The Cubs Hot Stove Action Thread

[beckdawg]

I'm not really seeing why so many are excited about the sox. The cubs offense was terrible last year and the the sox actually scored fewer runs last year as an AL team with the DH. Sure the Sox have Sale but what else? Ramirez was decent. De Aza was average. Jose Quintana was decent last year as well. But to talk like they are a fringe playoff team is a pretty huge stretch. You're basically assuming Abreu is a star and that the guys they dealt with are up soon and become impact players.

 

[brett05]

I'm not really seeing why so many are excited about the sox. The cubs offense was terrible last year and the the sox actually scored fewer runs last year as an AL team with the DH. Sure the Sox have Sale but what else? Ramirez was decent. De Aza was average. Jose Quintana was decent last year as well. But to talk like they are a fringe playoff team is a pretty huge stretch. You're basically assuming Abreu is a star and that the guys they dealt with are up soon and become impact players.

1) Everyone had career worse in Defense and Offense and Baserunning and nearly the worst in pitching sans Sale and Q.
2) It does assume we get average play out of all our new young guys right away which is not probable
3) Excitement is from the payroll flexibility, the change over from a veteran team to a youthful athletic team, and that it took four months to rebuild

 

[JosMin]

I'm not really seeing why so many are excited about the sox. The cubs offense was terrible last year and the the sox actually scored fewer runs last year as an AL team with the DH. Sure the Sox have Sale but what else? Ramirez was decent. De Aza was average. Jose Quintana was decent last year as well. But to talk like they are a fringe playoff team is a pretty huge stretch. You're basically assuming Abreu is a star and that the guys they dealt with are up soon and become impact players.

I talked about this on the CCS Radio podcast Saturday night -- I feel the additions the White Sox have made are better compliments to what they already had in place on their roster, compared to what the Cubs have done (which is close to nothing). Nobody outside of Abreu has star potential, but Adam Eaton could prove to be a solid do-it-all option and Matt Davidson could fill a huge void at third. If Ramirez and Beckham give close to what fans expect of them and Adam Dunn smashes something north of 35 homers, they White Sox could have a vastly improved offense. I think their biggest question, aside from what Abreu will give them, is fleshing out their rotation and bullpen.

 

[DewsSox79]

I talked about this on the CCS Radio podcast Saturday night -- I feel the additions the White Sox have made are better compliments to what they already had in place on their roster, compared to what the Cubs have done (which is close to nothing). Nobody outside of Abreu has star potential, but Adam Eaton could prove to be a solid do-it-all option and Matt Davidson could fill a huge void at third. If Ramirez and Beckham give close to what fans expect of them and Adam Dunn smashes something north of 35 homers, they White Sox could have a vastly improved offense. I think their biggest question, aside from what Abreu will give them, is fleshing out their rotation and bullpen.

danks was once good. the front 2 guys are great to have but 3-5 are questions. eaton is the wildcard. he is an obp machine but he has to do it on a regular basis in the mlb. they wont lose 100 games, they wont win 85. I see them at .500 at best in this transition barring another solid starter and a REAL catcher.

 

[JosMin]

danks was once good. the front 2 guys are great to have but 3-5 are questions. eaton is the wildcard. he is an obp machine but he has to do it on a regular basis in the mlb. they wont lose 100 games, they wont win 85. I see them at .500 at best in this transition barring another solid starter and a REAL catcher.

A full season of Avi Garcia is going to help out Ramirez and Beckham, IMO. And Adam Eaton is certainly going to help an offense that flat-out couldn't get on base last year. I'm excited to see what Abreu can do.

But I agree that the White Sox could potentially hover somewhere close to 80 wins, their big question mark is going to be starting pitching getting them deep enough into games. It's kind of the opposite of what the Cubs are dealing with -- I think they'll be able to mix and match their rotation enough to get to Veras and Strop at the end of games, but I can foresee tons of 3-2/4-2/3-1 losses for the Cubs this year. Scoring runs is going to be tougher than last year and last year was already uglier than a man's ass.

 

[DewsSox79]

A full season of Avi Garcia is going to help out Ramirez and Beckham, IMO. And Adam Eaton is certainly going to help an offense that flat-out couldn't get on base last year. I'm excited to see what Abreu can do.

But I agree that the White Sox could potentially hover somewhere close to 80 wins, their big question mark is going to be starting pitching getting them deep enough into games. It's kind of the opposite of what the Cubs are dealing with -- I think they'll be able to mix and match their rotation enough to get to Veras and Strop at the end of games, but I can foresee tons of 3-2/4-2/3-1 losses for the Cubs this year. Scoring runs is going to be tougher than last year and last year was already uglier than a man's ass.

gotta love our chicago baseball teams. its quite sad.



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[JosMin]

gotta love our chicago baseball teams. its quite sad.



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Patience is a virtue..... :dunno:

 

[chibears55]

Go a little farther back than the last half of the year, will you? The fact that Garza other than when with Texas and his rookie year has never been above 4.00 in ERA, and that includes both leagues. You can take the rest of the Cubs staff, put them in the AL and watch their numbers dwindle greatly.

no need to go farther back... you said he was far more superior then what the cubs have now... I beg to differ, cause I believe what he showed in the 2nd half of last year after injury is going to be pretty close to what your going to get from him now..

we cant compare samardzija and wood with Garza in texas but we can with their stint with the cubs and Garza is far from being more superior then them..
he wasn't even "superior" over travis wood in almost the same starts, and wood suppose to be a 4 at best 3..
heck for what it worth, travis wood made the all star team..

Garza 60 GS 21 Wins 3.45 ERA 1.21 WHIP 3.09 K/BB

travis wood 58 GS 15 Wins 3.62 ERA 1.16 WHIP 2.18

Also, if situations were the same, and Garza had two years of control left like Shark, do you think he would have fetched what the Cubs need as far as prospects? I do, and sorry to say, but it is because what he did in his past

he didn't quite fetch much in return from the cubs to the Rays and he had 3 yrs of control left prior to that trade.. they got quantity but not much in quality..
prob. because his past performances showed he wasn't anything more then a .500 starter with an ERA close to 4.00 and can give you about 6 IP..

Dempster sported really good numbers until he went to the AL. Garza did too until his last stint with the AL, but somehow, the rest of the Cubs staff would do okay in the AL?

I don't recall saying the rest of the cubs staff would be ok in the AL, I never even made that comparison.. you said he would be more superior then what the cubs have now in their rotation.. I disagreed.. I think post injury, he not going to be all that good, and what we saw of him the 2nd half of last year will be pretty close to what he will be like...

And if you think Garza is overrated, then you are over-hyping the rest of this staff.

again, never mention anything about hyping up the rest of staff.. just disagreed that Garza is more superior then samardzija and wood..
if anyone hyping up any player, its you with Garza...

If Garza were on the Cubs today, he would be penciled in at the very least as the number 2 starter, and more than likely number one. There is no debate on that one.

which means nothing to your argument of him being more superior then samardzija and wood..

If you think differently, keep talking.

im not not gonna tell you that samardzija and wood are better pitchers at this stage then Garza, but there is no way you can sit here and say that after the 2013 season and going into 2014, that Garza is a more superior starter the samardzija and wood.. If anything those 3 are about equal going into the season..

 

[beckdawg]

I see them at .500 at best in this transition barring another solid starter and a REAL catcher.

I got no issue with that sort of statement. I was just commenting on some talking about 80+ wins. The Sox are probably a safe bet to be a better team than the cubs 2014 but 2015+ I still prefer what the cubs have going. Ultimately, I feel like the Sox lack true elite talent outside of Sale. If Abreu becomes a star that's another piece to build on. If their #3 pick does yet another piece. The Sox have always been more crafty via trades than the cubs. So, maybe they continue to work that angle. I just see right now the cubs have 8-9 guys who could be average or better players in the majors in their farm system and will likely have 2 top 5 picks in the next 2 drafts which you hope to get stars out of.

I've said before I hold no ill will toward the Sox. If they aren't playing the cubs I have no problem rooting for them. I just see them being a lot closer to the start of a rebuild than the cubs are and I'm really not seeing a quick reload as being realistic.

 

[Capt. Serious]

I'm excited about the Sox because they actually have exciting young talent for the first time in quite awhile.

Unlike the Cubs, we're not sitting around waiting for a bunch of "what ifs".

 

[CSF77]

I've said before I hold no ill will toward the Sox. If they aren't playing the cubs I have no problem rooting for them. I just see them being a lot closer to the start of a rebuild than the cubs are and I'm really not seeing a quick reload as being realistic.

The term rebuild is over rated. Teams can draft with smaller pools and use talent to get proven players in trades while signing legit F/A.

Cubs are just playing small market baseball while sporting the highest profit margins.

Don't try to justify if. They are just putting out a AAAA quality team (IE Japan quality team) with a major market.

 

[beckdawg]

The term rebuild is over rated. Teams can draft with smaller pools and use talent to get proven players in trades while signing legit F/A.

When have the sox ever been strong at drafting? They have typically been one of the cheapest teams in terms of draft budgets of any team in the majors. They typically haven't been big spenders in FA either. So, unless they manage to get a lot of steals in trades the sox will have difficulty adding impact players.

 

[patg006]

I'm not really seeing why so many are excited about the sox. The cubs offense was terrible last year and the the sox actually scored fewer runs last year as an AL team with the DH. Sure the Sox have Sale but what else? Ramirez was decent. De Aza was average. Jose Quintana was decent last year as well. But to talk like they are a fringe playoff team is a pretty huge stretch. You're basically assuming Abreu is a star and that the guys they dealt with are up soon and become impact players.

I'm not excited, I think they got a chance to catch fire like Cleveland last year. Cleveland had bounces go their way.

Pauly was banged up and had a shit year. I think he'll look more like the .300 hitter he usually is instead of the .240 hitter he was last year.

Dunn is bad.

Jon Danks's arm issues are really bad. If he's ever healthy he's above average.

Their catching situation is worse.

This Eaton kid is a steal. I think in a full year where he gets more than 200 PAs he will benefit the team.

Avasail Garcia looks pretty promising. If cubs fans can :fap: to highly regarded prospects, why cant someone else?

I'm not saying this is the best team ever, but I'm not writing them off like I already have teh cubs the next 3 years.

 

[beckdawg]

If cubs fans can :fap: to highly regarded prospects, why cant someone else? I'm not saying this is the best team ever, but I'm not writing them off like I already have teh cubs the next 3 years.

There's a diffference between a playoff contender and an 80 win team. If Sox fans want to hope for an 80 win team i got no issue. But some here are suggesting they have a real shot to get 85+ wins which frankly I find to be totally unrealistic.

 

[chibears55]

the white sox lost 99 games last year.. did I miss some kind of major overhaul of this team this off season that going to add 25+ wins.. didnt realize this abreu kid was that good..

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[brett05]

There's a diffference between a playoff contender and an 80 win team. If Sox fans want to hope for an 80 win team i got no issue. But some here are suggesting they have a real shot to get 85+ wins which frankly I find to be totally unrealistic.

Who suggested it? All that was said as it would be no surprise if they did 85+ wins. Not the same as a "real shot" or a "playoff contender". Why you choose to make stuff up when you have way more gifted opinions to offer


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[brett05]

the white sox lost 99 games last year.. did I miss some kind of major overhaul of this team this off season that going to add 25+ wins.. didnt realize this abreu kid was that good..

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5/9 seasons 85+ wins is why. You make it sound like they've been losing like the Astros or some other team we all know


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[chibears55]

5/9 seasons 85+ wins is why. You make it sound like they've been losing like the Astros or some other team we all know


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considering that only 1 pitcher and 3 regulars were involved in more then 1 of those 5 85 win teams, its not really a good reason why we should expect this team to win 25 more games this year then last.. including 1 of those regulars basically playing his good bye tour in Konerko....
they look more like the team that has finished under .500 in 4 of last 7 years..

 

[brett05]

considering that only 1 pitcher and 3 regulars were involved in more then 1 of those 5 85 win teams, its not really a good reason why we should expect this team to win 25 more games this year then last.. including 1 of those regulars basically playing his good bye tour in Konerko....
they look more like the team that has finished under .500 in 4 of last 7 years..

But again given that last year they collectively played to career lows just average play gets them to .500


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[Jntg4]

Sox fans need to GTFO... they've only won 4 championships as a major league franchise... (1901, 1906, 1917, 2005), we've won 8 (1876, 1880, 1881, 1882, 1885, 1886, 1907, 1908) and they're all jealous.

Plus we had a better record last year

:umad: