Update on Team vaccination rates

[ThatGuyRyan]

Still waiting for the part where you say that you are in no way an authority on this.

When I am feeling ill I google WebMd or CCS.

 

[Pegger]

Thanks, that doesn't help.

I should have been a bit more clear. I'm thinking you have an option between Pfizer, Moderna and Johnson & Johnson.

Is there a blood clot risk? The only one you should be concerned about is J&J, but that's a small risk and heavily weighted for females, so if you are a male since it's a single shot that would be the fastest.

Is time important? If so, the J&J vaccine is single shot, so you'll be vaccinated the quickest.

What's available? If you have access to all equally, then probably do the J&J out of pure speed, but if you want Pfizer or Moderna and were looking for a recommendation they are extremely similar, so it doesn't matter.

Which one works best? The term used is 'efficacy'. All vaccines provide this info, but to help out Pfizer is 95% (2 shots), Moderna is 86% and Johnson & Johnson is 72%. The issue is each vaccine had clinical trials over different time periods and most of those stats don't include the current variant, so those stats aren't exactly accurate for your protection right now.

My non-medical message board stranger recommendation: Seems like this is a work requirement, so the sooner you are fully vaccinated, the sooner you can get to making money. If you don't have any specific clotting health concerns I'm thinking the J & J would be preferred. If not available then get either of the other two. Doesn't matter much.

 

[modo]

Still waiting for the part where you say that you are in no way an authority on this.

I never claimed to be. I am not going to give a disclaimer on every post where I give public accessible facts and my opinion.

 

[pinkfloydster]

I never claimed to be. I am not going to give a disclaimer on every post where I give public accessible facts and my opinion.

We're not talking about who should start at right tackle for the Bears. These are life altering decisions. So, yes, you absolutely should give your background information. Especially, when you read a couple of articles on the internet and then present them irresponsibly.

This is all basic stuff if you have empathy for your fellow humans.

 

[The Big Grabowski]

I need to iterate to people you all need to think for yourselves. I am not trying to convince anyone of anything here. I am telling you my thought process. At the end of the day make up your own minds.

I would hope people here are not mindless automatons that take everything the a particular political party tells you at face value or assume an expert is infallible or completely honest just because they are propped up in front of a TV and the government tells you so.

If there are seeds of doubt they should come from your own thought process and information you gather from multiple sources.

Who else is repeating propaganda here other than you? You're literally questioning Fauci and raising doubts about mRNA vaccines without stating any scientific basis behind it. You can draw a straight line from that reasoning to the Republican party.

 

[run and shoot]

I'm not here to get into a lecture. If you want to discuss things I recommend not coming across as a self righteous douche.

Katalin Kariko was an early researcher into mRNA work to fight diseases in the 90s. Her early work was rejected from funding by governments, corporations and dismissed by colleagues as being unreliable and not possible. Synthetic mRNA was always rejected by the body and many professionals thought it would be impossible. They finally started to get mRNA results on lab rats back in the 90s but nothing progressed. They finally started getting results in the mid 00s.

My point on this is part of the bigger discussion that long term effects of mRNA have not been studied. That's the whole point of a populace needed to make a decision, individually on whether to take the vaccine.

There is no statistically analysis possible for this since its basically in its infancy...thats the whole point.

My point on this is part of the bigger discussion that long term effects of mRNA have not been studied.

the long term effects might be taking place right now. If ya know what I mean.

 

[modo]

I feel like I am address cult members here.

Yes, I question Fauci. Because he is human and has been contradictory. That doesn't mean is evil or wrong all the time. It means he is human and not infallible.

Again, the long term effects of the vaccine are not fully known. There may or may not be affects down the road. In a small portion of the populace there were short term affects that had to have disclaimers after the fact.

There may never be long term side effects and that would be great.

I am not trying to convince anyone based on my opinion to either take or not take the vaccine. All I am telling you is why I don't think some football players are taking it. They are in a low risk group, for the most part. If I were in a low risk group I wouldn't take it either.

 

[modo]

Who else is repeating propaganda here other than you? You're literally questioning Fauci and raising doubts about mRNA vaccines without stating any scientific basis behind it. You can draw a straight line from that reasoning to the Republican party.

Nothing I stated here is propaganda. Everything I posted is factual public information.

 

[Bust]

Who else is repeating propaganda here other than you? You're literally questioning Fauci and raising doubts about mRNA vaccines without stating any scientific basis behind it. You can draw a straight line from that reasoning to the Republican party.

That individual is probably reading all the Fauci hate on social media. On youtube anything Fauci is getting hammered with dislikes lately, lol, in the thousands. Wasn't this way before masks got turned off. I assume once the anti vaccination group went live and the masses listened > thanks Anthony Rizzo! Fauci's been the whipping boy.

 

[Pegger]

I never claimed to be. I am not going to give a disclaimer on every post where I give public accessible facts and my opinion.

The 'facts' part is up for debate. I'm not specifically questioning you, but like I mentioned we have 'facts' coming from both political sides that would have someone draw opposing conclusions. I've had numerous conversations with friends where they are happy with the 'facts' they have accumulated, but the source is some obscure, fringe website that really pushes conspiracies . In those situations it becomes hard to decipher 'truth' from 'alternate truth'.

I'm seeing a lot of people just picking the set of 'facts' that suit their agenda and then using them as 'proof' that they are right. People aren't looking to gain information, but rather looking taking shortcuts to gain information that supports an argument.

 

[The Big Grabowski]

Nothing I stated here is propaganda. Everything I posted is factual public information.

No, they're really not. When you don't support your opinions with verifiable sources, they're pretty much opinions.

The truth is that vaccines, like any medication, have pros and cons. They go through trials and an approval process with the FDA to ensure that they're safe. The reason the COVID vaccines were approved on an emergency basis is because 4M people are dead. You get that right? 600K Americans are no longer alive because of a pandemic that was raging out of control

There have been some documented side affects with a few of the vaccines that raised concern. J&J was paused while they looked at blood clotting issues for example. I'm not sure what long term effects you think are going to suddenly materialize at this point. 161M Americans have been fully vaccinated.

If your understanding of science is that it's always right and never changes, you're starting from a flawed POV. If you're assuming a scientist like Fauci can't evolve in their thinking when presented with different evidence, again you're not operating from a reasonable point of view.

Fauci served over many administrations, both for Republicans and Democrats. He's eminently qualified and has written authoritative text books on virology. He is what we call an expert in the field. He was also working under an erratic president, who many feared to contradict for political consequence. I think we can probably give him some slack and not dissect his every word or email.

If there was something particularly egregious you take issue with that throws his expertise into question say it. Stop hinting at it and playing in the margins of uncertainty.

 

[modo]

The 'facts' part is up for debate. I'm not specifically questioning you, but like I mentioned we have 'facts' coming from both political sides that would have someone draw opposing conclusions. I've had numerous conversations with friends where they are happy with the 'facts' they have accumulated, but the source is some obscure, fringe website that really pushes conspiracies . In those situations it becomes hard to decipher 'truth' from 'alternate truth'.

I'm seeing a lot of people just picking the set of 'facts' that suit their agenda and then using them as 'proof' that they are right. People aren't looking to gain information, but rather looking taking shortcuts to gain information that supports an argument.

I don't take facts from political parties....

I take traceable known information like recorded statements and emails.

 

[modo]

No, they're really not. When you don't support your opinions with verifiable sources, they're pretty much opinions.

The truth is that vaccines, like any medication, have pros and cons. They go through trials and an approval process with the FDA to ensure that they're safe. The reason the COVID vaccines were approved on an emergency basis is because 4M people are dead. You get that right? 600K Americans are no longer alive because of a pandemic that was raging out of control

There have been some documented side affects with a few of the vaccines that raised concern. J&J was paused while they looked at blood clotting issues for example. I'm not sure what long term effects you think are going to suddenly materialize at this point. 161M Americans have been fully vaccinated.

If your understanding of science is that it's always right and never changes, you're starting from a flawed POV. If you're assuming a scientist like Fauci can't evolve in their thinking when presented with different evidence, again you're not operating from a reasonable point of view.

Fauci served over many administrations, both for Republicans and Democrats. He's eminently qualified and has written authoritative text books on virology. He is what we call an expert in the field. He was also working under an erratic president, who many feared to contradict for political consequence. I think we can probably give him some slack and not dissect his every word or email.

If there was something particularly egregious you take issue with that throws his expertise into question say it. Stop hinting at it and playing in the margins of uncertainty.

I am not going to rehash everything that is public info like contradictory statements and emails that contradict public statements. I am not even asking you to change your mind. I really don't care.

All I wanted to to discuss is why some football players are not getting vacc'ed.

 

[The Big Grabowski]

That individual is probably reading all the Fauci hate on social media. On youtube anything Fauci is getting hammered with dislikes lately, lol, in the thousands. Wasn't this way before masks got turned off. I assume once the anti vaccination group went live and the masses listened > thanks Anthony Rizzo! Fauci's been the whipping boy.

The state of partisan politics in the US demands a face for the masses to direct their hate. Issues and facts be damned, all that matters is lining people up in opposition.

 

[Pegger]

I feel like I am address cult members here.

Yes, I question Fauci. Because he is human and has been contradictory. That doesn't mean is evil or wrong all the time. It means he is human and not infallible.

Again, the long term effects of the vaccine are not fully known. There may or may not be affects down the road. In a small portion of the populace there were short term affects that had to have disclaimers after the fact.

There may never be long term side effects and that would be great.

I am not trying to convince anyone based on my opinion to either take or not take the vaccine. All I am telling you is why I don't think some football players are taking it. They are in a low risk group, for the most part. If I were in a low risk group I wouldn't take it either.

I don't fully understand the 'long term effects' argument.

Sure we don't know the long tern effects of the different vaccines, but they use similar logic to existing vaccines (RNA/mRNA), so we have a reasonable understanding what the long term effects could be. The underlying science has a long history to draw from, so it's wrong to say we can reasonably assume the outcome.

With that being said we also don't know the long term effects of COVID-19, but based on similar corona viruses we know it will mutate if given the opportunity to spread. Typically the more transferable variants (like the current Delta one) is what survives, making things worse, not better. The only way to reduce/stop the transmission is through PPE and getting vaccinated.

Finally, we do know the current short term effects of COVID-19. Current number of deaths world wide is ~4,090,000 people. We also know there are a bunch of people considered 'long haulers' who's COVID-19 symptoms haven't left. Personally I have a friend that just got out of a 3 month medically induced coma and he may never work again.

 

[modo]

I don't fully understand the 'long term effects' argument.

Sure we don't know the long tern effects of the different vaccines, but they use similar logic to existing vaccines (RNA/mRNA), so we have a reasonable understanding what the long term effects could be. The underlying science has a long history to draw from, so it's wrong to say we can reasonably assume the outcome.

With that being said we also don't know the long term effects of COVID-19, but based on similar corona viruses we know it will mutate if given the opportunity to spread. Typically the more transferable variants (like the current Delta one) is what survives, making things worse, not better. The only way to reduce/stop the transmission is through PPE and getting vaccinated.

Finally, we do know the current short term effects of COVID-19. Current number of deaths world wide is ~4,090,000 people. We also know there are a bunch of people considered 'long haulers' who's COVID-19 symptoms haven't left. Personally I have a friend that just got out of a 3 month medically induced coma and he may never work again.

as with any treatment, including vaccines, the benefits are weighed against the negatives. In most cases side effects are known upfront and appear within a few months. This isn't always the case, but most often. Plus this vaccine was used as a political hot potato from day one and seem to have party members flip flop on opinions based on before and after the election.

As this relates to football, which is what I am sticking with now because I don't give a fuck about politics or Fauci for CCS purposes, I think football players are weighing the risk group they are in verses a new type of vaccine, specifically an mRNA vaccine. COVID has overwhelming, statistically shown to affect people in specific risk groups with comorbidities. Healthy people in low risk groups are pretty safe from COVID when contracted. I think NFL players have seen other NFL players get it and pull thru pretty easy. For better or worse I think the unvaccinated NFL players would rather face the virus.

 

[Urblock]

What the fuck is this? LOL I love reading crazy.

 

[truthbedamned]

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[Bearly]

as with any treatment, including vaccines, the benefits are weighed against the negatives. In most cases side effects are known upfront and appear within a few months. This isn't always the case, but most often. Plus this vaccine was used as a political hot potato from day one and seem to have party members flip flop on opinions based on before and after the election.

As this relates to football, which is what I am sticking with now because I don't give a fuck about politics or Fauci for CCS purposes, I think football players are weighing the risk group they are in verses a new type of vaccine, specifically an mRNA vaccine. COVID has overwhelming, statistically shown to affect people in specific risk groups with comorbidities. Healthy people in low risk groups are pretty safe from COVID when contracted. I think NFL players have seen other NFL players get it and pull thru pretty easy. For better or worse I think the unvaccinated NFL players would rather face the virus.

Pretty safe for low risk groups is relative and changing a bit with the variants.

Top Central Florida doctors: Get eligible schoolkids vaccinated now

With Florida’s COVID-19 cases climbing over 200% in the past two weeks and hospitalization rates rising, leading health officials said Thursday the time is now to get middle- and high-school …

www.orlandosentinel.com

Overall, children infected with COVID are still highly unlikely to suffer serious illness, but the number is rising as the more infectious delta variant spreads. Nationally since the pandemic began, children have accounted for 14.2% of total COVID cases. By July 8, they were 22.3% of reported cases for the week — in part because of higher vaccination rates for adults.
In Mississippi, where hospitalizations for adults have doubled since July 4, there were seven children with COVID in intensive care this week, including two children on a ventilator.

There are still fewer youth noticeably affected by it than a flu but the risk of severe infection and passing it on to others is still much higher.

Even for those in low risk groups, the risk of vaccine is still orders of magnitude lower than the disease now that it's becoming more infectious with accelerating viral loads.

That said, If players would rather go through the protocols than get the shot, still their call.

 

[Bearly]

The NFL is only asking players to follow the same standards as Fox News implements for its employees.

Fox has quietly implemented its own version of a vaccine passport while its top personalities attack them

Tucker Carlson has called the idea of vaccine passports the medical equivalent of "Jim Crow" laws. And other Fox News personalities have spent months both trafficking in anti-vaccine rhetoric and assailing the concept of showing proof of vaccination status.

www.cnn.com