Rabbi supports ground zero mosque

[bubbleheadchief]

[quote name="LordKOTL"]I think what he means is that if you're going into another country don't act like a douchebag and all high and mighty because you're an american and you think you're better than the natives there.



After all, our politicans give us a bad enough rep (true of most countries, not just the US), the last thing we need is some numbnutted american with canadian flags all over loudly complaining that the "dagum furriners can't speak a lick of english".



And yes, i've seen that tourist in Europe...and yes, I've wanted to secrete a ballpeen hammer into his genitals repeadedly for making america look bad.[/quote]

I knew what he was talking about, the way he went about it set me off. As you could see.

I lived in Europe, for two years, prior to me joining the military, and saw exactly what he was talking about. And everyone of those types we saw, we quickly squashed.

 

[roshinaya]

[quote name="IceHogsFan"]



Holy ****



Where do you reside again? And what nationality do you proclaim so I can share

some thoughts?[/quote]



Let it come, let all your right winged furor rain upon the godless heathen from the socialist hellhole known as Finland. Spare me the "we saved your ass from the Nazi's" crap, that's old hat by now.

 

[bri]

[quote name="roshinaya"]



Let it come, let all your right winged furor rain upon the godless heathen from the socialist hellhole known as Finland. Spare me the "we saved your ass from the Nazi's" crap, that's old hat by now.[/quote]





Hun, nobody hates you. You gave us Sweet Baby Tuomo.

 

[Chief Walking Stick]

Muslims have every right to have a church there as anyone else. There are extremists in every religion that are cuckoo idiots (take a look at Westboro Baptist Church videos on YouTube).



Islam's BASIC principles/message are not that far off base from Christianity. It is morons that are taking the Qu'ran 100% literally that do the stupid stuff like blow themselves up in a crowded market or do anything related to terrorism.



No doubt if a Mosque is put up at Ground Zero that people from all walks of life will be committing "terrorism" of their own on people who visit that temple, funny how that works.

 

[Kerfuffle]

[quote name="Stu Grimson"]Muslims have every right to have a church there as anyone else. There are extremists in every religion that are cuckoo idiots (take a look at Westboro Baptist Church videos on YouTube).



Islam's BASIC principles/message are not that far off base from Christianity. It is morons that are taking the Qu'ran 100% literally that do the stupid stuff like blow themselves up in a crowded market or do anything related to terrorism.



No doubt if a Mosque is put up at Ground Zero that people from all walks of life will be committing "terrorism" of their own on people who visit that temple, funny how that works.[/quote]



No they don't!! I can't believe the crap being tossed around here. Think about all our military that has died in 7 years of war and the 3000 we lost on 9/11 before saying they have a right to build a tropy at Ground Zero.

 

[roshinaya]

[quote name="Kerfuffle"]

No they don't!! I can't believe the crap being tossed around here. Think about all our military that has died in 7 years of war and the 3000 we lost on 9/11 before saying they have a right to build a tropy at Ground Zero.[/quote]



What about the hundred of thousands of innocent lives that have been killed in the invasion and occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan? Are they less worth than your precious soldiers?



And as many have said, a mosque is a place of worship and not a trophy. Not all muslims are evil terrorists.

 

[TSD]

No they don't!! I can't believe the crap being tossed around here. Think about all our military that has died in 7 years of war and the 3000 we lost on 9/11 before saying they have a right to build a tropy at Ground Zero.





I dont support terrorism, i dont think terrorists should be protected, i think when found they should be greased on sight, with that said...



How many muslims have we killed since 9/11 innocent or otherwise? Thousands upon thousands, far far more than they killed of us. In fact despite how the media trys to swing it, from a casualties sustained to casualties inflicted standpoint this is the most lopsided engagement in the history of warfare in the favor of the united states.



We got more than our pound of flesh.



from a philosophical standpoint by your logic muslims would be completely in the right if they didnt allow a church to be built in the middle east because of the down right evil that was exacted on them by christians for centuries during the crusades.



Crusaders once set up camp on the outskirts of Acre during a siege, told the inhabitants they can let their women children and eldery free and they would be given safe passage.



The crusaders proceeded to rape the women, put the elderly and children on pikes, cook them and eat them in front of the defenders as an intimidation tactic. All in the name of the God of mercy and love in that religion of peace, christianity. Yet because of Christianity's long history of violence and oppression i do not believe for a minute all christians are like fred phelps, all christians arent the gunman that shot up the unitarian church, all christians dont bomb abortion clinics, all christians dont protest the graves of dead soldiers, and victims of school shootings, all christians dont run out and lynch *** people etc etc etc.



Or maybe the spanish shouldnt allow any mosques to be built because 75% of their country was occupied by the moors until 1492. When is the cycle of hate going to end.

 

[IceHogsFan]

[quote name="roshinaya"]



What about the hundred of thousands of innocent lives that have been killed in the invasion and occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan? Are they less worth than your precious soldiers?

[/quote]



Seriously, two words for your arrogance.



**** you



I have blocked seeing anything you ever type again.

 

[roshinaya]

[quote name="IceHogsFan"]



Seriously, two words for your arrogance.



**** you[/quote]



Well, **** you too!

 

[Kerfuffle]

[quote name="roshinaya"]



What about the hundred of thousands of innocent lives that have been killed in the invasion and occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan? Are they less worth than your precious soldiers?



And as many have said, a mosque is a place of worship and not a trophy. Not all muslims are evil terrorists.[/quote]

Civilian deaths are an unfortunate consequence of war and nobody wants to see that. The military does as much as possible to minimize those casualty numbers. And the terrorists do not fight conventionally - they fight from children's hospital bedroom windows, from grade schools, and other civilian places, even mosques and places of worship. They do that because they know any counterattack by American soldiers will be used as war propaganda that we are killing innocent lives. I'm sorry but you are being very disrespectul to our men and women in uniform. Your sarcastic comment calling them my 'precious soldier's' is terrible. And no one said all muslims are evil terrorists but sensitivity should be maintained by the Islamic community. Build your mosque - but put it 5 miles away. If this truly is to be a place of worship they should accept it anywhere in New York except Ground Zero. That is nothing more than a trophy to celebrate their 9/11 event.

 

[TSD]

[quote name="IceHogsFan"]



Seriously, two words for your arrogance.



**** you[/quote]



While his comment was worded in a rather, insensitive nature and civilian casualties are an unfortunate side effect of war that is unavoidable.



The people of iraq and and Afghanistan have paid in a river of blood for the misdeeds of their fundamentalist terrorist bretheren.





To say they cant build a mosque near the site of 9/11 "becuz we hasnt gots our revenge yet!" is ridiculous.



and this is coming from some one who has and still does support both conflicts, at least to the point of setting up stable governments in the 2 countries.

 

[LordKOTL]

[quote name="TSD"]...

When is the cycle of hate going to end.[/quote]

As soon as people get over this "My God has a bigger dick than your God" craze.



Look at it this way: One could argue that the Christian God looks down upon wingnuts that do bad things in his name, like, say the Westboro Baptist Church. It's not a far reach to think that Allah would look down upon any islamic terrorist that kills innocent people in his name. Either ay, it's just a bunch of idiot humans using a spectral entity to justify their hate. The problem is not the Gods, the problem is the idiot humans.

 

[Kerfuffle]

[quote name="IceHogsFan"]



Seriously, two words for your arrogance.



**** you



I have blocked seeing anything you ever type again.[/quote]



+1 and thank you!

 

[bubbleheadchief]

This is a straight question, not picking either side of the argument, how many of these civilian deaths have been caused by the extremists blownig themselves up in crowds of their own country men, women and children????





Now for the record, I will voice my opinion on the original topic, the mosque at ground zero. Find another place. I dont give a rats ass about anyone elses religion I really dont. If they, the people wanting to build this mosque/slash cultural center, truelly want to promote being a religion of peace and respect, they need to understand that their religion was used as an excuse to kill several thousand peoples of several different countries and religions, not just "Good ol' god fearin 'mericans," and yes, there were Muslims killed too. Hell, I do not want to see a church of any kind built near the place.

Simply becasue religion was used to justify the event in the first place.



To me this would be tantamount to building a US Embassy at ground zero of Hiroshima or Nagasaki, completely thoughtless and disrespectful.

 

[TSD]

[quote name="LordKOTL"]

As soon as people get over this "My God has a bigger dick than your God" craze.



Look at it this way: One could argue that the Christian God looks down upon wingnuts that do bad things in his name, like, say the Westboro Baptist Church. It's not a far reach to think that Allah would look down upon any islamic terrorist that kills innocent people in his name. Either ay, it's just a bunch of idiot humans using a spectral entity to justify their hate. The problem is not the Gods, the problem is the idiot humans.[/quote]



Exactly, God(s) was/were created as a means to justify whatever BS the psychopath that thought them/it up wanted to do.

 

[The Count Dante]

Prior USMC here in case some dont know and I had 2 tours in the Sandbox.



If you think that this 'war" is about freedom and stopping terrorism (which is laughable as terrorism is a tool of the 'weak' to be able to combat the 'strong' and will ALWAYS exist) I would say you are not seeing the bigger picture. The last time the U.S. has been "the good guys" was WWII. Each and every other excursion since is us being imperialists, greedy, or both.



We will always be fighting someone. We are a military complex and our economy depends on war. Just wanted to throw that in from the "we cant do it because troops died".



Restricting access to real estate based on religion is unconstitutional, whether you like the religion or not.



Sorry for any derail and not looking for argument.

 

[sth]

First of all I believe something like 50 innocent Muslims died on 9/11. Second of all hundreds of thousands of Muslims live in NYC so they need places to pray. Terrorists have killed thousands and thousands of Muslims over the past decade. Al Qadea killed a ton of Shia Muslims in Iraq during the war. And us invading Iraq was a mistake that helped the terrorists. But that doesn't make the terrorists good guys they are huge assholes and deserve to be taken out. Not every thing is black and white, gray people gray.

 

[roshinaya]

[quote name="bubbleheadchief"]This is a straight question, not picking either side of the argument, how many of these civilian deaths have been caused by the extremists blownig themselves up in crowds of their own country men, women and children????

[/quote]



Probably quite a few, but would these bombings have occurred without a foreign military presence in the region? They are after all prepared to die for a cause they believe in, sound familiar? There are no winners in a war, only losers.

 

[TSD]

[quote name="bubbleheadchief"]This is a straight question, not picking either side of the argument, how many of these civilian deaths have been caused by the extremists blownig themselves up in crowds of their own country men, women and children????





Now for the record, I will voice my opinion on the original topic, the mosque at ground zero. Find another place. I dont give a rats ass about anyone elses religion I really dont. If they, the people wanting to build this mosque/slash cultural center, truelly want to promote being a religion of peace and respect, they need to understand that their religion was used as an excuse to kill several thousand peoples of several different countries and religions, not just "Good ol' god fearin 'mericans," and yes, there were Muslims killed too.



To me this would be tantamount to building a US Embassy at ground zero of Hiroshima or Nagasaki, completely thoughtless and disrespectful.[/quote]





The Hiroshima example is a little different. A better comparrison would be this, If a bunch of catholic protestors bombed an abortion clinic killing everyone inside, would people be clamoring against a chruch being built next door? I doubt it.



Its just the fact the majority in this country are christian. if a neighborhood in Iraq was obliterated by a terrorist bomb I dont they would have a problem with a mosque being erected on the site. Now say the Americans Liquidated a town in Iraq, then some group wanted to build a church there, Im pretty sure there would be some pissed off Iraqi's.



Its all a matter of perception. its hard for people in america that are not islamic not to see all of islam as the enemy. Just like its difficult for muslims that are currently affected by the two wars not to see the christian west as the enemy.



Its a scary thought, but I am willing to bet following 9/11 if a vote was taken of the populace in favor of interning all peoples of arab descent, i am willing to bet the majority would have favored it. Its amazing how an experience like this can drive perminent hate for an entire group of people. Whats worse is parents on both sides are espousing this hateful rhetoric in front of their children creating a whole new generation that is going to have the exact same problems.

 

[bri]

Oh guys, let's not argue. Brenda starts back on General Hospital today.