Starlin Castro's Error Tracker (2013 Edition!)

[dabynsky]

The defensive metrics that offered up as having him being well below average his entire career.

Which is exactly what they show.

Thanks. Now we can move on.

And don't show him to be the worst defensive SS in baseball. Now feel free to move on.

 

[KBisBack!]

And don't show him to be the worst defensive SS in baseball. Now feel free to move on.

The well below average defensive metrics combined with his league leading amount of errors and lowest fielding percentage do.

Been trying to move on.

Why don't you answer MS's question instead of crying over the difference between 11th and tied for 10th.

 

[dabynsky]

The well below average defensive metrics combined with his league leading amount of errors and lowest fielding percentage do.

Been trying to move on.

Why don't you answer MS's question instead of crying over the difference between 11th and tied for 10th.

Because it is fun to see you continue to try to spin the conversation to prove your intrepretation of the data.

 

[KBisBack!]

Because it is fun to see you continue to try to spin the conversation to prove your intrepretation of the data.

Not spinning a thing. Have been entirely consistent in my statements that his defensive metrics have been below average and his error's and fielding percetage worst in the league.

The only spin going on is how that somehow makes for a decent defensive SS.

 

[KBisBack!]

Because it is fun to see you continue to try to spin the conversation to prove your intrepretation of the data.

But you clearly don't want to answer the question because you can't.

 

[dabynsky]

Not spinning a thing. Have been entirely consistent in my statements that his defensive metrics have been below average and his error's and fielding percetage worst in the league.

The only spin going on is how that somehow makes for a decent defensive SS.

But you clearly don't want to answer the question because you can't.

And I questioned three things that you said:
1. He is not improving
2. All defensive metrics have him as well below average
3. It is a fact that he is the worst defensive SS

The reason I haven't answered Mt. Salami's question is because it is incredibly subjective who is the worst defensive SS in baseball. Hence who I think is the worst defensive SS is an opinion just as your statement is and why I took issue with it.

 

[KBisBack!]

And I questioned three things that you said:
1. He is not improving
2. All defensive metrics have him as well below average
3. It is a fact that he is the worst defensive SS

All of which have been supported by facts.

You have weakly attempted to spin and nitpick things that tied for 10th isn't the same as 11th.

Wow.

 

[mountsalami]

And I questioned three things that you said:
1. He is not improving
2. All defensive metrics have him as well below average
3. It is a fact that he is the worst defensive SS

The reason I haven't answered Mt. Salami's question is because it is incredibly subjective who is the worst defensive SS in baseball. Hence who I think is the worst defensive SS is an opinion just as your statement is and why I took issue with it.

It's not incredibly subjective. In your opinion using whatever methods you like. Tell me who you believe is the worst defensive SS in the league.

 

[dabears253313]

He makes some errors but at the same time he makes a lot of great plays that most players can't make. He's able to get to the ball in spots where most players can't.

 

[mountsalami]

He makes some errors but at the same time he makes a lot of great plays that most players can't make. He's able to get to the ball in spots where most players can't.

You can say the same for Ian Desmond at one time and Yunel Escobar.

 

[mountsalami]

Maybe the Cubs shouldn't have signed Castro to such a long term deal. He's going to get worse defensively because he's an idiot. He should have been dealt to an AL team to be used as a DH later just like Prince Fielder.

 

[KBisBack!]

He makes some errors but at the same time he makes a lot of great plays that most players can't make. He's able to get to the ball in spots where most players can't.

That is just not true.

There are quite a few great defensive SS around the league who can make the same great plays that Castro does minus all the errors.

 

[dabynsky]

All of which have been supported by facts.

You have weakly attempted to spin and nitpick things that tied for 10th isn't the same as 11th.

Wow.

1. You've never addressed the issues I raised with point 1.

2. I've shown how according to the metrics themselves it says his ratings were average.

3. And again you've given me your opinion and not a fact for point 3. Taking the past three years of data, which includes 2011 where all of the criticisms of Castro are certainly warranted, Castro only ranks dead last in one statistic (fielding percentage by a single point over Ian Desmond). However, by DRS and UZR/150 Castro ranks well ahead of Ian Desmond (-2.6 to -3.4 and -11 to -16). I think there is a perfectly legitimate argument that Castro is better than Desmond, but that is not a fact even though I have facts to support it. That is the issue that I've raised with statement 3.

 

[dabynsky]

That is just not true.

There are quite a few great defensive SS around the league who can make the same great plays that Castro does minus all the errors.

That is correct, but it does not negate the fact that Castro does make more plays than the average SS.

 

[KBisBack!]

And the FACT that he commits more errors than all of the SS does not make up for it.

 

[dabynsky]

And the FACT that he commits more errors than all of the SS does not make up for it.

Well it is nice to find some common ground finally that Castro does indeed have above average range for a SS, but overall is a below average SS defensively.

 

[mountsalami]

And the FACT that he commits more errors than all of the SS does not make up for it.

Unfortunately.

Errors are the single most important statistic when judging a player defensively. Just so happens Castro has failed to show a great amount of improvement in cutting down his errors. If he was a career .250 hitter and had this many errors people would be calling for him to be sent down or traded.

Errors are caused by poor judgement and lack of concentration. He has lead the league in this catagory for a while now. It's not a secret. Cub fans like ourselves see it first hand.

He sucks defensively. Period.

 

[Jntg4]

Unfortunately.

Errors are the single most important statistic when judging a player defensively. Just so happens Castro has failed to show a great amount of improvement in cutting down his errors. If he was a career .250 hitter and had this many errors people would be calling for him to be sent down or traded.

Errors are caused by poor judgement and lack of concentration. He has lead the league in this catagory for a while now. It's not a secret. Cub fans like ourselves see it first hand.

He sucks defensively. Period.

Errors are not the single most important statistic for defense. I could get into how there are better metrics and all but don't have the time nor the care needed to go that route, but fielding percentage is obviously more important as it puts it on a per play basis (e.g. what bench player has 10+ errors if they don't play? but they aren't better than the starter). Then again, Castro's Fld % is close to last too I assume.

 

[KBisBack!]

Errors are not the single most important statistic for defense. I could get into how there are better metrics and all but don't have the time nor the care needed to go that route, but fielding percentage is obviously more important as it puts it on a per play basis (e.g. what bench player has 10+ errors if they don't play? but they aren't better than the starter). Then again, Castro's Fld % is close to last too I assume.

Exactly what is the most important defensive statistic if it isn't errors??

One that fits your agenda better?

And yes Castro is at the bottom of fielding percentage

 

[Jntg4]

Exactly what is the most important defensive statistic if it isn't errors??

One that fits your agenda better?

And yes Castro is at the bottom of fielding percentage

I don't know what is to be honest, there are a lot of proprietary metrics teams use, and you more advanced stats you can find at FanGraphs. I guess you still think batting average is better than OBP and OPS too.

Maybe if fld f/x ever comes out you'd have your answer there.