At what point does Rose overtake Pippen?

[BNB]

I don't understand your point?

Regardless Reggie did as much by himself as Pippen ever did and Reggie isn't even good enough to make the hall of fame.

Pippen just wasn't that good. Without Jordan I don't think he is anything but a good player. Certainly not a HoF or top 50 all time player.

??

Reggie is good enough to make the H.O.F....

...he just wasn't good enough to make it his first year in which was eligible.


The 2 years MJ went to play baseall, Pippen averaged 22 PPG, 8.6 RPG, over 5 APG, close to 3 SPG and led the Bulls to the playoffs each season. He also became one of the few players to ever lead his team in points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks in one season.

I would say Pippen was a very good player.

 

[poodski]

LOL the most clueless statement ive read in a long time.

Solid rebuttal homie.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

I don't understand your point?

Regardless Reggie did as much by himself as Pippen ever did and Reggie isn't even good enough to make the hall of fame.

Pippen just wasn't that good. Without Jordan I don't think he is anything but a good player. Certainly not a HoF or top 50 all time player.

he had good players on his team...mark jackson,rik smits,etc.

later in his career he had jalen rose with him(he was pretty good in his prime, thought i absolutely hate his guts)

reggie miller was a good player, and a winner...but he was very one dimensional...he was not a good defender,rebounder,ok passer,etc.

he was a shooter...

pippen was way more complete as a player...i think some overrate pippen on here(saying he was AS important as jordan)..but i completely disagree that he shouldnt be in the top 50 or wouldnt have been had be not been on the Bulls

in his prime he was the best wing defender in the league, a great point forward, and one of the best rebounders, he was crazy versatile,and could score efficiently,and was arguably one of the best if not the best SF in the NBA at some point..

reggie miller was a good player,but scottie was quite a bit better

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Reggie Miller belonged in the HOF last year. But he is nowhere near as good of a player as Pippen was... not by a long shot.

 

[poodski]

??

Reggie is good enough to make the H.O.F....

...he just wasn't good enough to make it his first year in which was eligible.


The 2 years MJ went to play baseall, Pippen averaged 22 PPG, 8.6 RPG, over 5 APG, close to 3 SPG and led the Bulls to the playoffs each season. He also became one of the few players to ever lead his team in points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks in one season.

I would say Pippen was a very good player.

I would also call Reggie a very good player but I wouldn't call him an all time great.

Pippen flat out had MJ. Michael made everyone better.

Pippen to me was replaceable.

 

[BMR31]

Solid rebuttal homie.

I dont give "rebuttals" to the clueless.

 

[poodski]

Reggie Miller belonged in the HOF last year. But he is nowhere near as good of a player as Pippen was... not by a long shot.

I agree. But no one is saying Reggie is an all time great like they do Pippen.

Reggie is what people say. A one dimensional player who is one of the best outside shooters ever.

Pippen was a more complete player overall but I still don't see him as a player that could carry a team to a championship.

To me Pippen is Grant Hill.

 

[poodski]

I dont give "rebuttals" to the clueless.

 

[BNB]

How did Reggie Miller deserve to make the H.O.F last year? Some players who have done more or were better than Miller waited longer.

Other than Shooting, what was miller good at? Nothing.

He was a bad rebounder,bad passer, wasn't a great defender, he never made a all-defensive 1st or second team, never made the all-nba 1st or 2nd team, only make the NBA 3rd team 3 times, in 18 years he was voted an all-star only 5 times, he only made it out of the first round of the playoffs 6 times in his career [out of 18 years].

yeah he had the most 3 pointers made up until Ray allen passed it... But miller played for 18 years.. he should have had that record.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

I agree. But no one is saying Reggie is an all time great like they do Pippen.

Reggie is what people say. A one dimensional player who is one of the best outside shooters ever.

Pippen was a more complete player overall but I still don't see him as a player that could carry a team to a championship.

To me Pippen is Grant Hill.

Grant Hill was much better than Reggie Miller was too. Pippen and Hill definitely both belong in the hall of fame... no doubt about it. Saying that Pippen doesn't deserve that is a bit of a head scratcher to say the least.

I have fought with people on here who overrate Pippen. But he is probably a top 50 player still.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

I agree. But no one is saying Reggie is an all time great like they do Pippen.

depends what the context of "all time great" is...Reggie should be in the HOF..but top 50 all time no

Reggie is what people say. A one dimensional player who is one of the best outside shooters ever.

but he's still one dimensional...and its not like he was ever a really prolific scorer either...although a much better shooter,overall reggie was not much of a better scorer than pippen

Pippen was a more complete player overall but I still don't see him as a player that could carry a team to a championship.

thats your opinion....but miller never won a title either and its not like he was playing on shit teams ...

pippen's ability to contribute in nearly every aspect of the game and score efficiently at a high clip is underrated by some(and overrated by others)...he may not be able to necessarily carry a team by his own scoring alot..but he can help a team win in other regards..like DEFENSE

To me Pippen is Grant Hill.

frankly, i think in his prime hill was even better than pippen and hill would have been REALLY good had he not gotten hurt....

so,if you are trying to downplay pippen..then you're doing it wrong lol

 

[poodski]

Grant Hill was much better than Reggie Miller was too. Pippen and Hill definitely both belong in the hall of fame... no doubt about it. Saying that Pippen doesn't deserve that is a bit of a head scratcher to say the least.

I have fought with people on here who overrate Pippen. But he is probably a top 50 player still.

You seem to be misunderstanding what I am saying.

I only said Reggie earlier because I stopped watching the game after he retired.

I agree Grant Hill is a good player. As is Pippen. I am just saying Pippen is a lot closer to Grant Hills level than he is Michael Jordans level.

I think you replace Pippen with Hill you still win six championships and Hill is considered one of the greatest ever rather than just a very good player and Pippen is in Hills shoes.

 

[poodski]

depends what the context of "all time great" is...Reggie should be in the HOF..but top 50 all time no

but he's still one dimensional...and its not like he was ever a really prolific scorer either...although a much better shooter,overall reggie was not much of a better scorer than pippen




thats your opinion....but miller never won a title either and its not like he was playing on shit teams ...

pippen's ability to contribute in nearly every aspect of the game and score efficiently at a high clip is underrated by some(and overrated by others)...he may not be able to necessarily carry a team by his own scoring alot..but he can help a team win in other regards..like DEFENSE


frankly, i think in his prime hill was even better than pippen and hill would have been REALLY good had he not gotten hurt....

so,if you are trying to downplay pippen..then you're doing it wrong lol

The pacers weren't Lebrons cavaliers bad but they were pretty bad.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

You seem to be misunderstanding what I am saying.

I only said Reggie earlier because I stopped watching the game after he retired.

I agree Grant Hill is a good player. As is Pippen. I am just saying Pippen is a lot closer to Grant Hills level than he is Michael Jordans level.

I think you replace Pippen with Hill you still win six championships and Hill is considered one of the greatest ever rather than just a very good player and Pippen is in Hills shoes.

Fair enough.

Still, despite what people consider these guys... take them for who they are. Hill had a season or two way better than Scottie's best and way better than Miller's best. Sure, Pippen had the longevity and MJ as a teammate. But he was a great waiting to happen before the injuries.

Pippen was a beast, despite not being as domineering of a star as Jordan and others. If Billups can lead a team to a title, I have little doubt Pippen could as well.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

The pacers weren't Lebrons cavaliers bad but they were pretty bad.

What do you mean? If LeBron had Reggie's supporting cast in the late 90's-early 00's, he probably already has a couple of titles.

 

[CODE_BLUE56]

You seem to be misunderstanding what I am saying.

I only said Reggie earlier because I stopped watching the game after he retired.

ok?

I agree Grant Hill is a good player. As is Pippen. I am just saying Pippen is a lot closer to Grant Hills level than he is Michael Jordans level.

me and rami are not saying Pippen is on Jordan's level lol...why would we say that(although some people on this board..they might lol)

reggie miller is a notch below pippen

I think you replace Pippen with Hill you still win six championships and Hill is considered one of the greatest ever rather than just a very good player and Pippen is in Hills shoes.

pippen would have most likely been an all time great had he been on another team besides chicago(may not have won many more championships..but his defense,overall ability, are unquestionable)

hill got injured..he would have been an all time great without being on the bulls had he been healthy...him not being an "all time great" has to do with injuries..not his teams

although i think its hard to replace pippen's d..he and jordan locked up backcourts(grant is a better rebounder,passer,and maybe even better all around than pippen,but pippen is a better defender..not to say that hill wasnt good tho in that department)

so,you're saying that pippen is replacable? arguably, he is...but few can really replace what he can do..hill is one

and reggie miller is not replacable?

 

[BNB]

I haven't seen anyone on here say Pippen is on MJ's level...

I've only seen people say that he was as important to the titles.

 

[RamiTheBullsFan]

I haven't seen anyone on here say Pippen is on MJ's level...

I've only seen people say that he was as important to the titles.

One of the posters did say that actually. But I'm sure he was just being a goof.

To me... saying that Pippen was just as important to those Bulls titles as Jordan kind of is putting Pippen on Jordan's level. There were other players that would have been a suitable replacement for Pippen and Jordan still could have had multiple rings.

 

[BNB]

One of the posters did say that actually. But I'm sure he was just being a goof.

To me... saying that Pippen was just as important to those Bulls titles as Jordan kind of is putting Pippen on Jordan's level. There were other players that would have been a suitable replacement for Pippen and Jordan still could have had multiple rings.

being as important to a title has a different meaning to me.

Like shaq and kobe... when they won those 3 titles together, Shaq was obviously to more dominant player and the better player. That's why he won all 3 finals MVP's.

But without Kobe, the Lakers probably wouldn't have won those titles... which is why he was very important to those titles

Same with the Bulls. MJ was clearly the better player and the biggest reason why we won those titles, but without Pippen, we wouldn't be bragging about 6 titles in the 90's... MJ says it himself all the time. Scottie was the perfect sidekick for MJ... he didn't care that he wasn't in the spotlight like MJ was. He just did his part to help the Bulls win games.

 

[97Bulls]

being as important to a title has a different meaning to me.

Like shaq and kobe... when they won those 3 titles together, Shaq was obviously to more dominant player and the better player. That's why he won all 3 finals MVP's.

But without Kobe, the Lakers probably wouldn't have won those titles... which is why he was very important to those titles

Same with the Bulls. MJ was clearly the better player and the biggest reason why we won those titles, but without Pippen, we wouldn't be bragging about 6 titles in the 90's... MJ says it himself all the time. Scottie was the perfect sidekick for MJ... he didn't care that he wasn't in the spotlight like MJ was. He just did his part to help the Bulls win games.

Great post. The shaq/kobe team is a perfect example. What those two did to that team should make guys like rami, heff etc appreciate pippen all the more. That feud costs the laker at leats 2 more championships AT LEAST.

What if pippen decided to pull a kobe and sabotage the team after a few championships? So that he can persue his own personal glory. Based on 94 and 95, its obvious that he was more than capable of keeping a team in contention with decent (94) to bad (95) talent. The bulls don't win 3 more championships. But people just don't see the sacrifice he made. And even penalize him for it.