At what point does Rose overtake Pippen?

[CODE_BLUE56]

One very important statement I must make...The powers that be locked and closed my famous "1994 Bulls vs 2011 bulls in 7 game thread" because they thought the argument was over....But the way it seems, this thread has turned into a sort of sequel to my elite classic epic thread..My important question to the mods is, WHY CAN'T YOU JUST REOPEN MY THREAD SINCE IT IS QUITE OBVIOUS THAT THE SAME ARGUMENT IS BASICALLY GOING ON HERE? And I ain't even the one that started the Pippen argument again..If this continues, every thread on this forum is going to turn into a Pippen debate.......Might as well change the name of this forum to the Pippen Forum....LoL.

i never really read your posts

now i see what i'm truly missing

:jackson:

 

[97Bulls]

Y

Well, I apologize for not reading thoroughly enough. But you did leave out Ron Harper, who was one of the best perimeter defenders in the league at the time. He was the guy who helped guard the best defender in the opposing team until Jordan got there.

The fact that Boozer can have such a high defensive rating completely dismisses this idea that it is a telling stat.

And FG% has zero to do with this subject and is a completely different stat entirely. Obviously a player who averages 20 points on 45% shooting is going to be a better scorer than a guy who averages 4 points on 62% shooting.

Your right about harper, my mistake. But he only played 20 min per. Due to the fact he couldn't pick up the offense.

And my example is very relevant. Boozers high defensive rating is due to him guarding the oppositions worst big. Rodmans high fg% is due to him only taking wide open layups and
out backs. And you know I'm right. Pippens defense was on par with great defensive centers. I proved my point. I refuted your boozer example. Ron harper played minimal minutes in 95. The only rebutal you have is will perdue and bill wennington.

 

[Glide2keva]

the second i saw pippen mentioned in some sort of argumentative question

i knew this was going to be interesting

dont really give a **** about the current argument...i think some people on here overrate rodman(tho his defense and rebounding are incredible) and pippen(not by alot..but its interesting listening to some of y'alls opinions)

anywho, of course...scottie is a top 50 player all time...awesome defender..versatile..etc.

scottie has the more accomplished career,but when its all said and done..rose will be the 2nd best bull(am i crazy to say he has a shot to be the best? he has an MVP and he's like 21 or 22? jordan didnt win his first title until his 7th or 8th year in the league)

Jordan won MVP in 88, his fourth year in the league.

Definitely not his 7th or 8th year in the league and Rose has no shot at being the best Bull ever.

 

[Glide2keva]

This is so ridiculous.

So I am assuming that Pippen is an "average" player because I believe that even a guy like Kendall Gill would have won the team championships as Jordan's secondary wing player?

I think a lot of people are not giving Jordan nearly enough credit in this forum. And that is disturbing to me.

Jordan gets as much credit as he deserves. I'll never discredit him to prop up another player.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

Reopen my 94 vs 2011 thread mods..Please????????..I am bombarded with 1000s of emails from angry citizens who want to join this community just to discuss pippen relaed topics with me and the chicitysports family...Its for the common good and public best interest...My thread was going for a world record....This is a wannabe clone thread and its as bad as the superman remake....The origional is always better..Do it for the common good...Thanks..

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9cTyxNZrG0[/ame]

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Y
Your right about harper, my mistake. But he only played 20 min per. Due to the fact he couldn't pick up the offense.

And my example is very relevant. Boozers high defensive rating is due to him guarding the oppositions worst big. Rodmans high fg% is due to him only taking wide open layups and
out backs. And you know I'm right. Pippens defense was on par with great defensive centers. I proved my point. I refuted your boozer example. Ron harper played minimal minutes in 95. The only rebutal you have is will perdue and bill wennington.

Ron Harper was playing close to 25 minute per-game before Jordan came back. After the final 18 games, that is when he started to play minimal minutes to make room for minutes for Jordan. So Pippen always did have decent low-post defenders and a secondary wing defender the entire time he was with the Bulls.

And Boozer's high defensive rating is due to him having great defensive players as teammates. That is the only reason. It is a very flawed formula.

The fact is that Pippen couldn't block shots at will like those centers/PFs I just mentioned. He could defend the rim against players 6'9 and under (assuming that player wasn't a beast like Malone or Barkley) but he couldn't shut down just anybody. He was an amazing wing defender but he wasn't nearly as amazing at defending the paint. And I'll take the best paint defender over the best perimeter defender any day of the week. That is where all the high percentage shots occur is the paint.

Having a great rim defender can make your small guys look like great perimeter defenders by default. It doesn't happen the other way around. Pippen always had at least one shot blocker on the court with him at all times. And he also always had at least one other great wing. That is why the Bulls were such a great defensive team. It made Pippen seem better than he really was.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

Jordan won MVP in 88, his fourth year in the league.

Definitely not his 7th or 8th year in the league and Rose has no shot at being the best Bull ever.

i said TITLE not mvp


and why not? obviously its a very long shot..but he has a much betterchance than most..he's a great young talent who will only improve(especially shooting and defense wise,although his D is pretty good right now)

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Reopen my 94 vs 2011 thread mods..Please????????..I am bombarded with 1000s of emails from angry citizens who want to join this community just to discuss pippen relaed topics with me and the chicitysports family...Its for the common good and public best interest...My thread was going for a world record....

Will you please stfu?

 

[Glide2keva]

i said TITLE not mvp


and why not? obviously its a very long shot..but he has a much betterchance than most..he's a great young talent who will only improve(especially shooting and defense wise,although his D is pretty good right now)

In that case, it was Jordan's 7th year when he won his first title.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

In that case, it was Jordan's 7th year when he won his first title.

ok i wasnt 100% sure...and rose is entering his fourth season(lockout complicates thing a little)

and he's very young and one of the best players on the planet

again, im not saying he will ever pass jordan..but he's got a chance to,unlikely, but still.

 

[Glide2keva]

ok i wasnt 100% sure...and rose is entering his fourth season(lockout complicates thing a little)

and he's very young and one of the best players on the planet

again, I'm not saying he will ever pass Jordan, but he's got a chance to, unlikely, but still.

He has no chance to surpass Jordan. That would make him the best ever, overall and no one is going to call Derrick Rose (as great as he is) the GOAT.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9cTyxNZrG0]‪Superman Gets Drunk‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

It's safe to say that Derrick Rose will never in a million years be as good as Michael Jordan was.

Derrick Rose has his amazing crossover and finishing ability and a combination of speed and power that made him who he is today.

Well, Jordan had almost all of the speed, even more power, even better finishing ability and one of the best handles in the league in his own right.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

It's safe to say that Derrick Rose will never in a million years be as good as Michael Jordan was.

Derrick Rose has his amazing crossover and finishing ability and a combination of speed and power that made him who he is today.

Well, Jordan had almost all of the speed, even more power, even better finishing ability and one of the best handles in the league in his own right.

Uhhhhhhh....duuuhhhhhhhh.....YOU THINK???

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9cTyxNZrG0]‪Superman Gets Drunk‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Uhhhhhhh....duuuhhhhhhhh.....YOU THINK???

‪Superman Gets Drunk‬‏ - YouTube

If you want to keep posting here, you are going to need to stop acting like a 12 year-old.

 

[scottiepippen1994]

If you want to keep posting here, you are going to need to stop acting like a 12 year-old.I am God on this forum and all of you must obey my commands. I am bending over and I want everyone here to kiss and lick my butt. I may be a homosexual, but I'm proud to be *** and I am God.

Yes master..I mean God..forgive me for my sins oh great and powerful Rami..After all You are the messiah of this forum.There you feel better now...:kick:

 

[97Bulls]

Ron Harper was playing close to 25 minute per-game before Jordan came back. After the final 18 games, that is when he started to play minimal minutes to make room for minutes for Jordan. So Pippen always did have decent low-post defenders and a secondary wing defender the entire time he was with the Bulls.
So you didn't. Remember that horace grant wasn't playing for the bulls in 95, but you do remember that harper played 25 minutes before jordans return? Lol ok

And Boozer's high defensive rating is due to him having great defensive players as teammates. That is the only reason. It is a very flawed formula.
Whatever bro. Truth be told, all stats have flaws.

The fact is that Pippen couldn't block shots at will like those centers/PFs I just mentioned. He could defend the rim against players 6'9 and under (assuming that player wasn't a beast like Malone or Barkley) but he couldn't shut down just anybody. He was an amazing wing defender but he wasn't nearly as amazing at defending the paint. And I'll take the best paint defender over the best perimeter defender any day of the week. That is where all the high percentage shots occur is the paint.

Having a great rim defender can make your small guys look like great perimeter defenders by default. It doesn't happen the other way around. Pippen always had at least one shot blocker on the court with him at all times. And he also always had at least one other great wing. That is why the Bulls were such a great defensive team. It made Pippen seem better than he really was.

I agree that the bulls always had great defensive players throughout pippens career. But that wasn't the case in 95. Pippen was the defensive leader of the bulls in 95, as well as anchor. You trying to include ron harper who played sparringly, due to his inabilty to pick up the offense, bill wennington and will perdue, intead of giving pippen his props for doing an amzing job with relative bad to decent defenders, says a lot aboutwhere you stand, and how much you know about scottie pippen.

Let me ask you this.... was pippen the leader of the 95 bulls number 2 ranked defense?

 

[scottiepippen1994]

I agree that the bulls always had great defensive players throughout pippens career. But that wasn't the case in 95. Pippen was the defensive leader of the bulls in 95, as well as anchor. You trying to include ron harper who played sparringly, due to his inabilty to pick up the offense, bill wennington and will perdue, intead of giving pippen his props for doing an amzing job with relative bad to decent defenders, says a lot aboutwhere you stand, and how much you know about scottie pippen.

Let me ask you this.... was pippen the leader of the 95 bulls number 2 ranked defense?

Ron Harper was hurt most of the 95 season...just another fun fact for the lord and god Rami..

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

I agree that the bulls always had great defensive players throughout pippens career. But that wasn't the case in 95. Pippen was the defensive leader of the bulls in 95, as well as anchor. You trying to include ron harper who played sparringly, due to his inabilty to pick up the offense, bill wennington and will perdue, intead of giving pippen his props for doing an amzing job with relative bad to decent defenders, says a lot aboutwhere you stand, and how much you know about scottie pippen.

Let me ask you this.... was pippen the leader of the 95 bulls number 2 ranked defense?

Pippen was easily the best defender on the team in 1995. He was the best perimeter defender in the entire league and probably the most versatile defender too. But I highly disagree with the assertion that the Bulls were the 2nd best defensive team in the league in 1994-95. They were up there but they weren't as good as the Rockets, Knicks, or Spurs... maybe others... Rebounding was the main problem for that team.

 

[icehogfan08]

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