teams have.

If for whatever reason the Jets didnt work out I doubt Rodgers retires and more likely considers other teams.



What leverage did the Jets have? They fucking blew the Wilson pick and Rodgers is their only hope of staving off being fired. No chance they draft another QB when the rest of the team is ready to win now and Rodgers is clearly a better gamble than Carr or JG.

He may end up sucking but the Jets had to go and get him if they view their team as ready to contend. If I were them there is no other QB that was available that I would gamble my job on unless Brady was willing to play another year or two. I certainly would not stick with Wilson.

What other options did the Jets have?

I think you misunderstood what the poster was saying. He didn’t say the Jets had any advantage,

I never said they would get in a bidding war with themselves or that it would take first round picks. I responded to a guy saying Murray is not worth more than a 4th in a league where Wentz ended up costing a 1st and the great Nick Foles cost a 4th.

I also said IF he is considered a franchise QB that teams will pay. That is a big if and it is entirely possible he is not considered a franchise QB in which case he will go for less. The point was teams dont get discounts on perceived franchise QBs based on actual trades in the real NFL.

i said that that I don’t think someone should give up more than a fourth because of Arizona not being in a great bargaining position. That’s all! I never said he sucked and isn’t worth more than a 4th.

You’re interpolating what I wrote instead of really trying to understand what I wrote.

 

[Payton!34]

No I am not saying that at all. You have it backwards. I am saying if he is perceived as a franchise QB he will likely cost franchise QB compensation.

Trades occur in the NFL where previous trades impact future trades just as previous contracts impact future contracts. Teams are aware of what comparable players have been traded or signed for and it factors into the compensation they ask for or are willing to offer. That is how market dynamics work. How else do you think the market determines value? Magic?

If 1 team views him as a franchise level QB they should not automatically give up more than what Wentz got. What is more likely is when it is all said and done they will likely have to give up similar value because it is unlikely only one team will be interested and it is unlikely the Cards are going to eat all that money to give him away for cheap.

If the Cards draft a rookie QB they can still keep Murray as that rookie will be on a rookie contract. Murray's dead cap is 97m for 23 and 81m for 24. They save some of that if they trade him but not enough to make it worthwhile to sell him off cheap.

So there are any number of variables here which is why in the end these guys tend to go for more than fans expect. Same thing happened with Rodgers. GB werent going to accept less when they have to eat a **** ton of money that would be more than his actual cap hit if they kept him.

My point has always been that Arizona is in a bad position if other teams don’t get desperate. That’s all, but I also said amd agreed that the QB position is so important and GM’s are under so much pressure that they will probably get more than they really should all things considered.

Very simple

 

[The Doctor]

Darnell Mooney interview

 

[Dejo]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678776944220053507

 

[bamainatlanta]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678776944220053507

So he’s intelligent and knowledgeable about QB’s?

 

[remydat]

I think you misunderstood what the poster was saying. He didn’t say the Jets had any advantage,

i said that that I don’t think someone should give up more than a fourth because of Arizona not being in a great bargaining position. That’s all! I never said he sucked and isn’t worth more than a 4th.

You’re interpolating what I wrote instead of really trying to understand what I wrote.

The poster was suggesting GB had all or most of the leverage. I am saying you have to look at the situation from both sides. GB had more leverage than the poster is saying because the Jets are in win now mode and Rodgers represented their best chance at contending for a title. That translates into GB having leverage. Hence when I asked what was the alternative for the Jets I was met with silence.

Likewise, the Cards would have more leverage than you think because:

1. A team might view Murray as their best chance at winning now and thus will be willing to pay for that;

2. The Cards will have to eat a **** ton of dead cap in a Murray trade so no reason to do so unless they get something good;

3. Even if they sign a rookie they can carry a rookie QB on a rookie contract and Murray for some period of time and wait teams out as they are rebuilding and in no rush. A team trading for Murray is likely trying to win now and would want Murray in house in time to learn the offense and new teammates;

So there is really nothing wrong with Zona's bargaining position as they would not be forced to trade Murray. They would be willing to trade him at a price that makes sense for them. You dont eat 97m or 81m in dead cap for a 4th round pick. You are better off keeping him and waiting for a despearate team to come along or for him to get healthy and prove himself.

My point has always been that Arizona is in a bad position if other teams don’t get desperate. That’s all, but I also said amd agreed that the QB position is so important and GM’s are under so much pressure that they will probably get more than they really should all things considered.

Very simple

And I am saying that is not getting more than they should. That is market dynamics at work. If his demand goes up because teams are "desperate" then his cost goes up. If the supply of potential franchise QBs is limited then his cost goes up. That is how a market works.

What you are calling "desperation" is really the supply of potentially good QBs being outstripped by the demand for them. When demand > supply the end result is a higher cost. That is not "desperation" but basic economics.